Oprah to investigate abuse at puppy mills REAIR May 29

[lizbud]

Whoa, little girl, take a deep breath. People buying dogs from breeders that are interested in the health and development of their favored breeds of dog are NOT responsible for pet over population. Irresponsible pet owners who don't get their dogs altered, backyard breeders, and puppy mills are. Even if everyone on here were to get a dog from a shelter every single year, it wouldn't make a dent compared to the dogs that are being irresponsibly bred, either intentionally or unintentionally. Now, I believe your intentions are good, but telling people who are responsible pet owners that they are killing dogs by buying from a reputable breeder is not going to have the effect you want. You need to change your tactics to get people involved in more active regulation of all animal breeders.

Amen to that.

[krazyaboutkatz]

I watched Oprah's show last night and I thought that it was very well done.It sure gave me LES though. I thought that puppymills had to pass certain inspection codes or they would be put out of business. The one's that I've seen on Animal Planet were always shut down due to their horrible conditions. I sure wish that they'd all become illegal.

Hopefully with Oprah's large following, she'll be able to reach a lot people and change their minds about where they go to adopt their future dogs. I know that in the area where I live, there are no pet stores that sell dogs. There are a few petstores that hold dog rescue adoptions though which is much different. The same goes for cats.

When I was much younger I remember going to the mall and going to the petstore and looking at all of the cute puppies. Little did I know that they came from puppymills. I didn't even know what a puppymill was back then. I hope that children can be educated about this so we can hopefully change things for the better.

I was also glad that Oprah said that buying puppies off of the internet is very bad too. My brother and SIL bought their puppy off of the internet. Even though the breeder was listed as being local, he flew the puppies in from another state. They adopted a Puggle and she became very sick after just a few days with severe kennel cough. My brother tried to talk to the breeder and he didn't even care and he hung up on my brother. He was able to stop payment on the check but they still lost their down payment and had to spend a lot of money on vet bills. Even their vet was horrifed to know that they bought their puppy off of the internet. He said that she most likely came from a puppymill. She recovered and is now doing well. I sure hope that they learned there lesson and that they'll adopt from a shelter or rescue group in the future. The sad thing is that most of their neighbors have also bought their dogs through the internet and even my SIL's sister did this.

[Falconara]

From what I can tell I am with Ginger's Mom - the problem I see with it is people going where Powerlounger just did. That's the extreme in the other direction that I just do *not* agree with. Especially considering many responsable breeders are also active in rescue.

~Cate

[buttercup132]

Also I do not condemn anyone for going to a reputable breeder. I wouldn't go to any breeder for a dog though...I will always go to my local high kill shelter. I feel horribly for all the millions of dogs who are euthanized in shelters and until this problem is solved I think all breeders reputable or not should cut back on their breeding...

Reputable breeders barley breed as it is. Maybe 1-2 litters a year if that. That's why they have such long waiting list.

IMO breeds of dogs were created to serve a purpose. Responsible breeders make sure that thier lines produce dogs that serve that purpose. If everyone got dogs from a shelter and no one bred, what dogs would be used for hunting, hearding ect. Dogs work, and some are better at some jobs than others.

I agree, and if you say you can get a lab or collie from the pound sure but most likley they aren't going to have great breeding lines so they won't have the same hunting or herding instincts as dog bred from working lines.

Firstly, I am stating a simple fact. Breeders provide dogs. So do shelters. People want dogs. And they have that choice as to where to go to get a dog. Go to that breeder, a dog in a shelter dies. But some breeder has a fatter wallet. Deal with it.

That is wrong though. Some people don't want the same dogs, some people want working dogs, some people want show dogs. Reputable breeders don't have a fatter wallet they don't make money off of their puppies if anything they loose money. BYB make the money off their puppies.
I'm pretty sure I have also heard numerous times of shelters that milk people for money.

You may have to actually put effort into it, but they are there.

And you think there is no effort and searching endlessly picking through the ton of byb to find the good one. You think it takes no effort to research this breeder ask other breeders about them takes no effort?

They want a purebred, go to a purebred rescue.

Like I said before, what if they don't adopt out of state/country?
What if you dont have a rescue near you?
What if they dont adopt out to people in apartment,with kids,cats etc?

Ummm can someone say PETA wanna be?

[Moesha]

Ummm can someone say PETA wanna be?

That wasn't really necessary was it? You made your points tactfully. Why add comments to fuel controversy?

[3muttsandaboston]

Puppy mill guidelines are horrindous. According to them the dogs on oprah were not mistreated...

What it means to be a blue ribbon kennel
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qdI2U6dgA8Y

Usda's puppymill guidelines...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4r-FcXAXcE

Also I do not condemn anyone for going to a reputable breeder. I wouldn't go to any breeder for a dog though...I will always go to my local high kill shelter. I feel horribly for all the millions of dogs who are euthanized in shelters and until this problem is solved I think all breeders reputable or not should cut back on their breeding...

[krazyaboutkatz]

Puppy mill guidelines are horrindous. According to them the dogs on oprah were not mistreated...

What it means to be a blue ribbon kennel
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qdI2U6dgA8Y

Usda's puppymill guidelines...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4r-FcXAXcE

Also I do not condemn anyone for going to a reputable breeder. I wouldn't go to any breeder for a dog though...I will always go to my local high kill shelter. I feel horribly for all the millions of dogs who are euthanized in shelters and until this problem is solved I think all breeders reputable or not should cut back on their breeding...

Thanks for posting these links. I just watched them and it's horrible. Now I know why there are so many dogs living in horrible conditions at the puppymills. It's so sad.

[Seravieve]

Also I do not condemn anyone for going to a reputable breeder. I wouldn't go to any breeder for a dog though...I will always go to my local high kill shelter. I feel horribly for all the millions of dogs who are euthanized in shelters and until this problem is solved I think all breeders reputable or not should cut back on their breeding...

I feel the same way. I -personally- wouldnt go to a breeder, and I try to steer people to shelters when theyre looking for a new dog.. but I wouldnt look down on someone because they went to a breeder. A reputable breeder anyways.

I too would rather frequent the local shelters. I love my rescue doggies.

[Giselle]

If you are a reputable breeder, it is your duty to help homeless pets of your devoted breed. That's how I see it.

Most of the breeders I consider 'reputable' are very active in breed rescue and regularly foster/rescue. Their heart dogs are often (would you know it?) mutts from the local shelter.

I didn't catch Oprah's show, but did she talk about the ethics of breeding? i.e. backyard breeding ("I think Fido and Fifi should be bred just once for the kids to witness?")

[ParNone]

Always baffles me as to why rescuers and responsible breeders/owners need to be pitted against each other. We’re on the same side. Responsible breeders are trying to better the breeds. They screen potential buyers and require spay/neuter contracts and take back any dog to ensure their dogs don’t end up in rescue. Responsible breeders/owners are not adding to the problem.

I’ve always felt one of the great things about dogs is that they were bred to perform all kinds of different functions. That they can not only be wonderful companions and family, but are capable to work as partners with man in many endeavors, really sets them apart from other animals. That’s why we have seeing eye dogs and police dogs and herding dogs and search and rescue dogs, etc. and my favorite since I have Smooth Collies, Alzheimer Guide Dogs. They’ve tried different breeds but weren’t successful until they tried a Smooth Collie. They needed a breed with a high spatial sense for the most important “Home” command, which was key to the program for when the Alzheimer patient became confused and lost. For whatever reason, that highly desirable trait seems to be apart of the Collie breed. Do we want to stop purebred breeding and lose these types of things?

Rescuing definitely needs to be supported, but we can’t toss aside one of the things that makes dogs special, the different breeds and their functions, by not supporting responsible breeding too. To witness them going extinct would also be very sad indeed.

Par...

[DJFyrewolf36]

IMO breeds of dogs were created to serve a purpose. Responsible breeders make sure that thier lines produce dogs that serve that purpose. If everyone got dogs from a shelter and no one bred, what dogs would be used for hunting, hearding ect. Dogs work, and some are better at some jobs than others.
Adopting from a shelter is a great idea when looking for a companion animal but very rarely can they perform a specialzed job (there are cases where they have though!
And even if you adopt a shelter dog, you aren't saving all of them. Adopting from a shelter takes the same time, concidration and care as picking a breeder. You have to pick a dog that fits your situation. Blindly rescuing a dog could end up with the dog right back in the shelter, and often this is the case when people don't evaluate why they want a dog.
Responsiblity is the issue here, whether it be in breeding or in shelters. Shutting down breeders isn't going to make people any more responsible. Awareness of the issues are.

Edit: I just said basically the same thing you did, par lol.

[lizbud]

Usda's puppymill guidelines...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4r-FcXAXcE


I feel horribly for all the millions of dogs who are euthanized in shelters and until this problem is solved I think all breeders reputable or not should cut back on their breeding...

I wish more people would become knowledgeable about the USDA.
How the puppy mills are allowed to barely meet minumum requirements
and continue to do" business as usual". The USDA requirements are deeply
flawed & we need to change & update these Federal Laws.

I think the AKC has a moral obligation to speak up for all dogs & lobby
for improved animal regulation. The Breeders who support & promote the
group should want to improve the treatment of animals.

[K9soul]

The logic used in the argument that for every puppy/dog bought, one is killing another, has always amazed me in how far it reaches and is based on assumptions. First it assumes that if the person did not go to a breeder, they would have gone and saved a life from the shelter, which is not necessarily true. Some would rather have a dog whose background they know and who has been bred specifically to a purpose to fit their lifestyle best, and would forgo getting a dog at all if they could not pursue that course.

You could really make reaching assumptions and accusations like that all day long about a great many things, i.e., because I adopted my dogs when they were cute puppies and highly adoptable, I condemned older, less wanted dogs to die. You could even carry it further and further.

Anyone who decides they don't wish to own a dog at all is killing a dog in a shelter.

Anyone who decides they prefer cats or other pet types are killing a dog in a shelter.

Anyone who only rescues one dog when they have the financial ability to take more is killing a dog.

If one goes to a breed rescue or no kill shelter, they are killing a dog in a high kill shelter.

The crux of the problem is not who adopts what and where, but irresponsible breedings: Those who dump litter after litter of unwanted dogs simply because they don't care to spay/neuter their dog. Puppy mills that "farm" dogs for pet shops with no care at all to their conditions, temperament, and proper care, they pour hundreds and thousands of dogs into picture, many with a myriad of health and temperament problems that land them in shelters and often on the euthanasia table. It is those people responsible for all the lives lost and dogs languishing in shelters. It is to them you could truthfully say "you are responsible for the suffering and deaths of dogs in shelters."

[lizbud]

I found a GMA "The Problem With Puppy Mills" on ABC website. It's covers
the same tour by Lisa Ling.

http://abcnews.go.com/video/playerIndex?id=4598865

[DJFyrewolf36]

Just another point, I know of a very good Doberman breeder who donates every penny they make after the vet checks on their dogs to the local shelter and they donate quite a bit to breed rescues and shelters. They don't make a living on breeding, if anything they lose money because they never charge for adopting out a dog as a companion if they test positive for any medical problems. They also do an interview and a home inspection of each canidate for adoption. My dad got a companion doberman from this breeder and not only did the breeder pay for his neuter and initial vet check up he covered any recuring costs for the dogs medical issues. This breeder does this for every dog. Im sure they aren't the only breeder that goes through this much for the well being of their dogs, at least I hope not .
To me, that doesn't sound like a person who is just in it for the money.