About Prison Conditions (long)

[Lady's Human]

It should be. There are many crimes that shouldn't be jailable offenses, though.

[Catlady711]

I had a cousin that got nabbed (I can't remember for what but it was serious) in FLA quite some time back. He got put on a chain gang cleaning up along the highways and other such manual labor. After he got out he made a point to never do anything like that again, and never did.

I think what most people think of as above and beyond 'humane' conditions for prisoners are what they are protesting. Prisons like this (found in Austria according to snopes) are just plain ridiculous. It's supposed to be a prison not a freaking resort!

http://www.snopes.com/photos/architecture/prison.asp

[RICHARD]

Let's put this b&w issue into a more relative term.

Economy.

People are really hurting at the moment because they choose to live over their means at the moment.

I don't feel sorry for them. As a matter of fact THEY are the reason we are in this hole.........Poor judgement?

NOPE, the same stupidity that puts people into jail.

What jails or prisons give the inmates more than what we on the outside have?

TV? A gym? Food? Medical care?

They don't have cable and the movie channels. Most of us go to a doc that is covered by the insurance our employers have. We buy a year's worth of 24 Hour Fitness! They are served slop that the city/county buys for them.

We can leave our homes, jump into the car and get a few things off of the dollar menu of the local fast food joint, when we decide to forgo the manicure, hair cut or latte.

It's just the level of stupidity that steers our ship. It's all about dumb choices and paying the piper when they knock on the door.

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And isn't it amazing when we hem and haw about a death penalty case comes up. Someone is put to death for killing another person - but we ignore the fact that this system puts to death an average of one person a month in the four years since 2004 -for nothing more that being a low level criminal?

Don't get me wrong-screw up and pay the price - and people do.

MSNBC runs a series on prisons and inmates.

Having caught a few episodes I can see that the basic needs they get while in the can are nothing that I can get for myself. I don't have to share a closet to live in, I can come and go as I please and I am not looking over my shoulder at all times.

If the arguement is that inmates have it better than people on the outside, the problem rests with the people who can improve their status, but do not.

[shepgirl]

So...people on welfare are the same as those in jail?

I dated someone who went to prison for a short time. He had tasks, and earned $7 an hour to do them. These went towards paying off his fine, which shortened his jail stay. Good incentive to work. Minimum security.

Crime? Forgetting to renew his car insurance the year before, and he was nabbed when coming back from overseas through Canada customs.

Joe's jail would have been totally pointless.

Forgetting to renew your car insurance isn't a crime out here.

Some of the people on welfare here have committed fraud to collect welfare Catty...so yes, they should be doing jail time instead. Fraud is a crime punishable by law.
The reason they are not kicked off is because of some crooked lawyers, doctors who have no moral values, etc. Hard to bring these people to court when you know they have a list of charges they are willing to sue the legal system with if they are bothered.
We do have those that are truly in need of welfare and I am the first one to support this, not all are low lifes, not hard to weed them out and I would never dissalow them help knowing their true conditions.

[jennielynn1970]

Forgetting to renew your car insurance isn't a crime out here.

No, but driving a car and not having insurance is. There's lots of people who do that.

In PA, if I don't renew my auto insurance, my insurance company will let the state know and I'll get a nice letter telling me to turn in my plate and not to drive my car. Same if my registration lapses, they'll let my auto insurance know. My auto insurance lapsed once, accidentally, and the hoops I had to jump through to get everything lined up again with the state was mind blowing. Will never goof on that one again!

[shepgirl]

This is a crime here also but not one to land you in jail unless you keep repeating it. My insurance is one thing I would never dare forget to pay...an accident could be way more costly than the premium....

[Twisterdog]

I believe people who are in prison should have basic human needs met. Healthy food, clean water, clothes, shelter, sanitation. I do not think it is right to subject an inmate to rotten food or lethal temperature extremes.

IMO, if we (as tax payers and voters) cannot treat another human being with basic survival rights, then are we not also commiting the crime of abuse and neglect? Does that not make us no better then the criminals we are in charge of incarcerating?

However, I do not believe prisoners should live in spa-like conditions. If prison offers one more comforts than one had on the outside, does that not remove a lot of the motivation to reform oneself?

Speaking for me personally, I believe in the death penalty. I believe that certain people who commit truly heinous crimes should be put to death. I do not believe that someone who tortured, raped and murdered dozens of people deserves to live.

[jennielynn1970]

Our county jail here in Allentown, Lehigh County Prison, was rebuilt/remodeled a few years back. It's amazing looking from the outside. It also has a reputed gorgeous basketball court and workout area. I knew of guys who were friends of the workers in there who went in there to work out. Gotta love it.

[shepgirl]

Our county jail here in Allentown, Lehigh County Prison, was rebuilt/remodeled a few years back. It's amazing looking from the outside. It also has a reputed gorgeous basketball court and workout area. I knew of guys who were friends of the workers in there who went in there to work out. Gotta love it.

Sounds just like the jails out here. Maybe if conditions weren't so luxurious there would be less crime. Some inmates who have finished their term actually don't want out since they know they won't get as much as they did inside these jails...they might have to actually work to earn a living and enjoy the luxuries...heaven forbid they should work to earn their own way.

[RICHARD]

Here is an honest to god question about some of the posts on this thread.

What is so "luxurious" about living in a concrete box about 12x8 feet?
About having to shower with 10,20,30 people at a time?
About eating some shiat on a shingle that you have no control over?
Worrying about someone taking a sharp toothbrush and taking out -insert
body part here-?
About not being able to talk walk, go to the fridge at night or dressing up the way you want to, when you want to?
Next time you go to a gym think about having to share the equipment with some nasty inmate, or getting your head dented with a dumbbell?

If you think that living under those conditions is wonderful, People in the United States are far more well off than we want to admit.

[Edwina's Secretary]

Here is an honest to god question about some of the posts on this thread.

What is so "luxurious" about living in a concrete box about 12x8 feet?
About having to shower with 10,20,30 people at a time?
About eating some shiat on a shingle that you have no control over?
Worrying about someone taking a sharp toothbrush and taking out -insert
body part here-?
About not being able to talk walk, go to the fridge at night or dressing up the way you want to, when you want to?
Next time you go to a gym think about having to share the equipment with some nasty inmate, or getting your head dented with a dumbbell?

If you think that living under those conditions is wonderful, People in the United States are far more well off than we want to admit.

I do agree with you on this RICHARD. I cannot help but wonder if they people yelling about the "luxurious" prisions have ever actually seen one? I have not and do not want to. But from what I have seen on news, etc. they sure don't look like someplace I'd commit a crime just to get into!

We often say that liberty is the most valuable thing there is. So, isn't depriving someone of their liberty the greatest punishment?

[IRescue452]

What about self-defense crimes: involuntary manslaughter? Somebody comes at you with a chainsaw so you shoot them fatally. Are you really a horrible person deserving of this jail? You might be the most law abiding person in the world, a volunteer, an organ donor, have saved somebody from drowning type of model citizen, but you commited a crime so you get the same "don't do the crime if you can't to the time deal"?

What about last winter when I hit a patch of ice and spun head-on into a van? If I had killed the guy should I get these types of conditions?

What about the hypothetical man who steals the loaf of bread to feed his starving family. Desperation drives people to crime even though they aren't bad people. Put them in 165F conditions and feed them mold?

Teenagers who are caught with drugs? Do they need to learn to be citizens and find a job they can do and learn to budget and that kind of stuff to get them on the right track to living in society, or do we need to put them in these horrible conditions and teach them nothing but hate?

[Twisterdog]

What about self-defense crimes: involuntary manslaughter? Somebody comes at you with a chainsaw so you shoot them fatally. Are you really a horrible person deserving of this jail? You might be the most law abiding person in the world, a volunteer, an organ donor, have saved somebody from drowning type of model citizen, but you commited a crime so you get the same "don't do the crime if you can't to the time deal"?

What about last winter when I hit a patch of ice and spun head-on into a van? If I had killed the guy should I get these types of conditions?

What about the hypothetical man who steals the loaf of bread to feed his starving family. Desperation drives people to crime even though they aren't bad people. Put them in 165F conditions and feed them mold?

Teenagers who are caught with drugs? Do they need to learn to be citizens and find a job they can do and learn to budget and that kind of stuff to get them on the right track to living in society, or do we need to put them in these horrible conditions and teach them nothing but hate?

I agree with this. I don't think self-defense should be a crime at all. In fact, I think you should get an award for shooting a chain-saw wielding psychopath who broke into your home. I don't think anyone should go to prison for an accident, like you described. I like to think our justice system is still functional enough to not allow that to happen. I think the man stealing bread for his family ought to be taught about the public aid available (food stamps) for such cases, and should be put into a job training program so he can learn a skill with which to support his family.

I also do not believe in throwing juveniles in jail for minor crimes such as vandalism, skipping school, drinking beer, smoking pot. I believe juveniles need to be sent to rehabilitation facilities where they are reformed, counseled and taught to be productive adults. I have, unfortunately, had a bit of experience with the juvenile justice system, having four teenagers. It does society not one ounce of good to put a "delinquent" teenager in jail until he turns eighteen, then let him out. Society needs to fix the problems these kids have, before they become much larger problems in adults.

But I have seen some pretty darn nice prisons on television. I can't remember the name of the program I was watching, but my husband and I both said, "Dang! That's an awfully nice 'cell' that murderer has ... nicer than the places we lived in college. That's and awfully nice gym ... I don't think we could afford a membership there. And he's getting a free master's degree, when I can't afford to go get mine. Hmmmm .... " Obviously all prisons aren't like this, but they do exist.