Question about President Bush

[ramanth]

Or in my case, where I need birth control to keep the pain of Endometriosis at bay.

[Lady's Human]

And who exactly was planning on banning contraceptives?

[lizzielou742]

It's not that anyone is proposing banning birth control pills and condoms. It's that federal funding under the Bush administration has gone overwhelmingly to groups who support abstinence-only programs versus groups that provide contraceptives. It has also tried to eliminate health insurance coverage for contraceptives for federal employees and their dependents (in the 2002 FY budget).

There are other issues for women out there to be concerned about under Bush, such as the fact that women in the Bush administration get paid 78 cents for every dollar the men in the administration get paid, the fact that Bush's reps have said in the past that women's discriminination are a "very different category for the President" than racial and ethnic discrimination, emergency contraceptive issues, the Global Gaga Rule, possibly appointing Supreme Court justices that could rule to overturn Roe v. Wade, reports of non-profit organizations that offer contraceptives being repeatedly audited, reports of information about women's health being removed from government websites, etc. etc. etc.

[carole]

I was interested to read this thread, as I too had heard that about Bush,one of the reasons I was hoping he was not re-elected.

The thing is the fact he has two daughters of his own, makes me wonder if in actual fact he would consider taking womens rights away, is it pure hearsay and just stirring things up, or is it indeed true?

I have to agree with you Wolfchan 100 percent there.

I don't think it is clear cut if you are pro-choice or pro-life because I consider myself somewhere in between.. I certainly believe in a womens right to choose, but then again I am not for abortion randomly just because its inconvenient, so doesn't that make me on the fence somewhat?

[Logan]

Originally posted by ramanth
Or in my case, where I need birth control to keep the pain of Endometriosis at bay.

Kimmy, I have the utmost respect for you, and I hope you know that, but has anyone stopped you from using birth control??? I used it, myself, until earlier this year when it was no longer necessary because my husband took steps to prevent pregnancy. I have NEVER heard or experienced anything that made me think that birth control would not be available to me, certainly not from anyone who was President or running for President!

Are we all saying that we are "for" free for all sex?? Before marriage? I have a 13 year old daughter who is mature for her age........I preach abstinance all day long with her. Am I wrong wanting her to abstain from sexual intercourse that might lead to unwanted pregnancy or disease? Is President Bush or President Anybody wrong in pushing this agenda??? They are offered LOTS of alternatives in Sex Education in school, and parents, like me, are trying like heck to offer alternatives to them, at home, as we should, as good parents.

We push "neutering" for our pets, why not push abstinance for our children as well until they are old enough to make informed decisions??? I want grandchildren and will love them to pieces, but I want my daughter and other children to experience life without the burden of producing offspring before they are ready.

[ramanth]

No offense taken.

I don't think that my birth control pills will be ripped from my hands anytime soon. However, it's just troubling to know that there might be a new head of the FDA that doesn't believe in such contraceptives. Who's to say they wouldn't try to push for a ban on contraceptives for unmarried women. It probably wouldn't pass though, but the idea to me is scary.

I'm all for abstinence. I abstained till I was 21 and even then I wish I had waited longer. Not to be too personal, but Andy is a virgin and wants to wait till he's married. I respect and honor that and so we wait.

I probably won't be able to have kids anyway, but that's a different rant for a different time.

I'm all for abstinence being taught, but today's society seems more sex driven than back when I was a kid, so I think other methods should be taught as well and not just focus on one method.

[aly]

I'm another one for abstinance, BUUUT I also acknowledge that not every child is brought up in a home where their parents educate them on it. Sex between unmarried people happens and will continue to happen no matter what. It seems to be a big part of "casual dating". Although I don't agree with it, I don't think these people are wrong for doing it. They aren't hurting anyone (usually) and they should be allowed to practice safe sex with condoms, birth control, etc. No, I don't think people should be having a sex free-for-all (hehe), but casual sex happens between friends and between people dating all the time. I don't think they should be made to wait - even though it is something you or I would do.

[dukedogsmom]

I was brought up correctly and still started having sex at age 17. Thank goodness for planned parenthood! I don't want that taken away from other young women. I've been responsible about it all along because I knew I didn't want children. However, if I did get pregnant, I would have an abortion. There are enough unwanted kids in the world already. Some people are so selfish and self centered that if they can't have their own, they won't adopt. I think that is so closed minded. Proof of our rights have already happened. Several pharmacies have refused to fill a morning after pill because it was "against their beliefs" They should have been given their walking papers! One victim was a 21 year old mother with 2 kids. It was an accident. By the time she found someone else that said they would fill the prescription, it was too late. Like Aly said, things like this happen bit by bit and then, later on, it all adds up. That's just one of the many reasons I didn't want Bush to win. I'm thinking of the younger women and girls, such as my 14yr old niece. She's been rasied and educated properly,too. But, as we all know, that's sometimes not enough.

[Kfamr]

My parents have never ONCE talked to me about sex, the dangers of having unprotected sex, etc.. Not once.
Nor have they spoken to me about smoking, doing drugs, drinking, etc.
I have never had the urge to do any of them, and the sex part will stay that way until i'm married. (And the rest will NEVER happen. )

This is MY choice, and my choice only. Just like having an abortion is someone's choice, and their choice only. We cannot lead people's lives, or atleast I don't think we should. .. no matter what we believe is right and wrong. (However, there is a line that should not be passed)
As far as not filling someone's perscription because of your beliefs.. that's ridiculous. Why get into that profession if you're going to deny your customers their requests?
It'd be like a vegan working at Outback and not allowing anyone to order a steak.
This is only my opinion of course.

[jazzzytina]

It'd be like a vegan working at Outback and not allowing anyone to order a steak.

I love that one.

Anyone see the interesting documentary on Trio called "Texas Virgins" that talked about the abstinence movement in Texas while President Bush was Governor? It was very interesting, and I have to say refreshing to see so many young people walking that walk. I wish I had.

[Tubby & Peanut's Mom]

Originally posted by Logan
Kimmy, I have the utmost respect for you, and I hope you know that,

Logan, ditto for me having the utmost respect for you. However, with all due respect, I don't think using you and Helen as examples will work in this argument. As you know, there are many many many young girls out there that don't have wonderful parents like Helen is lucky enough to have. There are thousands and thousands of young girls growing up in inner cities where alot of times their own mothers need to be taught about birth control, much less having the mother teach the daughter. And I'm not just saying the inner cities are the problems. I'm sure there are thousands of young girls growing up in rural communities that are just as much at danger of getting pregnant at a very young age. Sometimes their excuse is "what else have we got to do?" I know that's a sorry excuse, but we can't look at our view on this, we have to look at it from their point of view.

I have no problem teach abstinence. What I have a problem with is the fact that these teachers much teach abstinence to the exclusion of all other forms of birth control. They can't even answer questions about other forms of birth control! I think it's a great theory to only teach abstinence, but it's not very practical in the real world.

And my last argument with all this is that on one hand Bush preaches about how the Republican party is the party that empowers people to run their own lives and wants government control out of people's lives to they can be free to make their own choices and run their own lives. Then on the other hand he wants to put more governmental controls in people's lives so they won't have the choice of having an an abortion. How is it that he calls Kerry a flip flopper when he clearly speaks out of both sides of his own mouth? "I say less governmental control for the people....oh but wait....except when it comes to abortions. Then we must let the government have complete control and ban all abortions." Someone please explain that one to me.....

[Logan]

I know, I know, Debbie, which is why I ought to stay out of these discussions.

[lizzielou742]

Debbie -

It's a wedge issue. Just like the gay marriage thing. If the Republicans in office really did ban gay marriage and abortion, then it would no longer be an issue for average Americans to fight over when election time comes around. And there wouldn't be those two huge issues to separate the Republicans and the Democrats, and the parties wouldn't have much to fight over or separate themselves except issues like the economy, foreign policy, etc. The average American would be forced to concentrate on what else separates the two parties. So, I propose the Bush administration and Congress should go ahead and do it. Go ahead and federally ban gay marriage and abortion completely, I say. Sound crazy? It's because they'd never do it.

Know what I mean?

[Tubby & Peanut's Mom]

I'd have to disagree, lizzielou. If the Republicans went ahead and banned abortions, it would become even more of an issue because the pro-choicers would start pushing even harder to get it un-banned. And also, there would start to be all the health problems cropping up from women who go ahead and get them illegally by untrained non-doctor types.

So, therefore, I propose that the pro-lifers just drop the issue, since it's never going to be banned, and that way we can start to focus on the other "real" issues.

And Logan, no problem. If you hang out in these threads in the doghouse you know I normally don't get involved either. Don't know why this one sucked me in.

[lizzielou742]

Right. My idea was to go ahead and challenge the Republicans in the Congress to ban it, and make them defend it, knowing it would never happen. It would expose some hypocrisy.