The 2004 presidential election.

[Lady's Human]

In some states, including PA, they are allowed to vote.

[Tubby & Peanut's Mom]

Originally posted by Logan
I didn't think prisoners were allowed to vote!

I accidentally clicked on this thread. I haven't taken time to read the entire thing, but Logan, from what I understand, it's only felons that can't vote. If you are convicted of a felony crime, you can't vote for the rest of your life. However, a lot of crimes are not felons - just petty crimes I guess - so those prisoners don't loose their voting rights.....from what I understand.

They are also talking about reversing the felony thing. If you've done your time and paid for your crime, you should be able to go back into society as full blown member with all the rights afforded to a regular citizen. Don't know if I agree with that, but just wanted to throw that out there for you all to chew on too.

Ok, back to your regularly scheduled debate.

[tatsxxx11]

One lawsuit that will probably never happen.....A Class action suit against the State of Pennsylvania by the troops who have just been disenfranchised to to the Ex DNC chairman and Governor of PA, Ed Rendell. GOV. Rendell has refused to extend the deadline for absentee ballots, which, when combined with the actions of the PA SC, which removed Nader from the ballot, has taken the right to vote away from the people who are defending the rights of everyone in the country. Congradulations to the DNC.

The suit was heard and as is explained, that is a decision (extending the absentee ballot deadline) that only a fereral court judge can make, and did. If you don't care to read the entire letter, (long) here's a pertinent excerpt from a letter written by Gov. Rendell to Senator Santorum in respone to the charges.

"As Judge Kane noted in her Memorandum and Order, the proposal by the federal government would have "invited unpredictability to an otherwise orderly and
time tested elections process" and "may do more to disenfranchise overseas
voters than the harm they seek to cure."
Despite these facts and the existence of a federal court decision on the matter, members of the media and others continue to call on me to extend the deadline for receipt of military and overseas ballots. As an attorney, you
know that I do not have the power unilaterally to extend deadlines set by
statute - and it is disingenuous for anyone who believes in the rule of law
even to suggest such action".



HARRISBURG, Pa., Oct. 25 /PRNewswire/ -- Governor Edward G. Rendell
released a letter he wrote to U.S. Sen. Rick Santorum regarding misinformation
about military and overseas absentee ballots.
The Governor's letter follows.

October 25, 2004

The Honorable Rick Santorum
United States Senate
511 Dirksen Senate Building
Washington, DC 20510

Dear Senator Santorum:
As Governor of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, I have a constitutional
obligation to protect the right of every eligible Pennsylvania citizen to vote
and to ensure that these votes are properly counted. This is the same duty
that I discharged as Mayor and District Attorney of the City of Philadelphia.
I believe that the right to vote is fundamental, and I will never allow that
right to be compromised for any reason.
So let me be absolutely clear concerning the votes of our servicemen and
women and other overseas Pennsylvania citizens: We have received written
certifications from 65 of Pennsylvania's 67 counties that they have provided
absentee ballots to military and overseas voters in accordance with applicable
Federal law. The two remaining counties have cured problems with the issuance
of absentee ballots through an expedited mailing and ballot return process as
explained below. These certifications support the conclusion that all
Pennsylvania military and overseas ballots have been sent out in accordance
with Federal law. All of these ballots will be counted in accordance with law
for the November 2nd General Election.
As you know, several weeks ago, Attorney General John Ashcroft through the
United States Department of Justice (DOJ) requested a federal court order
requiring Pennsylvania counties (a) to deliver to military and overseas voters
a second absentee ballot that did not include the names of Ralph Nader and
Peter Camejo and (b) to grant a two-week extension for the counting of
military and overseas ballots cast in the November 2nd General Election. The
Pennsylvania Republican and Democratic parties and the presidential campaigns
were given notice of this court proceeding.
The commonwealth opposed Attorney General Ashcroft's request because all
military and overseas ballots had been issued in time to be received and
counted in accordance with law, and because a second absentee ballot would
create significant voter confusion. After two days of hearings and arguments
last week, United States District Court Judge Yvette Kane - who served as
Secretary of the Commonwealth under Governor Tom Ridge and is intimately
familiar with Pennsylvania election law and procedures - agreed with the
commonwealth's position and denied the DOJ request.
Some have noted that the commonwealth agreed to an extension of time for
the return of military and overseas ballots for the April 2004 primary
election. In fact, the commonwealth agreed to an extension for the primary
election because many county boards of elections in March failed in their
statutory duty to deliver and mail special write-in absentee ballots under the
applicable statutory deadlines. Moreover, as a consequence of the late
mailings, commonwealth officials were convinced that at least some overseas
voters were unlikely to receive their absentee ballots in sufficient time to
return them by the statutory deadline. Because many absentee ballots were
delivered late in advance of the primary and to protect the rights of voters
overseas, the commonwealth agreed to an extension of the filing deadline,
which was memorialized by a federal court order.
Unlike the primary election, for the November 2nd General Election the
county boards of elections (with two exceptions discussed below) have
certified in writing that they delivered or mailed absentee ballots to
military and overseas voters either by September 20th - the deadline under
Pennsylvania law - or a day or two later to accommodate changes made to the
absentee ballot required by state court actions on whether Nader and Camejo
should appear on the General Election ballot.
We are aware of two relatively small counties that failed to deliver and
mail ballots as required by law. When the Department of State learned of
these counties' omissions in early October, it directed these counties to send
out special write-in absentee ballots immediately by express mail and to
provide military and overseas voters an expedited method of returning absentee
ballots free of charge. Judge Kane and the Department of Justice approved of
this remedy for these two counties.
Beyond these two counties, neither the DOJ nor any other voter or
interested person has claimed in legal submissions or at the hearing last week
that other county boards of elections failed to send absentee ballots to
military or overseas electors as required by Pennsylvania law in time for
these voters to receive and vote absentee ballots by the statutory deadline.


As Judge Kane noted in her Memorandum and Order, the proposal by the federal government would have "invited unpredictability to an otherwise orderly and
time tested elections process" and "may do more to disenfranchise overseas
voters than the harm they seek to cure."
Despite these facts and the existence of a federal court decision on the matter, members of the media and others continue to call on me to extend the deadline for receipt of military and overseas ballots. As an attorney, you
know that I do not have the power unilaterally to extend deadlines set by
statute - and it is disingenuous for anyone who believes in the rule of law
even to suggest such action.


Moreover, even if I had the power to extend the
deadline, I am convinced, based on my review of the facts and the
well-reasoned and thorough opinion of Judge Kane, that there is no reason to
do so. However, if any credible evidence is presented in a timely manner that
any county has not in fact complied with the law, the commonwealth is prepared
to seek an appropriate judicial remedy.
As we enter the last week of this election cycle, I am confident that
despite our philosophical differences, we will be united in continuing to
protect the voting rights of our citizens.

Sincerely,

Edward G. Rendell
Governor

CONTACT: Kate Philips of the Pennsylvania Office of the Governor,
+1-717-783-1116

[Lady's Human]

The problem comes in when the overseas ballots are ruled invalid because they had Nader on the ballot.

[tatsxxx11]

Agreed! But it is the courts that have to recitfy the problem; the legislature, governonr, cannot intervene unilaterally.

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by tatsxxx11
Agreed! But it is the courts that have to recitfy the problem

She said 'rectify'.........huh, huh huh!!!

[Lady's Human]

The governor's office could, however, take some action in the courts to get resolution, instead of stonewalling. After all, it was the DNC in PA that created this mess when they filed lawsuits at the last minute to keep Nader off of the ballot. A remedy could have been sought as part of that action, but wasn't, as it was not in the interests of the parties that filed suit.

[lizbud]

I don't think it's a Judge's or a Governor's job to seek remedies to wrongs.That's the job of the lawyers on each side of an arguement brought before the court.

[Lady's Human]

The purpose of the lawsuit was to theoretically right the wrongs of oh my god having a third party candidate on the ballot. In causing the problem of having multiple versions of the ballot floating around, they could have asked the judge in the case to rule that the absentee ballots that had Nader on them were legitamate. They did not, creating the current problem.

Old military rule....If you're' going to complain about something, you had best have a valid solution.

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by lizbud
I don't think it's a Judge's or a Governor's job to seek remedies to wrongs.That's the job of the lawyers on each side of an arguement brought before the court.

Judges and governors have their fiefdoms to run, they don't have time for that...


Thanks for coming back before the election.....


I needed some one to help me decide who to vote for.

----------------------------------

I was watching the Bill 'its braver to crash a plane into the WTC'
Maher tonight.....He had on Wesley Clark, Richard Belzer and Kevin Costner.

The person that I thought would make an intelligent comment didn't, the person who I thought would be funny wasn't and the person who I thought was an airhead made the most brilliant observation.

-------------------------------------

Americans are stupid, they need to be told again and again and again.

You know how to get the hair on the spine of a policitian stand up???

GO VOTE....

Blah, blah blah, blah George Bush blah blah blah.

In order

Richard Belzer. Not funny.

Kevin Costner, Brilliant.

Wes Clark, " "

Wes, dude, have those eyes checked out, looks like a runaway thyroid.

When the 7 lost minutes of the Bush/school children visit came up
(Bush sitting in the Sarasota classroom on 9/11) AGAIN ......
the conversation drifted as to why people bring this up again and again......,Belzer made his observation. Lovely, a comedian who I thought was smart, ain't!

I personally think that since George Bush didn't duck into a local phone booth, put on his super hero outfit and keep the PA flight from hitting the ground, He's no Superman....

He was the president.

I find it rather funny that people still bring that up.....

Let it go..........it's history, learn from it...

Fool me once shame on you.....
Next time you have a plan to work from.


The one think that I have enjoyed about this election is listening to people bash our politicians.

One of the funniest parts of this whole discourse are the snipes I have read on the threads.

I'd make a great politician, I've done most the things that the candidates have.

Except marry for money.

Women seem to find me out before I can get my claws into them.
But that's what I get for dating smart women.

So, sometime in the near future put your presidential hat on and gaze into the mirror.....Say, "I could be president!"

For a second think about all the nasty stuff in your past,
Then wink at the person in the mirror put the hat back on the shelf and let's work on the nastiness and BS for 2008

There's a lot of living to do between now and then....I hate to see us lose our edge.

[Lady's Human]

Gov Rendell doesn't have the power to extend the absentee ballot deadline?

From MSNBC:

Yesterday, in hotly contested Pennsylvania, Gov. Edward G. Rendell (D) agreed to a seven-day extension to settle a federal lawsuit in that state after initially resisting the idea. As a result, military ballots there may be received through Nov. 10. Republican officials are considering a new lawsuit to push back that extension further.

Oops, guess he did.

[mugsy]

In regards to prisoners: As far as I understand, you may vote, felon or otherwise, as long as you are not physically in prison. That's what I understand....they may have changed it, but, I know people with felonies that have done their time and are very active on the political front.

As far as PA and the absentee voting...that's just not right. EVERYONE 18 years or older should have the right to vote...especially those men and women in the military who are oversees fighting for our country....God I hate trick plays....by either side.

I am truly at a loss in this election....I can't abide by either candidate. Neither one of the them would know the truth or speak the truth if they tried. And of course, in IN, the 2nd most conservative state in the Union behind KS, Nadar was not allowed to be on the ballot....I love how the government can keep candidates from running by keeping them off the ballot.

[Lady's Human]

In PA, Prisoners can vote in elections. The rules vary state to state. As far as Nader and the other third party candidates getting on the ballot, there should be nothing keeping them off of the ballot as long as they are eligible to run under federal law. Third parties not being listed on ballots is one of the things that keeps the two party system as it is. Frankly, both major parties are letting the lunatic fringe take control, and it is truly pathetic.

Bill n' Opus for president!

[ramanth]

Originally posted by RICHARD
TRIVIA!

In the last 17 elections when the Washington Redskins LOSE the home game BEFORE the election the incumbent loses.

GREEN BAY 28, WASHINGTON 14

[mugsy]

They also said that it might not be the same this year because the BoSox broke their World Series curse!

All I know is that I am SO ready for this to be over. What I find scary is that my 8th graders are better versed on this election than a lot of adults who are actually GOING to vote. We just got done with a 2 week unit on U.S. government and how it works and the differences in the parties and stands that each candidate is taking yada yada yada. The kids were really frustrated because they couldn't figure out which way I leaned....I'm so bad! lol