Courtesy, manners and tradition

[carole]

catlady you do raise a very good point, and twisterdog, you are indeed brave to say that to people who offend you with bad language, it is actually against the law to swear as such in public i believe, but of course it is never enforced, or maybe i am wrong here, but i always thought it was at least down under.

I tried it once myself i was in burger king with my then young daughter, melissa was about six at the time, these young kids a bit older than her perhaps eight or ten were using the F word, i said something, all i got was more abuse and felt really intimidated, yes even by these children, i have since learn't to just try and close my ears to it all,except it is so hard when you here it everywhere, i am much the same as you twisterdog, i am no saint, but i do watch my P's and Q's in public and in front of children.

[pomtzu]

One word.....

Amish

If you're saying that the Amish don't change - that's not completely true. No - they haven't changed too much - nothing like the rest of society - but changes are there.

Some - not all of them, now have electricity in their homes, they use power tools, they RIDE in cars (but don't own them or drive them), use cell phones - and yes - they even shop at Walmart!!!

Small changes and a long time coming, but none-the-less, even they are changing to survive in this ever-changing world.

[pomtzu]

I was raised w/that instilled in me as well; no hats on men indoors. Now baseball caps are a fashion statement, a tacky one at best, IMO, but I'm not offended by any means if I see someone wearing one.

Yes, but when you come to the dining room table to eat - it's hats off and shirts on!

[Medusa]

Yes, but when you come to the dining room table to eat - it's hats off and shirts on!

Oh heavens, yes!

[RICHARD]

I'm no saint and don't pretend to be but I think I'll stick to doing something that I was taught: shoot them in the back w/love. I can get riled but experience has taught me "least said, easiest mended" whether in my head or in actuality. And I think it's best to leave one's mother out of it.

I decapitated this piece of garbage with my 'love' and she remained a bitter AH that was incapable of being civil to me or anyone else.

Her job was to submit a bi-weekly count of the patients that came to her area.
So, she her job was to count no higher than 60 on any given day, write it down on a piece of paper and at the end of the pay period, pick up a phone and leave me a message on voicemail or fax me the sheet.
I offered to do the count myself or go pick up the paperwork, meet her halfway, have them floor clerk do the count, pick it up or send it. I set up and EXCEL file so she could email it to me or the Finance office and offered to show her how to run it.

She complained that I was bullying her, I was a racist, I was trying to eliminate her job. If she took a day off she would hide the ledger or lock it up in her cupboards so no other person could help me. She would make me wait and pass the deadline for submitting the totals, The finance office would call me, I would call her, then call her boss and if I was lucky and she was in the mood, I would get my totals.

I told her boss that SHE would have to find a way to deliver the niumbers because I was tired of chasing her down and getting what I needed. She was a miserable FH dinosaur that refused to work and make a job that was pretty easy, easier.

EVERYONE in that surgery unit was afraid of her and even her spineless boss defered to her and let her run the area because they were afraid of a grievance based on whatever bug had crawled into her nasty old orifices.

There are only three idiots in my professional career that I totally dismissed as being petty pieces of crap. I always tried to be a courteous to them-and worked at it harder- because they found a way to be rude, obnoxious morons and I was going to stand above it and I did.

I had professional respect for them, but as human beings? She did the same thing to everyone she came in contact with, she treated everyone with the same disregard and malice.. She was noting but a miserable biddy who was out to make everyone pay for her bad attitude in life.

I usually have pity on such a poor human being, but she earned every ounce of my contempt and the way I felt about her.

Kill them with kindness?

Nope!

Let them die naturally and as miserable as possible, why take on a murder rap?

[Medusa]

I give up.

[RICHARD]

I give up.

Don't I get a white flag and a sword?

[Medusa]

Don't I get a white flag and a sword?

No, I'm not surrendering. I just give up.

[Cataholic]

I have given the look to people/young people that use bad language in front of my son. And, I have had others nudge their friend when the friend uses crude language in front of my son, and I always smile and say thank you to them for noticing.

As for baseball caps, I don't want J to grow up with a cap on his head, and will discourage him from wearing it at meals. Probably not indoors, but, at meals.

As for treating everyone the way I want to be treated, well, that only goes so far with me. Frankly, if someone repeatedly treats me poorly (which I can't say I really have had happen), I would probably give up. More often, I take the extra time/energy to get in good with them, and can get them to turn it around. Some people are just sour!

[RICHARD]

As for treating everyone the way I want to be treated, well, that only goes so far with me. Frankly, if someone repeatedly treats me poorly (which I can't say I really have had happen), I would probably give up.

AHA!

That's the way I feel.

My situation was WORK. I 'needed' her to complete my job and it got to the point where I had to keep pushing and get her out of my loop so I could get on with things.

None of the people in charge wanted to deal with her-becuase of her negativity and the fact that they didn't want to fight against one person's stupidity.

It was better to leave an ill mannered person alone, than it was to correct the situation.

---------------------

Manners and courtesy go far in business and providing services to a paying customer. I first become a polite consumer and then see what the company has to offer me.

If they are jerks or something is amiss, they get no return business.

If they meet me halfway, I may come back.

If they mow me over and knock me down with service?

They get a loyal customer. It's a small thing that benefits both of us.

[Catlady711]

If you're saying that the Amish don't change - that's not completely true. No - they haven't changed too much - nothing like the rest of society - but changes are there.

Some - not all of them, now have electricity in their homes, they use power tools, they RIDE in cars (but don't own them or drive them), use cell phones - and yes - they even shop at Walmart!!!

Small changes and a long time coming, but none-the-less, even they are changing to survive in this ever-changing world.

You're confusing the Old Order Amish with the Mennonites.


http://www.thirdway.com/menno/FAQ.asp?F_ID=3

Today some practices among the Amish include: untrimmed beards and hooks and eyes in place of buttons on outer garments of the men; horse and buggy transportation; horse-drawn implements for farming; plain and distinctive dress patterns; no electricity in homes.

However, most Mennonites today are not outwardly that different from any person you meet on the street. Mennonites believe in simple living, but express that simplicity in a spirit of stewardship and awareness of the needs of others rather than completely separating from society as the Amish continue to do.



http://www.800padutch.com/amish.shtml

Today there are over 25 different Amish, Mennonite, and Brethren church groups in Lancaster County. The more traditional groups are called 'old order'. They do not permit electricity or telephones in their homes. By restricting access to television, radio, and telephones, the Amish are better able to keep the modern world from intruding into their home life.

These traditional groups wear plain clothing styles, which has earned them the name "Plain People". It is the simple, peaceful lifestyle of these plain people that attracts such a curiosity today. Many wonder how these people can survive in their supposedly backward ways. Well, they're not only surviving - they're thriving. Since 1960, the Amish population in Lancaster County has almost tripled.

The Amish have a strong sense of community spirit, and often come to the aid of those in need. Their barn raisings are a good example. Neighbors freely give of their time and their skills to help one another.

With our society's current interest in restoring 'family values', much can be learned from studying the Amish way of life. Their devotion to family and community and their strong work ethic are good examples for our larger society.


The old order Amish are living proof that change in a society is not a necessity to survial and not always a desireable thing.

[Medusa]

You're confusing the Old Order Amish with the Mennonites.


http://www.thirdway.com/menno/FAQ.asp?F_ID=3

Today some practices among the Amish include: untrimmed beards and hooks and eyes in place of buttons on outer garments of the men; horse and buggy transportation; horse-drawn implements for farming; plain and distinctive dress patterns; no electricity in homes.

However, most Mennonites today are not outwardly that different from any person you meet on the street. Mennonites believe in simple living, but express that simplicity in a spirit of stewardship and awareness of the needs of others rather than completely separating from society as the Amish continue to do.



http://www.800padutch.com/amish.shtml

Today there are over 25 different Amish, Mennonite, and Brethren church groups in Lancaster County. The more traditional groups are called 'old order'. They do not permit electricity or telephones in their homes. By restricting access to television, radio, and telephones, the Amish are better able to keep the modern world from intruding into their home life.

These traditional groups wear plain clothing styles, which has earned them the name "Plain People". It is the simple, peaceful lifestyle of these plain people that attracts such a curiosity today. Many wonder how these people can survive in their supposedly backward ways. Well, they're not only surviving - they're thriving. Since 1960, the Amish population in Lancaster County has almost tripled.

The Amish have a strong sense of community spirit, and often come to the aid of those in need. Their barn raisings are a good example. Neighbors freely give of their time and their skills to help one another.

With our society's current interest in restoring 'family values', much can be learned from studying the Amish way of life. Their devotion to family and community and their strong work ethic are good examples for our larger society.


The old order Amish are living proof that change in a society is not a necessity to survial and not always a desireable thing.

The Amish that I know consider themselves to be "old order" but they drive, use cell phones, watch TV, etc. Mind you, they don't own cars, phones or TV's but they have no problem w/borrowing them. I asked one of my Amish friends about this and he said "It's a gray area". They are not Mennonites. They're Amish.

[pomtzu]

You're confusing the Old Order Amish with the Mennonites.


http://www.thirdway.com/menno/FAQ.asp?F_ID=3

Today some practices among the Amish include: untrimmed beards and hooks and eyes in place of buttons on outer garments of the men; horse and buggy transportation; horse-drawn implements for farming; plain and distinctive dress patterns; no electricity in homes.

However, most Mennonites today are not outwardly that different from any person you meet on the street. Mennonites believe in simple living, but express that simplicity in a spirit of stewardship and awareness of the needs of others rather than completely separating from society as the Amish continue to do.



http://www.800padutch.com/amish.shtml

Today there are over 25 different Amish, Mennonite, and Brethren church groups in Lancaster County. The more traditional groups are called 'old order'. They do not permit electricity or telephones in their homes. By restricting access to television, radio, and telephones, the Amish are better able to keep the modern world from intruding into their home life.

These traditional groups wear plain clothing styles, which has earned them the name "Plain People". It is the simple, peaceful lifestyle of these plain people that attracts such a curiosity today. Many wonder how these people can survive in their supposedly backward ways. Well, they're not only surviving - they're thriving. Since 1960, the Amish population in Lancaster County has almost tripled.

The Amish have a strong sense of community spirit, and often come to the aid of those in need. Their barn raisings are a good example. Neighbors freely give of their time and their skills to help one another.

With our society's current interest in restoring 'family values', much can be learned from studying the Amish way of life. Their devotion to family and community and their strong work ethic are good examples for our larger society.


The old order Amish are living proof that change in a society is not a necessity to survial and not always a desireable thing.

No - I know there is a difference.

I live just a few miles from several Amish communities, and as I said - SOME have taken on a few of the more modern ways.
Most of them here are farmers, but with land being at a premium, and them not being able to expand, many have gone into the furniture and construction business. An Amish family owned the construction business that build my garage a couple of years ago, and they used power tools and also used cell phones - however they were driven here by a non-Amish driver. I was talking to one of the gentlemen, and he said he just recently had electric run to his house.
We also have Mennonites in the area, but they drive, don't adhere to the old way of dress, and look pretty much like the ordinary guy on the street. The only different thing about the dress is that the women wear the little white caps on their head.

[Medusa]

No - I know there is a difference.

I live just a few miles from several Amish communities, and as I said - SOME have taken on a few of the more modern ways.
Most of them here are farmers, but with land being at a premium, and them not being able to expand, many have gone into the furniture and construction business. An Amish family owned the construction business that build my garage a couple of years ago, and they used power tools and also used cell phones - however they were driven here by a non-Amish driver. I was talking to one of the gentlemen, and he said he just recently had electric run to his house.
We also have Mennonites in the area, but they drive, don't adhere to the old way of dress, and look pretty much like the ordinary guy on the street. The only different thing about the dress is that the women wear the little white caps on their head.

The Amish that I know are quite well-to-do. They own/ed much of the surrounding land in their community and their homes are quite beautiful and modern w/the exception of electricity. Like your friends, they use power tools to build the furniture for their furniture business, they borrow cell phones, ride in cars and trucks and sometimes even borrow them and they use computers. Why they don't just give in and buy their own modern conveniences is beyond me; one of those 'gray areas', I guess.

[Catlady711]

If an Amish is friends with a non-Amish then they are not traditional 'Old Order' because those do not commonly associate, nor befriend non Amish folks.

If, in fact, the true traditional Old Order Amish ever do change to that extent then they are doomed to the same deterioration of society and values that our society is and there will be no hope left for them.

Then they could enjoy the 'privileges' our society does by having crime, drugs, lack of community, rebellion, murder, indifference, violence; all in exchange for electricity, internet, tv, movies, cell phones and everyone doing their own 'thing'.

Barn raisings? Nope sorry, we just don't feel like helping you we have our own problems to deal with.

That would be a very sad day indeed.

Personally I think total separation from the modern stuff isn't a bad idea at all, and go back to a sense of community that no longer exists for the majority of Americans anymore.

There's a reason when I go camping I still use a tent, and deliberatly choose completely rustic campsites who's only ammenities are a hand pump for water and a covered outhouse. I like it that way and honestly hate to come back home to the 'convienences' and stress that comes with our 'modern' living.