breeding delima

[binka_nugget]

Originally posted by KYS
Not to keep the subject going on and on.
Shots are not evil.
Ask your vet why some dogs
have bad re-actions to shots.
From what I understand,
it has to do with the dogs immune system.
In the wild only healthy animals survived.
In domesticated animals their is no
survival of the fittest.
(that why carefull breeding is so very important)

JMHO

That makes sense, and you also said it in a nice tone. I'll have to ask the vet about this. In theory, Kai's immunity level should be boosted but I don't want to go into details. Often, there are people that claim that their dog/s have come in contact with something (parvo or what not) and they were perfectly fine. All dogs are different I guess so I don't think there's a right or wrong answer to this.

[aly]

You're right that all dogs have different immune systems, etc. However, with puppies, their immune systems aren't as developed so they will almost always contract parvo if exposed to it. Even if an adult dog doesn't catch it after being exposed, that dog can still carry the virus and transmit it to other dogs.

I respect peoples' opinions who consider not vaccinating if it is in the best interest of their individual dog. I don't agree with it much, but I do respect it because I think the people have good intentions. Obviously, they don't want to cause harm to their dogs. However, I have big problems with people who just flat out refuse to go to the vet. And I really strongly disagree with the natural rearing. There's absolutely no point to it. Saying that wolves survived in the wild without vets is true, but as KYS pointed out, there's survival of the fittest. Many wolves died who could have been spared with medical treatment. We've domesticated our dogs and they depend on us. We should do all we can to keep them healthy and not just say, oh well, thats nature's course.

[wolfsoul]

Just to say something about shots, most wild dogs get shots. Canid biologists travel far and wide to make sure that they give wolves and other wild dogs their shots, radio collars or chips, and they take health records of the animal. Then they put drops in the wild dogs' eyes so theyaren't scratchy from the tranqulizers and set them free. So no one can use wild dogs don't get shots as an excuse.

From what i've read, dogs that have lower immunities or allergies are the ones that have bad reactions to shots. If they have a low immunity, they should get their shots so that thier bodies can build an immuntiy to the reactions and give it a boost.

Dog are not wild. They depend on us completely for everything. I respect that some people only want what is best when not taking their dogs to the vet, but it will be very sad when a dog gets very sick and the owner refuses to take it and the dog slowly suffers rather than getting medication or a quicker alternative to a slow painful death.

[cali]

I adivise some of you to read before you write, some people are jumping to the conclusion that my dogs NEVER see a vet, when all I said was that they dont go for every little thing nor do they go annually, if something was horrably wrong we would take them to our vet, yes we have one, a HOLISTIC vet. when we do take them to the vet for titres and their PARVO shot as a pup. yes their parvo shot, that is all they get, however, and not until 16 weeks of age. also when it comes to border collies, a good breeder with working dogs will NOT vaccinate the pups why?? so that only the strong survive to keep the breed healthy unlike most other breeds, BC's are som eof the healthiest around and that is the reason for it.

[Kfamr]

EVERYONE NEEDS TO STOP.
THIS PERSON OBVIOULSY JUST WANTED TO START SOMETHING, AS YOU SEE SHE/HE HAS NOT CAME BACK INTO THIS POST FOR A WHILE NOW. LETS JUST LEAVE IT AT WE ALL HAVE OUR DIFFERENT OPINIONS.

[aly]

Cali -

I saw what you said in this thread. But I do remember previous ones where you have caused quite a stir saying you wouldn't go to the vet.

You're offended that people say responsible breeders vaccinate, BUT you just said responsible breeders DON'T vaccinate. So you're doing the same thing that you're getting mad at other people for!

[binka_nugget]

Originally posted by Kfamr
EVERYONE NEEDS TO STOP.
THIS PERSON OBVIOULSY JUST WANTED TO START SOMETHING, AS YOU SEE SHE/HE HAS NOT CAME BACK INTO THIS POST FOR A WHILE NOW. LETS JUST LEAVE IT AT WE ALL HAVE OUR DIFFERENT OPINIONS.

Agreed. Everyone has different opinions. We should just leave it at that.

[primabella]

EVERYONE NEEDS TO STOP.THIS PERSON OBVIOULSY JUST WANTED TO START SOMETHING, AS YOU SEE SHE/HE HAS NOT CAME BACK INTO THIS POST FOR A WHILE NOW. LETS JUST LEAVE IT AT WE ALL HAVE OUR DIFFERENT OPINIONS.

I mentionned that awhile ago. This is such a waste. No one will agree here.

[cali]

I mean border collies are considered one of the healthier breeds, they have not been bred to death my many breeds and become useless(for there original job I mean) there are few breed specific illnesses, for them, just collie eye, blindness,(more like disablities) and hip displasia, which is relitivly new to the breed, the good breeders(not show breeders in the case of a BC) only go for ability, and health, not for looks, so it is really survival of the fittest for them, because if they cant survive on there own without help from vaccs as a pup how are they going to survive herding for hours on end, getting kicked by the stock etc.. you only want the fittest and healthiest dogs in the breed

[aly]

Thanks for the info. It is interesting but you know where I stand on vacs so I won't beat this topic into the ground anymore