Do you know what the ages of her children where in 1984?Quote:
Originally Posted by Edwina's Secretary
EDIT: I found it. In 1984 her children where 18, 22, and 24. Not a fair comparison of the 2 canidates.
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Do you know what the ages of her children where in 1984?Quote:
Originally Posted by Edwina's Secretary
EDIT: I found it. In 1984 her children where 18, 22, and 24. Not a fair comparison of the 2 canidates.
ES, I haven't commented on Ayers or the "reverend" Wright because I share the concerns of those who brought it up as an issue. Sen. Obama has chosen to associate with a terrorist and a bigot, which shows serious flaws in judgement.
I also have doubts about the judgement of Sen. McCain and his choice of running mate, but it doesn't have a damned thing to do with what she's wearing.
Frankly, if I could pull the lever for "none of the above", I would.
hehe, it was me being sarcastic and a smart ass...Quote:
Originally Posted by sparks19
I kinda like being in an ornery mood. :p
Jenn, I noticed the ornery mood. It's an improvement :p
Grace,
I started reading it because the OP brought up something that COULD have been pertinent to the ISSUES, but it quickly veered off course.Quote:
If it bothers you so much, simply don't read it any longer.
My apologies for intruding on your bingo game.
Can you dance like this??? ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by sparks19
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...aPalinDWTS.jpg
Also issues that keep getting ignored, like keeping the state funded plane being more expensive then taking commercial flights, that state Congresional leaders also take per diem payments in their own districts, the current AK gov driving herself and either her or her husband cooking for her family instead of having a personal driver and chef (perks the previous gov enjoyed), or the former AK gov using state funds for flights for his family.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady's Human
I believe NObama is using campaign funds to fly to HI to visit his grandmother. Whether he uses the campaign jet or commercial travel it, like Palin's new wardrobe, is a non issue as they are using campaign funds for the trip.
Very nice chop, for bringing the funnay.Quote:
Originally Posted by jenn_librarian
October 23, 2008
Look Is the Same; the Labels Have Changed
By ERIC WILSON
When Sarah Palin arrived at the governor’s mansion in Juneau, Alaska, for the first time in December 2006, she wore a pink turtleneck, a preppy track jacket and what appeared to be a knockoff Burberry scarf. She had often campaigned in fleece. Introduced as Senator John McCain’s running mate in Dayton, Ohio, in August, she wore red pumps that cost $89 from Naughty Monkey, a brand whose target audience is teenagers.
As a vice-presidential candidate, Ms. Palin’s look — which has apparently undergone a costly makeover — has not changed dramatically from a “Working Girl” formula of authoritative jackets paired with feminine skirts that seem calculated to suggest that she is ready to go to work on Day 1.
The Republicans spent about $150,000 on a clothing makeover for Ms. Palin and her family, according to financial disclosure forms. But looking at the before-and-after photos, it was not readily apparent what Ms. Palin got, exactly, from her shopping spree at Neiman Marcus and Saks Fifth Avenue.
What the number $150,000 suggests is that Ms. Palin traded up to designer versions of the clothes she wore before stepping onto the national stage, a surprising implication for a candidate who emphasizes her appeal to working-class voters.
“My first reaction when I heard about this was, ‘Honey, I could have dressed you for a lot less than that,’ ” said Cindi Leive, the editor in chief of Glamour magazine, which asked readers on Wednesday to vote in an online poll whether the expenses were too high; 72 percent said they were. “In general, she looks terrific,” Ms. Leive said, “but if you asked me to figure out where the $150,000 went, I’m not sure I could tell you.”
It is not yet clear whether Ms. Palin chose her new wardrobe or worked with stylists and other advisers, or what message her clothes were intended to broadcast. In fact, most of her bracelet sleeve jackets are so generic-looking that they could have come from any of the favored designers of Washington politicians: Oscar de la Renta, Escada and St. John.
The square ivory jacket she wore during her acceptance speech at the Republican Convention was a $2,500 silk shantung Valentino, reportedly bought at Saks. But the black wrap jacket she wore for the vice-presidential debate in St. Louis was a Tahari suit, according to a spokesman for the line, and costs less than $200; her shoes, according to the sleuths at ShoeaholicsAnonymous.com, were red imitation croc pumps from Kate Spade.
To her credit, Ms. Palin has been wearing those suits, and those awkward-yet-efficient, zip-close jackets (nothing says maverick like red leather) repeatedly over the last month, implying a sense of frugality that would belie the credit card statements of the Republican National Committee. To be scrupulously nonpartisan, Senator Joseph R. Biden Jr., her Democratic counterpart, seems to have a deep wardrobe of ties.
Some fashion executives went so far as to defend Ms. Palin for helping to support the economy.
“There’s no upside to looking frumpy or dowdy,” said Simon Doonan, the creative director of Barneys New York, where the campaign reported spending only $789.72, or enough for almost one outfit.
What about the judgement of Gov Palin...in accepting all that loot? That is what this thread is about. Sorry the humor and fun we were having with it confused you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady's Human
Check out the "new and improved" Sarah Palin. Fancy duds for a plain old
hockey mom. Can you say, "all style & no substance". :)
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/popup?id=6088889
LH...I think I see the problem here. Men and Women communicate differently. And you seem to filter women's conversation through your very male/military paradigm. So rather than being insulted by your demeaning expression of how women talk...I'll suggest some reading for you to help you understand.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady's Human
Deborah Tannen Phd is considered the pioneer in the study of the differences in communication styles between men and woman. She has written some excellent books on the subject. Available on Barnes and Noble as well as many other book sellers.
Another expert in the area is Anthony J. Ipsaro, Phd. He approaches the subject from the viewpoint of a white male. He uses Tannen's works and created a phd program in Men's Studies (as he says...Why only Women's Studies??) You can find some of his work on the internet.
I hired him a couple times for workplace training programs. What was interesting was men -- who thought they understood women because they have a mother, a wife, daughters, whatever -- were the most impacted by the program. I remember after the first session going out for drinks with a group and the choruses of "I never knew!" "Oh my gosh!" etc. etc.
So instead of calling us "hens" and "bingo playing old ladies" and other attempts at disparagement...maybe learn about how we communicate? Edit...I left out old biddies
Quote:
Originally Posted by Edwina's Secretary
Do you teach dance lessons?
yeah right... maybe at night in my dreams I could dance like that lol.Quote:
Originally Posted by jenn_librarian
I couldn't even wear the outfit and fake it lol.
LOL BTW... Obama can't dance like that either. I saw him try on Ellen :p then his wife came on and shamed him lol.
ES, if you're going to put this in terms of men not knowing how women communicate, then why don't women learn to communicate with men (after all, you speak as if it's a disability, and in this society those who don't have the disability need to accomodate those who have it) rather than vice versa?
Funny, I have no trouble communicating with women on the job, or normally in any other interactions. Only HERE do I seem to have those problems. Notice I used a very, very specific reference for comparison. It's not a general reference at all.
It's not a communications issue, it's a couple of people who feel the need to disparage those who disagree with them, so they can continue to do their "superiority dance" blind to everything else around them.
LH...I certainly don't want you to learn anything new if you don't want to!Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady's Human
However...I would like you to go back to my post. I said men and women communicate differently. Disability? No. How women talk and men talk is different and things can get confused or misunderstood because of it.
For example...in this thread I cannot find where anyone criticized WHAT Ms. Palin wears...what was criticized and made fun of was the amount of money that was spent, the hypocrisy, and where the money came from.
You called it a hen party and a bunch of old ladies playing bingo. I am guessing those are not compliments?
You don't think what was being discussed are legitimate topics. I think they go to the question of character. Obviously some others do as well.
So instead of offering a specific reason why these are not legitimate concerns you...Quote:
disparage those who disagree with you, so you can continue to do your "superiority dance"
Quote:
Originally Posted by Edwina's Secretary
Well said. Now this is about the most dispassionate, legitimate, explanation
of communication styles as you will ever find. The fact that men & women
use different ways of speaking/writing than men, is just a proven fact.
It's only a disability if you make it one.:)
I suspect it's more differing political views than a gender issue. There are plenty of left wing men out there, just not on this board, so somehow conflicts here end up a men versus women situation. I'm sure the guys here would be horrified at the blog entries of one of my favorite authors who is very outspoken in his political views :p. http://grrm.livejournal.com/
Plus, I think internet/text communication is quite different than in work or face-to-face interactions of daily life.
Quote:
Originally Posted by K9soul
Very true, but it can come down to a communication problem. For instance,
a man & women can have the same political views, but communicate their
thoughts in different ways.(styles)
I am surprised, quite, that you think LH cannot communicate with women. As the youngest of the family, he had a strong-willed mother and two older sisters - as well as an older brother, but the age spread is such that he was in college by the time LH hit kindergarten.
He was raised to communicate well with, and respect women.
Now, by the way I believe it was Richard, not LH who used the term "hen fest." I have never thought of "hen party" as a derogatory term, frankly, just a descriptive one of what often happens in a gathering of women - we talk, we chatter, the more of us, the more noise we make! Hen=female. Not that men don't gab, but their voices tend to be lower pitched, so it's a lower rumble of noise. A gab fest is a gab fest, but a hen fest is all girls.
I agree with that, and that there are differences in the way men and women communicate. It can take work and learning on the part of both to better understand each other. But sometimes I think it's just a general personality clash more than anything to do with gender.Quote:
Originally Posted by lizbud
ETA: I personally wouldn't care for being referred to as part of a 'hen-fest' unless it was meant teasingly. Said seriously, it does seem somewhat condescending to me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karen
They don't gab if there is a ball game on TV lol.
I find men are experts at communicating for an afternoon where not one word is uttered except "anyone want another beer while I'm up"
Like when we have a family gathering and all the cousins end up in the living room watching football. The ladies are in the dining room (usually indulging in the desserts lol) talking it up... and the living room is completely silent unless someone scores lol.
and when a group of women get together there is usually more than one conversation going on.. the talking gets loud, it gets fast and it gets high pitched and it SOUNDS like a hen house :)
A spirited defense of your little brother Karen! And my apologies if I misattributed one of the demeaning insults used against women.Quote:
Originally Posted by Karen
He did use "Old French Canuck women at bingo on Friday night." "Bunch of old biddies at the bingo hall."
I have to tell you...my strong-willed mother would have washed out my brother's mouth with soap if he had been so insulting to women!
I guess I'm more an exception to the norm then :p. I tend to become quiet in a large group or else speak lower one-on-one with someone off away from the main group. I hate competing with a lot of noise. In my ex's family gatherings however, the men were just as loud or louder than the women. It was a big family with a noisy bunch, where-as I was raised in a quiet house with just me and my mother. At the big gatherings, I always retreated to a quieter room after a couple hours to get a break!Quote:
Originally Posted by sparks19
If you read Deborah Tannen's book one of the things she talks about...when women talk to each other they nod. This is how women (normally) communicate. It is an indication of "I'm listening." If you look at a group of women talking they look like those dogs with the wiggly heads in the back of automobiles.
When men nod it is -- in "men speak" if you will, a sign of agreement.
The breakdown can occur when a woman is non-verbally saying "I am listening" and the man is non-verbally hearing "I agree with you."
And of course, when the man does not nod...women hear "not listening."
It is a very interesting area of study that crosses cultures as well.
And can be useful to understanding each other.
Perhaps this could be a visual that contributed to the term "hen party" all though I have never heard that term used in any "endearing" way!
My very strong-willed mother might have uttered either of those phrases.Quote:
Originally Posted by Edwina's Secretary
One can respect women without having to never utter a critical word about anyone belonging to that gender. Heck, he'd be accused of pandering if he did.
Have you ever been to a bingo hall in an old mill town on a Friday night? It is quite an interesting experience - there was always plenty of smoke, at my height of 5' 6" I towered over nearly everyone, and the noise level of gossip and chatter could have fooled a casual observer into thinking the bingo was not taken very seriously! Woe be unto thee who made that mistake!
ES, I wasn't insulting WOMEN in general. It was again, a specific comment on specific comments and behavior, not anyone in general.
Bollocks, to be polite. As with all non-verbal communication, it is situational, and dependent on far more than just gender.Quote:
When men nod it is -- in "men speak" if you will, a sign of agreement.
If that's a great revelation in the book, then the book should be in the recycling bin.
Quote:
Originally Posted by K9soul
You would have had a hard time ( or be a different person) if you had grown up in my family. I was raised with four rowdy brothers & only one
sister who was 10 years younger than me.:) You had to speak up and
hold your own, or be lost in the shuffle.:D
Gosh darn it LH...there you go bein polite and respectful again.
Let's see...what all are you an expert about....
By golly...the list is just too dang long.
Sorry Karen....but if that silly photo joke of women toting while men didn't was offensive enough to men for you to shut it down....
Can you REALLY say that to say to some that they are like "a bunch of old biddies" is not an insult???
I realize you have to take care of your brother and all but...
Classic, ES.
If you can't debate, denigrate.
Karen doesn't "take care of me" nor do I take care of her.
You may want to take a course in civil debate, emphasis on CIVIL.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady's Human
There is no way to interpret this remark, but as a insulting, sexist, way
to refer to women you don't like or you don't agree with.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady's Human
Exactly LH. Get a grip man.:D
Liz, it's not sexist at all. I've used the same comment to refer to men.
To restate in in simpler terms,
It has nothing to do with gender, it's the behavior.
As you denigate? "Bunch of biddies." Is that a debate tactic?Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady's Human
Or this...Debate? Civil?Quote:
If that's a great revelation in the book, then the book should be in the recycling bin.
I challenge you to find where in this thread ANYONE has complained about WHAT Sarah Palin was wearing. It was about the cost of what she wore and where the money came from to buy the clothes.
You turned it from a discussion into a denigation...of the people who were posting.
Civility? Why don't you demonstate it to me? I've yet to see any from you.
And next will you tell us when you use this phrase...Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady's Human
to refer to men?Quote:
Old French Canuck women at bingo on Friday night
Please.
And nothing superior in this remark!Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady's Human
When I've used that phrase to refer to men?
Easily.....American Legion meetings, Union meetings, work, ..........
and as Karen can attest, I'm not alone in the use of that phrase to refer to a behavior, regardless of gender.
As to the "expert" comment, I'll leave it alone, as we're not even in the same ballpark in regards to what constitutes an expert.
LOL there are always exceptions to the rule :)Quote:
Originally Posted by K9soul
I am LOUD... I always will be loud lol. My whole family (with the exception of my mother) is LOOOOOOUUUUUUUDDDDDD. lol
So my father also doesn't fit into the category of "quiet if there is a ball game on" the only time he is quiet is when he is asleep lol.
:)
From MW dictionary=
Main Entry: fest
Pronunciation: \ˌfest\
Function: noun
Etymology: German, from Fest celebration, from Latin festum — more at feast
Date: 1889
: a gathering, event, or show having a specified focus <a music fest> —often used in combination <a gabfest>
-------------
Yes, I used the term henfest.
You say bollocks, I say huevos!
I saw a program where they were talking about the word misogyny and how man had never come up with a term for women that hate men-
I love to have a good debate with people and have noticed that when given a comment or answer to a post, some people cannot answer or will not answer in a way to promote understanding or civil conversation.
Nope, Just toss out an insult or accuse the post of misogyny or some other politically incorrect crime.
Most of us have a sense of humor when challenged, some of us mope about, our heads thumped and brains scrambled because some one challenged us with a thought that might be challenged-is ya had your wits about you and a little bit of self deprecation.
But no, we are too immoveable and steadfast in our stupor and belief that our opinion is all that matters.
From lipstick on a pig, henfests and French Canuckian women at bingo-
I dated a Chicago/French/Canuck woman and have to tell you she'd gladly admit to being a tough gal, then kick you arse afterwards- it's amazing that women aren't a little tougher and more resistant to a few little words or sayings on a website.
LOL, You pluck and trim, shave places that I'd never let any sharp metal near, tint you hair or take it off with chemicals that kill sealife, you undergo surgeries to expand and shrink body parts, give birth and iron then you feign injury at some old saying that men toss out at you?.
Sorry ladies, you lost me at that one.
Yes, I am laughing at the people that deserve it.:confused:
Please,Quote:
Originally Posted by sparks19
You know that is not true. To use a political term, You are out of touch.
We also know-
WHERE'S the remote.
Grab me some chips honey.
RUN!, RUN!, RUN!, &#$*&$
What the eff was that?
What the eff was that all about?
This ref/ump is blind/on the take!
You just had to hit/catch it, stupid!
GO!, GO!, GO!, GO!,GO!, GO!, Yah!!!!!!
and
This one isn't cold.:D
LOL, you may want to take a look at that sentence, I can see some followers of a certain religion taking that statement as an attack on a certain book,Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady's Human
King James or not!:rolleyes:;):confused: