Sex abuse in church

[lizbud]

No, but pedophiles may gravitate toward jobs that have to do with children, sadly.

Now, that could be true. These people who abuse children don't have
"normal" sexual desires for heterosexual relationships. They are deviates
from the normal.

[wombat2u2004]

Now, that could be true. These people who abuse children don't have
"normal" sexual desires for heterosexual relationships. They are deviates
from the normal.

No no no....they DO have normal sexual desires. They are the same as everyone else. But that changes because of circumstance.
They cannot have a normal sexual realationship, so therefore they take the only way out, and have an abnormal sexual relationship.

[Catty1]

But Wom - isn't that like saying the pedophiles among us can choose to marry, and therefore won't prey on children?

I think the one point made was that the Catholic clergy is attractive to pedophiles because they don't have to hide behind a marriage...and they have a lot of access to their victims.

I agree that there likely are affairs of all kinds in the Catholic church, but I bet pedophilia is of a higher incidence than in other churches, or the public at large.

Churches that welcome pastors with families will attract that element. Less so for pedophiles!

[Marigold2]

Why are priets not allowed to marry? The truth will surprise many, it's not because they are married to God and are suppose to be pure of thought. Hundreds of years ago priets were allowed to marry, I believe 39 Popes were.
It had to do with the church wanting to keep more money for themselves and not wanting to support the priest and his many kids, mistress and more kids. Money, money, money it's all about the money.

[king2005]

Why are priets not allowed to marry? The truth will surprise many, it's not because they are married to God and are suppose to be pure of thought. Hundreds of years ago priets were allowed to marry, I believe 39 Popes were.
It had to do with the church wanting to keep more money for themselves and not wanting to support the priest and his many kids, mistress and more kids. Money, money, money it's all about the money.

I hope I don't upset anyone with "my personal opinion"

Todays Church (I cannot speak for the past as I HONESTLY don't know it) is nothing more then a money hungry Cult. Thats how I see it.

I am no longer religious as it was forced down my throat by crazy teachers & crazy church goers. The ONLY person who was on my side was Fr. Sebastien. He never tried to cram it down my throat, never got mad if I didn't pay, pray or believe. He said the ONLY thing that was important, was for me to be a good moral person... & to this day, that is the rule I live by.

I am a strong believer that the lack of marriage plays a huge part in the molestation/rape issues. How many priests have been caught for paying hookers? I've heard of several, how many aren't caught? ALL mammals have a huge drive for sexual relations, esp males. Its all related to hormones.

Take elephants for example. Take an intact male & keep him penned up alone from the females.. What dose he do out of sexual frustration? He humps anything he can get on top of (cars, toys, different species, etc)..

Horses will do the same thing
Dogs will do the same thing
Monkeys & Apes will do the same things
& so on...

Human males are no different. After a while their sexual frustrations are going to cause them to snap & do crazy things.. which in our society is illegal.

Maybe neutering (not a V.) Priests is the way to go. It generally solves other male mammals from getting sexually frustrated, as there are NO hormones to cause it. Seriously... What do Priests need them for anyways?

[blue]

The Catholic Church isnt infallible. For all of its faults the church still helps more then it harms.

[wombat2u2004]

The Catholic Church isnt infallible. For all of its faults the church still helps more then it harms.

It does....but first it helps itself.

[Miss Z]

Maybe neutering (not a V.) Priests is the way to go. It generally solves other male mammals from getting sexually frustrated, as there are NO hormones to cause it. Seriously... What do Priests need them for anyways?

Now you mention it, routine castration has been part of many old religious divisions even up to the early 20th century, if I recall correctly. Perhaps they had it right in the past! It certaintly would be a rather fitting punishment for these priests, or indeed any serious sexual predator.

[king2005]

Now you mention it, routine castration has been part of many old religious divisions even up to the early 20th century, if I recall correctly. Perhaps they had it right in the past! It certaintly would be a rather fitting punishment for these priests, or indeed any serious sexual predator.

I think getting it done beforehand is the way to go. Once a priest has been a priest for 5yrs, its mandatory to have your nads removed.

I truly believe most of those priests never planned on harming anyone. Raging hormones will cause you to do sick evil things, EVEN if you are a good person.

Take my dad for example... he was starting to go down a very bad path before I was born, but luckily he saw what path he was going down & sought help right away. He saw a shrink to help, then had some surgery to help (after my sister was born) & went on medication to lower his drive greatly.

Please note, he didn't commit any crimes (no humans of any age were involved)s, but he was damn close. To this day it has haunted him. & because of what didn't happen I was subjected to horrible evils when I was 14yrs old. Its sooo much fun being lured into a room & then have 2 adults (mother & CAS) try to force you to say "daddy touched me"... If I wasn't a level headed stubborn child I would have caved & said whatever it took to get them to stop yelling at me. Sorry not gonna lie about something like that... but how many scared kids would?

Kinda makes you wonder how many false cases there really are out there...

My point is, is that my dad IS a good man, he's not a predator by far, but his hormones were going to make him one. So this is why I believe hormones control us more then we'd like to think.

Also look at a lot of the Priests that are doing the crimes, they are fairly old, no? & been trapped in a raging hormonal body for decades with no release, no? Ticking time bombs.

Doesn't the same sort of thing happen to many dogs that are tied up all their lives? After several yrs of nothing but confinement & isolation, the once friendly dog is now a raging psycho path.

Lets also look at Zoos. What happens when you put wild animals into small boring pens? They loose their minds & do abnormal things.

Lets look at circuses. What happens when you confine a wild animal to a tiny pen & force it to do stupid retarded things all its life? They loose their minds & become milling machines.

yes yes yes, they are very different situations, but just look what hormones & confinement & isolation does to a wild animal. Humans are animals, we ALL react very very similar & when we snap or go nuts, watch out, because we are also very smart animals, so we are good at hiding things.. kinda like a sick cat I suppose.

[Cataholic]

I am a strong believer that the lack of marriage plays a huge part in the molestation/rape issues. How many priests have been caught for paying hookers? I've heard of several, how many aren't caught? ALL mammals have a huge drive for sexual relations, esp males. Its all related to hormones.

Human males are no different. After a while their sexual frustrations are going to cause them to snap & do crazy things.. which in our society is illegal.

I believe that research has shown, time and again, that rape is NOT a sexual issue.

Molestation is not a sexual issue...it is a deviant mindset.

Being gay does not make someone a pedophile. There is simply no relation to one's sexual preference and molestation. Gays like men or women....pedophiles like CHILDREN.

Allowing or disallowing priests to marry doesn't alter the deviant mindset of molestation. Molestation is NOT caused by some pent up sexual frustration.

Wacked is wacked...whether you are married or not.

[Miss Z]

As always, a most excellent post, Johanna.

Castration is drastic but I could certainly see the minute chance of eunuchs returning to the church before priests and nuns were allowed to marry, certainly those in the higher ranking positions of authority. I highly doubt the Vatican would be swayed on that one. I believe they take this belief from a rather literal interpretation from the book of Matthew, although being atheist, I do not know it to quote it.

But, as to whatever solves the issue addressed in the OP, the floor remains open. I think the only thing that can be agreed on thus far is a more rapid and fitting course of action for those caught.

[king2005]

I believe that research has shown, time and again, that rape is NOT a sexual issue.

Molestation is not a sexual issue...it is a deviant mindset.

Being gay does not make someone a pedophile. There is simply no relation to one's sexual preference and molestation. Gays like men or women....pedophiles like CHILDREN.

Allowing or disallowing priests to marry doesn't alter the deviant mindset of molestation. Molestation is NOT caused by some pent up sexual frustration.

Wacked is wacked...whether you are married or not.

Mindset or Chemical imbalance?
Its amazing the things humans will do when their brain isn't working right. I'm NOT using any of this as an excuse for their behaviour, I'm putting a lot of the blame on how these people have to live their lives, which isn't biologically or psychologically right/normal.

[chocolatepuppy]

I believe that research has shown, time and again, that rape is NOT a sexual issue.

Molestation is not a sexual issue...it is a deviant mindset.

Being gay does not make someone a pedophile. There is simply no relation to one's sexual preference and molestation. Gays like men or women....pedophiles like CHILDREN.

Allowing or disallowing priests to marry doesn't alter the deviant mindset of molestation. Molestation is NOT caused by some pent up sexual frustration.

Wacked is wacked...whether you are married or not.

Excellent post...I agree 100%

[Asiel]

I believe that research has shown, time and again, that rape is NOT a sexual issue.

Molestation is not a sexual issue...it is a deviant mindset.

Being gay does not make someone a pedophile. There is simply no relation to one's sexual preference and molestation. Gays like men or women....pedophiles like CHILDREN.

Allowing or disallowing priests to marry doesn't alter the deviant mindset of molestation. Molestation is NOT caused by some pent up sexual frustration.

Wacked is wacked...whether you are married or not.

Cataholic makes a lot of sense in this post. I can understand some people thinking that letting priests marry might make a difference and in a small minority it might.
But many pedophiles, homosexulas are married and it doesn't change their mindset. There are as many sexual deviants in married couples that in all walks of life.
I'm sure many of us know of these odd couples who will spend hours watching porno , including porno of little children...are these not sexual deviants?
If marriage would be the answer to this problem then you wouldn't see these half *ss deviant couples having to turn to porno to satisfy themselves. When police raid their homes and come out with box after box of porn with little kids posing I'd say they are simply deviants regardless of the life they chose. Being married is another way for them to hide , just like hiding behind priesthood.
Your neighbour could be one of them and you would never suspect it from the facade he displays for the neighbourhood. Heck, some of these sickos even use their own kids and make them pose for videos...sick!!

[wombat2u2004]

But Wom - isn't that like saying the pedophiles among us can choose to marry, and therefore won't prey on children?

I think the one point made was that the Catholic clergy is attractive to pedophiles because they don't have to hide behind a marriage...and they have a lot of access to their victims.

I agree that there likely are affairs of all kinds in the Catholic church, but I bet pedophilia is of a higher incidence than in other churches, or the public at large.

Churches that welcome pastors with families will attract that element. Less so for pedophiles!

Well yeah, I suppose that church does attract pedo's......but to what extent ???? Is every priest that ends up a pedo have a past as a pedo ???
I doubt it. I suppose some had that in mind when they first entered the church, but I would bet that would be a very low percentage of them.
Most of those priests entered their training as teenagers. Usually because of family expectations that to be good Catholics, one of their children be it male or female enter the church. If that is the case, then why would they have been pedo's then ???
And isn't it true that most perversions need to time to grow and be nutured ??? I mean if mummy and daddy EXPECTED their son to give his life to the church, and then took him along as a 16-17 year old, and shoved him into the local convent where he was sexually abused by his superiors, how long do you figure it would take before he knew that the only way he could get sex, was in the same manner ????
I believe that it is circumstance. These people can't lead an ordinary sex life, so they must seek it secretly, and what is a better opportunity than to take advantage of those who won't speak up ???