Can somebody explain the most recent Israel/Palestine conflict?

[sasvermont]

It is not so simple.

http://www.mideastweb.org/briefhistory.htm

[caseysmom]

That's it, I've had enough.

I'm tired of the double standard which exists here.

Had I said that about a woman on this board I'd have had my head handed to me in an instant.

You constantly insult people, and constantly use condescending language when referrig to a few posters in particular.

How in hell you get away with it I have no idea, but I've had enough.

Take your elitist crap and find another place to peddle your superiority complex.

For the record I think that you did not deserve that comment Lady's Human and even though we sometimes disagree you treat the other side with respect that you are debating with.

[jennielynn1970]

My ex was a Palestinian living in Egypt.

There was a time where Palestinians were not allowed to get back into Palestine because Palestine wasn't considered a "country" and those people who were traveling or out of country were considered a refuge. His status, before he became an American citizen, was still a Palestinian Refugee.

Everything that I gathered from him, and a lot of it was more than I really wanted to know because it turned into a lecture at times. However, that being said, he really did know a lot about the circumstance. His grandfather also does journalism and radio talks about Palestinian causes (grandpa has lived here for over 40 years).

Almost of the strife you hear of now goes back to when the Jews were "given" the country of Palestine by after WWII. This is land they say they were promised in the Bible/Torah. However, there were people already living in that area, all over that area, and that area was called Palestine.

Instead of finding an area where they wouldn't be moving people out of their homes, it was decided to take all of the Palestinians and move them into a designated area, put them in refugee camps and basically remove all of their human rights. Much like what the Nazis did to the Jews.

Maybe it's just me, but how does what the Jews went through give them the right to do the same thing to another people?? I never understood that. It may have said in the Bible/Torah that you were supposed to be promised a certain land, but if someone else is already there, technically it's already taken, you can't just move them. At least I don't think you should be able to.

Why make others suffer because they had suffered??

My ex also had relatives who are Hamas. How about living in a shack of a house, and having no indication anything is going on, and in the middle of the night, a tank comes and plows down the house with the family in it? Killing everyone?? How does Israel get that right??


They have been, and will always be, fighting over the initial taking of the land. The Palestinians, and whomever else were there, deserve to have their land back. They deserve to live in homes, not refugee camps, not subjected to all the crap that they go through.

Just because in the Torah/Bible it said that the Israelis were promised that land by God, doesn't mean that another people should have been harmed to give it to them.

The whole thing makes me sick. The way one group treats the other. It just goes back and forth, and until the Palestinians get their land back, yes THEIR land, it's not going to stop, nor should it. I wouldn't want to be moved out of my house because in someone else's Bible it said it was "given" to them by God. I bought it, I live here, too bad, suck it up and go get your own place that no one is living in.

That's my take.


Wish my ex was around(he's visiting Egypt) cause he could write it out and explain it better than I could.

And yes, Palestinians are still considered refugees. From what I gathered in Egypt, citizenship was determined by the father, and my ex's father was Palestinian. His mom is Egyptian. Mom cannot give him citizenship (like we can here in the US). He was born in Kuwait, when his dad was working there, but is not a Kuwaiti citizen. His citizen ship goes with the father in Egypt, and his father is not an Egyptian. Citizenship over there is confusing.

[Karen]

I have deleted comments in this thread that were not appropriate for Pet Talk. Please remember to treat each other with respect.

[popcornbird]

Jenn Librarian, I completely agree with you. I have many, many Palestinian friends, and most of them have the same story. Refugees, kicked out of THEIR homeland. Everyone has the right to peace and safety in their land. Everyone has the right to peace and safety in their homes. Everyone has the right to defend their land and home from criminals. The Palestinians have suffered too long. They have been kicked out of the land that belonged to them. They were kicked out of their homes where they were raising up innocent families and children, and made into refugees, thrown into refugee camps to make room for foreigners who didn't belong there. Their homes were destroyed, family members killed. Why? Because the Jews think they're the chosen people, and that's the land God chose for them? Maybe its because of their crimes against humanity that God took the land away from them and gave it to another nation. The Israelis even hit a boat that was bringing in relief supplies for the victims in Gaza. Can you believe that?? Its a big shame. So many people have suffered in this conflict. So many children have been killed. And to think...this conflict wouldn't even exist if the land was just returned to its rightful owners. The Palestinians deserve to have their land returned to them.

The conflict in Palestine/Israel is just the fruit of injustice. Such situations will always arise when injustice is allowed to rule in the land. Only when injustice is abolished will peace prevail. God knows when and if that will ever happen. I don't see it happening in our lifetime. Its a sad, sad situation, and I pray for all those who are suffering for no crime of their own.

[Giselle]

]Why? Because the Jews think they're the chosen people, and that's the land God chose for them? Maybe its because of their crimes against humanity that God took the land away from them and gave it to another nation.

Hmm, that's a vengeful God that I'd rather not subscribe to. To each his/her own. *shrugs*

Interesting info and perspectives. It's rather difficult maintaining objectivity in this situation, isn't it? Hmm, I will be perusing the aforementioned links in the meantime.

[RICHARD]

I think that the people who do the suicide bombings and shoot off rockets and mortars are to blame.

The way I see it, the first set of idiots who start this a-holery should not complain about getting the same back.

The Palis have had chance after chance to sit down and broker a peace deal-The other Arab nations in the surrounding areas use the Palis to war with the Israelis, then claim to be a brotherhood.

I had to laugh at the Iranian youth groups that claimed to have signed up 10,000 volunteers to go to Israel and blow themselves up.


Stay at home and play with explosives there.

[KYS]

[QUOTE by popcornbird:. Why? Because the Jews think they're the chosen people, and that's the land God chose for them? Maybe its because of their crimes against humanity that God took the land away from them and gave it to another nation. >>>>>>>>>>>

I will pray for you popcornbird. Such hate.

1:The Palestinian refugee problem has remained unsolved for approximately 60 years, causing suffering and instability throughout the Middle East.
The Arabs' rejection in 1947 of UN General Assembly Resolution 181 - which would have partitioned the British Mandate area into an Arab state and a Jewish state - and the ensuing war they started in the hope of destroying Israel. Many Palestinian Arabs who lived in areas where the fighting took place abandoned their homes, either at the request of Arab leaders, or due to fear of the fighting and the uncertainty of living under Jewish rule. A refugee problem would never have been created had this war not been forced upon Israel by the Arab countries and the local Palestinian leadership.
Sadly, during this period there were innumerable refugees fleeing wars and conflict in many parts of the world. Almost all of these were resettled and their lives rehabilitated. The sole exception remains the Palestinians, deliberately kept as refugees for political aims.

The fate of the Palestinian refugees stands in sharp contrast to that of the many Jews who were forced to flee Arab countries in the wake of the establishment of Israel, leaving behind a great deal of property. Despite the difficulties, the hundreds of thousands of Jewish refugees were absorbed as citizens of the State of Israel.

The Arab countries, with the sole exception of Jordan, have perpetuated the refugee problem. The refugees continue to live in crowded camps, in poverty and despair. Few attempts have been made to integrate them into the numerous Arab countries in the region. These refugees, their children, grandchildren and great-grandchildren remain today in a number of Arab countries with no political, economic or social rights.

It's a very complicated and sad situation for everyone. I pray daily that
we will have a world of peace that respect everyone's faith and nationality.

2: Humanitarian aid, Here is a story did not make the front page news:
and I hope aid is now getting through:

December 31 2008:
Israel with the humanitarian effort in coordination with the international organizations, Palestinian Authority and various donors. Ninety three trucks, with approximately 2500 tons of humanitarian aid, medical supplies and medication were conveyed through Kerem Shalom cargo terminal. The World Food Programme has informed Israel that they will not be resuming shipment of food commodities in to Gaza due to the fact that their warehouses are at full capacity and will last for approximately two weeks.

Since the beginning of operation "Cast Lead" some 6500 tons of aid have been transferred at the request of the international organizations, the Palestinian Authority and various governments. Preparations are underway to facilitate further shipments expected to arrive in the coming days.

[Pam]

Because the Jews think they're the chosen people, and that's the land God chose for them?

Pick up a Bible and look in the Old Testament (Deuteronomy 7:6) you will see these words:"For you are a people holy to the Lord your God. The Lord your God has chosen you out of all the peoples on the face of the earth to be his people, his treasured possession."

God chose this people to bring forth his Son, through Mary and out of the lineage of David so that we, who are Christians, share a part in the history of this people.

This conflict has been going on longer than what is suggested in previous posts. It all started when Abraham and Sarah did not wait for "the promise" who was to be Isaac. Instead they enlisted the "aid" of Sarah's hand maiden, Hagar, to help Abraham conceive a child. They named this son Ishmael and he was the ancestor of the northern Arab people.

[caseysmom]

Pick up a Bible and look in the Old Testament (Deuteronomy 7:6) you will see these words:"For you are a people holy to the Lord your God. The Lord your God has chosen you out of all the peoples on the face of the earth to be his people, his treasured possession."

God chose this people to bring forth his Son, through Mary and out of the lineage of David so that we, who are Christians, share a part in the history of this people.

This conflict has been going on longer than what is suggested in previous posts. It all started when Abraham and Sarah did not wait for "the promise" who was to be Isaac. Instead they enlisted the "aid" of Sarah's hand maiden, Hagar, to help Abraham conceive a child. They named this son Ishmael and he was the ancestor of the northern Arab people.

I doubt the Palestinians believe in the Bible, this will not help them feel much better I am guessing.

No offense to anyone but this is why I can't stand religion.

[jennielynn1970]

The Muslims, in general, believe in the three books. The Torah, the Bible, and the Qur'an. They are all holy books. They are all about God. If you read a translation of the Qur'an, you will see that it's a lot of the same "stories" as are in the Bible as well. I have a copy of the Qur'an in translation (although it's not considered the Qur'an because it is in translation), and I have read parts of it.

Yes, many things are different. Jesus was considered a prophet, not the son of God. That's considered blasphemy to them. God is perfect. The rest of us, are not.

[Twisterdog]

I doubt the Palestinians believe in the Bible, this will not help them feel much better I am guessing.

No offense to anyone but this is why I can't stand religion.

I agree. Organized religion in and of itself is the root of this problem, and a good portion of all conflicts since the dawn of time.

Christians quote the Bible, and use it for justification for anything they want to do. Muslims quote the Qur'an for the same reasons, ditto the Jews and the Torah. It's all absurd, IMO. NO religion is the "right" religion, and no people are the "chosen ones" above all others. I think "God" probably is completely disgusted by all the cruel, evil, close-minded, petty things that have been done "in His name" over the years.

If you are a Christian, I will say with 99.99% certainty that you are a Christian not because you researched all the world's religions and chose the one you personally believe in ... but because your parents were Christian. And your parents were Christian because their parents were, etc. Christians are Christians, Jews are Jews, Muslims are Muslims, Hindus are Hindus, etc. not because of an informed, spiritual choice ... but because of an accident of birth. If one of you American Christians had happened to be born in Pakistan instead of Ohio ... I assure you that you would be Muslim today, and think that Islam was the "right" religion and Christianity was the "wrong" religion. A geographic roll of the dice made people the religion they are, not being "chosen".

To me, there is nothing more hyprocritical than killing another human being in the name of your "loving God" ... any "God", whatever your religion dictates that you call him. And EVERY major religion does it.

I saw a bumper sticker once that said, "My invisible god can beat up your invisible god." Touche.

[Twisterdog]

Almost of the strife you hear of now goes back to when the Jews were "given" the country of Palestine by after WWII. This is land they say they were promised in the Bible/Torah. However, there were people already living in that area, all over that area, and that area was called Palestine.

Instead of finding an area where they wouldn't be moving people out of their homes, it was decided to take all of the Palestinians and move them into a designated area, put them in refugee camps and basically remove all of their human rights. Much like what the Nazis did to the Jews.

Maybe it's just me, but how does what the Jews went through give them the right to do the same thing to another people?? I never understood that. It may have said in the Bible/Torah that you were supposed to be promised a certain land, but if someone else is already there, technically it's already taken, you can't just move them. At least I don't think you should be able to.

Why make others suffer because they had suffered??

I agree completely.