Oprah to investigate abuse at puppy mills REAIR May 29

[lizbud]

Usda's puppymill guidelines...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4r-FcXAXcE


I feel horribly for all the millions of dogs who are euthanized in shelters and until this problem is solved I think all breeders reputable or not should cut back on their breeding...

I wish more people would become knowledgeable about the USDA.
How the puppy mills are allowed to barely meet minumum requirements
and continue to do" business as usual". The USDA requirements are deeply
flawed & we need to change & update these Federal Laws.

I think the AKC has a moral obligation to speak up for all dogs & lobby
for improved animal regulation. The Breeders who support & promote the
group should want to improve the treatment of animals.

[K9soul]

The logic used in the argument that for every puppy/dog bought, one is killing another, has always amazed me in how far it reaches and is based on assumptions. First it assumes that if the person did not go to a breeder, they would have gone and saved a life from the shelter, which is not necessarily true. Some would rather have a dog whose background they know and who has been bred specifically to a purpose to fit their lifestyle best, and would forgo getting a dog at all if they could not pursue that course.

You could really make reaching assumptions and accusations like that all day long about a great many things, i.e., because I adopted my dogs when they were cute puppies and highly adoptable, I condemned older, less wanted dogs to die. You could even carry it further and further.

Anyone who decides they don't wish to own a dog at all is killing a dog in a shelter.

Anyone who decides they prefer cats or other pet types are killing a dog in a shelter.

Anyone who only rescues one dog when they have the financial ability to take more is killing a dog.

If one goes to a breed rescue or no kill shelter, they are killing a dog in a high kill shelter.

The crux of the problem is not who adopts what and where, but irresponsible breedings: Those who dump litter after litter of unwanted dogs simply because they don't care to spay/neuter their dog. Puppy mills that "farm" dogs for pet shops with no care at all to their conditions, temperament, and proper care, they pour hundreds and thousands of dogs into picture, many with a myriad of health and temperament problems that land them in shelters and often on the euthanasia table. It is those people responsible for all the lives lost and dogs languishing in shelters. It is to them you could truthfully say "you are responsible for the suffering and deaths of dogs in shelters."

[lizbud]

I found a GMA "The Problem With Puppy Mills" on ABC website. It's covers
the same tour by Lisa Ling.

http://abcnews.go.com/video/playerIndex?id=4598865

[DJFyrewolf36]

Just another point, I know of a very good Doberman breeder who donates every penny they make after the vet checks on their dogs to the local shelter and they donate quite a bit to breed rescues and shelters. They don't make a living on breeding, if anything they lose money because they never charge for adopting out a dog as a companion if they test positive for any medical problems. They also do an interview and a home inspection of each canidate for adoption. My dad got a companion doberman from this breeder and not only did the breeder pay for his neuter and initial vet check up he covered any recuring costs for the dogs medical issues. This breeder does this for every dog. Im sure they aren't the only breeder that goes through this much for the well being of their dogs, at least I hope not .
To me, that doesn't sound like a person who is just in it for the money.

[krazyaboutkatz]

In case any one missed Oprah's show on puppy mills here's a link so you can read more about it, see pictures, and watch a few videos Puppy Mill Story On Oprah. Just click on Lisa Ling On Puppy Mills.

[Ginger's Mom]

I did read your post and to say that most shelter dogs are too weak to run and play is crazy.

You didn't read my post, you looked at it and assumed that it said something it didn't. I said that many people find that their shelter dogs are not physically fit enough to run and play. In just this last week I have spoken with three friends about this very issue. One had to have her dog's back operated on for disc problems two months ago, another is taking her dog to a heart specialist for diagnosis and treatment this week, and the third is taking her dog in have his knees and hips operated on this week. The last dog is assumed to have been a product of a puppy mill or some such facility where he was kept in a cage all of the time. All of them are good dogs and worthy of their homes, but not dogs that can perform "jobs." They are good pets, if you only want a pet, by all means go to a shelter. If you are looking for a dog that can perform a "job" there is nothing wrong with going to a reputable breeder to get a dog that has been bred for that purpose.

Honestly I think we need to start breeding more for companion dogs and less for working dogs.

I honestly don't know what this means. I really do not think you were suggesting that we needed to start breeding more for companion dogs and less for working dogs when there are so many suitable companion dogs at shelters. I am sure you must have had something else in mind rather than suggesting that breed standards should be changed or that new breeds should be developed for a situation (companionship) that there are already too many dogs vying for.

Just a hint, if you don't want me to think something is directed at me, don't start your post by quoting me. It's bound to get my attention.

[3muttsandaboston]

Wow i'm sorry. I really don't mean to offend. I will stop posting in this thread because it is a topic that really really gets to me. Yes i Did Mean we need to tone down the working dogs but not change the breed standard. I will end by saying I love dogs all dogs and hate when they are mistreated. I also wish this thread hadn't veered off the topic of puppymills.

[Twisterdog]

Wow, this degraded in an ugly way.

For what it's worth, here is my opinion:

Puppy mills - indeed, the scum of the earth. There is a special place in hell, I hope, for these "people" who torture and neglect animals solely to make money.

BYB's - some of them are in the exact same league as a puppy mill, only on a smaller scale. They are simply breeding one or two dogs to death, instead of a thousand. There's room in the inner circle of hell for them, too. Some people who want Fluffy to have babies aren't necesarily evil, just ignorant and misinformed. However, they should NOT be breeding. And the only way to stop them from breeding is if everyone stops buying from them.

Reputable breeders - obviously doing a good and responsible job at what they do. SOMEone has to continue making purebred dogs. These are the ONLY folks who should be doing it.

Shelters/rescues - IMO, the far-and-away best choice for 99% of the dog owning population.

In a perfect world, there would be no such thing as puppy mills, BYBs, shelters or rescues. Everyone who wanted a dog would pre-order one from the reputable breeder of his/her choice, and there would exactly the right number of dogs for homes in the world. But, obviously, we are a LONG way from that. So, to start us down the road to that place, we all must NEVER buy from a puppy mill, pet store or BYB and we must ALWAYS adopt whenever possible.

My personal opinion on adopting a rescue/shelter dog vs. buying from a reputable breeder: Neither is a "bad" choice. However ... if you love goldens or bulldogs or schnauzers, great! I happen to love several purebreds, too. But why not adopt one from a shelter or breed rescue as opposed to buying one from a breeder? Unless you are planning on showing or breeding ... why do you have to have a dog from a breeder with papers? I've never understood this.

I currently have four purebred dogs, two with papers. I didn't get any of them from breeders. They were all rescues. I'm not going to breed or show them, so why would I not adopt/rescue one and save its life? In the years I have been rescuing dogs, I have had easily over a hundred purebred dogs who came into my home as rescues and found forever homes. I have worked with thousands more at shelters. And, with the popularity of the internet, petfinder.com and other sites, it is SO easy to find exactly the breed you are looking for in a matter of minutes.

There is NO health guarantee on ANY dog. I bought my boyfriend (now my husband) a purebred English bulldog for his birthday when we were dating. Not something I would have done for myself, but it was important to him. I did a LOT of research on breeders and the breed. I found the best breeder I could find. He was without a doubt a very reputable breeder, who did every possible health, genetic and soundness check on his dogs. Sadly, it didn't matter - Rosie died before her second birthday. I could have very likely found an EBD on petfinder.com that would have lived to be ten years old. To imply that every dog from a reputable breeders is healthy, and every dog from a shelter has issues is simply ridiculous.

[3muttsandaboston]

Wow, this degraded in an ugly way.

For what it's worth, here is my opinion:

Puppy mills - indeed, the scum of the earth. There is a special place in hell, I hope, for these "people" who torture and neglect animals solely to make money.

BYB's - some of them are in the exact same league as a puppy mill, only on a smaller scale. They are simply breeding one or two dogs to death, instead of a thousand. There's room in the inner circle of hell for them, too. Some people who want Fluffy to have babies aren't necesarily evil, just ignorant and misinformed. However, they should NOT be breeding. And the only way to stop them from breeding is if everyone stops buying from them.

Reputable breeders - obviously doing a good and responsible job at what they do. SOMEone has to continue making purebred dogs. These are the ONLY folks who should be doing it.

Shelters/rescues - IMO, the far-and-away best choice for 99% of the dog owning population.

In a perfect world, there would be no such thing as puppy mills, BYBs, shelters or rescues. Everyone who wanted a dog would pre-order one from the reputable breeder of his/her choice, and there would exactly the right number of dogs for homes in the world. But, obviously, we are a LONG way from that. So, to start us down the road to that place, we all must NEVER buy from a puppy mill, pet store or BYB and we must ALWAYS adopt whenever possible.

My personal opinion on adopting a rescue/shelter dog vs. buying from a reputable breeder: Neither is a "bad" choice. However ... if you love goldens or bulldogs or schnauzers, great! I happen to love several purebreds, too. But why not adopt one from a shelter or breed rescue as opposed to buying one from a breeder? Unless you are planning on showing or breeding ... why do you have to have a dog from a breeder with papers? I've never understood this.

I currently have four purebred dogs, two with papers. I didn't get any of them from breeders. They were all rescues. I'm not going to breed or show them, so why would I not adopt/rescue one and save its life? In the years I have been rescuing dogs, I have had easily over a hundred purebred dogs who came into my home as rescues and found forever homes. I have worked with thousands more at shelters. And, with the popularity of the internet, petfinder.com and other sites, it is SO easy to find exactly the breed you are looking for in a matter of minutes.

There is NO health guarantee on ANY dog. I bought my boyfriend (now my husband) a purebred English bulldog for his birthday when we were dating. Not something I would have done for myself, but it was important to him. I did a LOT of research on breeders and the breed. I found the best breeder I could find. He was without a doubt a very reputable breeder, who did every possible health, genetic and soundness check on his dogs. Sadly, it didn't matter - Rosie died before her second birthday. I could have very likely found an EBD on petfinder.com that would have lived to be ten years old. To imply that every dog from a reputable breeders is healthy, and every dog from a shelter has issues is simply ridiculous.

I agree with you 100% on everything you said! I love going to a pound or rescue and meeting dogs of all different shapes and sizes to find the perfect dog for me! My pound has a room or outdoor area you can take them to and play with them and meet them as much as you want.