nonstop crying at night!

[d_ciao]

i'm at home right now, and she's in her little fenced off area. she's crying even though she can see me. i know she wants out, but we can't really allow it right now. she cries even worse when i go into another room where she can't see me... it seems to be inevitable should i just leave her be? the crying's getting worse as i type.

[boricuajenny5]

I had this fight with my Cockapoo and honestly, she won. I live in a duplex and she was only 2 months old when I got her. I bought her from a run down pet shop who kept her in a crate day and night. I guess this gave her the impression that creates were bad because she never liked it at my house. She cried and cried for hours at a time. I was afraid she would wake up the landlord and I would have to get rid of her. I had the crate by my bed where should could even lick my hand if she needed to know i was there. I took a couple of days off from work just to help her with the crying and spend more time in her crate while I was home but nothing worked. Since she was small (and stayed small) I decided to let her have her way and sleep with me. Its not the best thing to do but it worked for me and I really dont mind since I only have 1 small dog. She sleeps calmly with me every night and doesnt bother any more. She is almost 2 years old now. She does alot better without being caged in when I am gone too which I do not recommend unless you can stay on top of EVERYTHING and make sure there isnt anything around that your puppy could chew. I tried putting a gate in the kitchen doorway but she managed to jump over it then crawl underneath when I put it higher. Maybe its in poodles to crave so much attention?

[Canis-Lupess]

Even if you don't go to her, make sure you don't speak to her or pay her attention when she cries...even from over the other side of the room. Some time should be spent with her in one room and you in another out of sight although not all the time.
If she cries louder, it's obvious that she's having a hard time being left alone at the moment but allowing her to be with you all the time would just make that even worse because there is bound to come times where it is impossible to not leave her on her own...and I can't imagine you wanting that being as she sounds pretty vocal as it is. With full on seperation anxiety, it's not just the noise, it's also the destroying of anything they can get hold of and defecating all over the place...not so much because they need the loo but out of pure stress.

The breeders may have played a part in it if they reared the pups in the house and always had somebody there with them and they were never left in a room on their own. With seperation anxiety, it is usually the presence of people that matter...not other dogs.

When we have had pups or taken one of our own pups from the litter, they've all been pretty good and may only whine a few times whilst they still hear you moving around but then quieten down for the night. My sisters Border collie pup was good like this too. He slept in the kitchen at first and then moved to the outhouse at night but that was partly his own choice....he went out there and wanted to stop so they put his bed in there and now he has a dog flap to get into the garden. Making as much racket as yours doesn't happen with most pups as people often believe.

Still, creating a routine might help. Dogs like routine. If you tire her out during the times she's allowed out of her pen, she'll more likely sleep once she's put away. Pups do need to sleep often so I can't imagine a young pup having the energy to cry non stop 24/7.
If she does ever spend time on her own without making a noise, even if it's only a few seconds, if you're there, go back in and give her plenty of praise and then up the amount of time gradually that she is required to stay silent. This helps reinforce their confidence at being left on their own. They realise you always come back and are happy and rewarding when you do.
Also, don't make too much fuss when you go to leave her. This reinforces the noisey behaviour. A cool departure and a warm return are what it's about.
With dogs that have seperation anxiety, you find it's the opposite...the owner knows the dog hates being left and that they destroy things so they make a lot of fuss, telling the dog to behave or trying to reassure it and then when they return and find another total mess, they get angry at the dog and so it's a warm departure and cool return....this just makes the whole behaviour worse.

[Catty1]

There is an excellent article on dealing with separation anxiety on the Cochrane Humane Society site:

http://www.cochranehumane.ca/html/resources/sepanx.htm

[WELOVESPUPPIES]

I don't believe that putting her in the room with you will increase seperation anxiety. We did what was best for OUR family, he slept, we slept and we built a routine. Play inside/outside from about 6 p.m. until 9:30(on and off of course) with potty breaks and feeding time. Then about 9:30 he settles down into my lap or his own dog bed which is in the same room we are. 10 p.m. all dogs go out to do their business and when we come in he goes straight to his crate and gets in it. Now I do not crate him when I leave the house. I have a very large masterbathroom that I put a puppy safe gate in the doorway of. I move his bed, food/water, toys, potty box etc into the bathroom and put the gate up. He does not cry when this is done and he also does not cry in his crate at night. I work out of the house and have for the past 12 years so all my dogs are around me 24 a day except for weekends when grocery shopping or errands need to be done. We have three dogs and none of them have seperation anxiety and this is how all three of them were brought up. All dogs are different and what works for one household might not work for another. I wish much luck in whatever you try, for you and your baby girl.

[Canis-Lupess]

Well, as CIAO stated, the bedroom is too small and he/she is going back to school in a month. What then?!?!?!?!

Let the pup get used to spending the night with them and then suddenly, they are off back to school and she's left all alone again and totally not used to spending the night alone.

There is no reason why any dog shouldn't be able to get used to spending the night in it's own space.

All the dozens of dogs we've had have never slept with us and they haven't had a problem with that.
Also, it is well known that dogs who are allowed to spend too much time with their owners are more likely to get seperation anxiety. No point in doing something that could cause this and waiting for it to develop and then have to try and reverse it afterwards.

John Fisher used to always ask these questions to owners who's dogs had seperation anxiety:

Does the dog follow you from room to room?
Does it sleep in the bedroom?
Does it try and get into the loo with you?
Does it scratch or cry and howl when doors are accidentally shut on it?
Is it always flopped down at your feet whenever you sit down, usually with one paw over your feet, or does it insist on sitting on your lap?

He asked these questions for a reason. He commented that if the answer to any of these was correct, then he knew it was an over-attached relationship and the dog can't stand to be left on it's own.

He goes on to say: Obviously, if the dog cannot be left in a room on it's own when the owner is in the house, there is no chance of leaving in the house on it's own. Significantly more time should be spent with the dog in one room and the owner in another - starting with periods of time that can be counted in seconds, leading to far longer periods, to the point where the dog can be shut out of the bedroom at night without it causing a problem.

Funny how he commented so much about dogs with seperation anxiety sleeping in the bedroom with their owners.

[lizbud]

I may be wrong here, but it sounds like the pup is in the fenced in area
a lot. Why? Does this only happen at night or the whole day? How would
you describe a typical day for the pup? The pup at 4mos shold be learning
to do it's potty business outside.

[WELOVESPUPPIES]

Well, as CIAO stated, the bedroom is too small and he/she is going back to school in a month. What then?!?!?!?!

Let the pup get used to spending the night with them and then suddenly, they are off back to school and she's left all alone again and totally not used to spending the night alone.

Funny how he commented so much about dogs with seperation anxiety sleeping in the bedroom with their owners.

Understandable if the bedroom is too small, but the pup would only need a small crate, what could it weigh at 4 months 5-6 pounds.

I never got the impression d_ciao was going away to school, just back to school. d_ciao, are you going to college where you are leaving the home?

It is funny how one of the comments was "does your dog follow you room to room" when I have read on several threads on this site and others about people being told to teather their new puppy to them while in the house so they know they are not getting into things and so they know when the pup has to go to the bathroom. That is teaching a dog to follow you throughout the house. So you see there are many methods out there to get your pup to be the dog you want it to be, it just has to work for the family owning the pet. And yes we will sometimes disagree on that method but everyone on this site is entitled to their own opinion on things, that does not make one right and one wrong. What works for one home and their pets may not work for someone else. I am just explaining what WORKED FOR OUR HOUSEHOLD. Does it make it the right thing? Maybe not, but I am not going to sit here and be told that my dogs should not sleep in my room because I am going to create seperation anxiety. Duke has been raised this way since the day he came home(almost seven years ago). All my life our dogs have slept in someones room and we have never experienced a dog with seperation anxiety. Were we just lucky? Maybe. But three out of three here and absolutely no problems.

d-ciao, whatever you chose to do is something that has to work for all of you in your household, puppy included. I know there is a PTer on here, petpsychologist, who always offers good advise and maybe other solutions than what have been brought up here. Good luck.

[d_ciao]

yes, i am going away for school - i live in toronto, but i go to school in waterloo.

with regards to the separation anxiety questions:

Does the dog follow you from room to room? yes, sometimes
Does it sleep in the bedroom? nope
Does it try and get into the loo with you? hmm... not really, she isn't able to
Does it scratch or cry and howl when doors are accidentally shut on it? from what i know, she hasn't scratched on any doors besides the gate that we fence her off with
Is it always flopped down at your feet whenever you sit down, usually with one paw over your feet, or does it insist on sitting on your lap? yes, definitely

she isn't always locked up in her area because we know she needs to be able to run around. at the same time, we're not sure how often we should be keeping her in there during the day aside from sleeping at night.

[Canis-Lupess]

The problem with having a dog spend all of it's time with you and have it follow you all over the house is that when a time comes for it to be left because you can't take it with you or whatever, that dog is much less likely to be able to cope with being left because it simply is not used to it and such dogs are most likely to fret and suffer anxiety when left alone.
We never had any of our pups follow us all over the house and we haven't had any problems from not being able to see them every second of the day. In fact, sometimes dogs will only act in a certain undesirable ways when there are people there for them to get the attention of. I knew somebody who's pups started to delibertaly chew the table just to get attention. Obviously, she didn't do this when they weren't around. When they were, she'd do it just to get a reaction out of them and when they went to tell her off, she'd just move around the other side of the table and carry on doing it....obviously too used to getting too much attention and didn't like it when they took their attention of her for even a second...like when they watched TV or talked on the phone. With my advice, they managed to correct it and she no longer does this.

The reason I disagreed is because having CIAO have the pup sleep in the bedroom with them could just make this problem worse, not better. In many cases it does make the problem worse and I know people who fell for this same thing and it only got worse and I told them why. The only way a dog can be used to spending time alone is if it gets to spend time alone...not constantly under the owners feet or on their lap.
Obviously, if top dog behaviourists like John Fisher and Peter Neville, and these are who most of the behaviourists in the U.S learnt their stuff from, are saying what I am, I'll go by them rather than somebody who says you should give in to the dog and let it sleep in your bedroom with you because it's the easier option in the short term.

CAIO - I don't think there is any set amount of time to have her in her fenced off area. I think the main time would be times when she is naturally tired and needs to rest but I suppose she'll also need to go in there to keep her out of the way when the house needs tidying or maybe when visitors come etc.... If she is really tired and sleeps in there without problem as a result, she'll gradually get used to spending a bit more time in there even when she's awake but always still with plenty of opportunities to be let out and explore, run about and play etc...
As others have stated, provide her with things to do in her fenced off area. Also, instead of her seeing her fenced off area as a prison, teach her to view it as a safe haven. Somewhere she can retire to when she's tired or had enough. Let her still have access to it even when she's free. If she knows it is somewhere thats not just a prison, she'll start to enjoy it more in there. Thats why people often leave crate doors open for dogs to use even when they are allowed to free roam the house and the dogs are encouraged to use it as a bed before they are taught to be closed inside it so they already view it as a haven beforehand.

[d_ciao]

yep, we've already decided that she will not be sleeping upstairs with us. because first of all, she doesn't know how to use the stairs. second of all, she still goes pee at night, so we wouldn't want her to pee all over my room, or in her own doggy bed for that matter.

we have tried putting her in when she appears to be tired - however, as soon as we put her in, she all of a sudden musters up some more energy to stay awake and scratch at the gate, attempt to jump over it, and cry a whole lot - even if she knows we're there.

the gate does have a small pet door that she can fit through. i've taught her to go in and out of it, and she's gone in there occasionally on her own. however, i still think she views it as a place we put her for punishment - which is clearly not what we're trying to convey it as. we leave the pet door open whenever she's free to roam about the house. she's gone in there to drink water and whatnot, since her water bowl is there. her toys are usually in there as well, unless she carries them out herself. her bed is also in there, with puppy pads for potty in an opposite corner.

she peed and pood on the puppy pad earlier today, but when brought out, she made a huge accident on the floor a couple of hours later. i don't think she knows yet to go back to the puppy pad when she needs to go potty. would there be any strategies for this? usually when she has an accident, we carry her in ourselves to tell her to pee on the puppy pad, but should we be letting her enter herself through the pet door, and then telling her?

i'm assuming it wouldn't be a good idea to put her in there directly after she makes an accident on the floor, otherwise she'll begin to associate her fenced off area as an area of punishment. do you think it'd be okay to put her in there after walks? she tends to be really tired after walks, so perhaps putting her in there will help. but she does stay up and begin to cry, so i'm not sure what we can really do with regards to that.

[ilooovecat]

1. Keep the dog in the quietest part of the house. A dog with behavior problems has not earned "the run of the house".

2. Keep curtains and/or shades drawn. If you don't have adequate window coverage, get some; hang a sheet or blanket across the window. A darker environment has a calming effect on most dogs. Additionally, there are no visual stimuli to provoke the territorial or bored dog. Curtains muffle sounds from the outdoor for alarm barkers.

3. Leave a radio or TV on as "white noise." In many households, the stereo/TV/radio is on from morning 'til night as long as someone is home. Imagine how "loud" the silence is when everyone is gone and the sound system is turned off! Beyond masking outside noises, leaving the radio/TV/stereo on gives the aural appearance of your presence.

4. As you leave, give the dog an "only-when-I'm-gone" chew toy with your scent imparted on it. This toy should be something spectacular -- a sterilized beef bone stuffed deeply and thoroughly with canned dog food or cheese spread (served frozen or chilled) or a flavorful beef-basted knotted rawhide bone. Give it to the dog upon leaving; rub it between your palms several times before you go. Not only is this a diversion tactic, it actually makes being left alone not so bad, as this is the only time the "most-wonderful-thing-in-the-world" appears!

BARKING SET-UPS If you have tried all of the above and you are still finding notes from your neighbors, you must desensitize the dog to your departures with "barking set-ups." Set-ups take time; slow incremental progress is a necessary part of the program. Be prepared to use a long weekend or some vacation time before beginning the program.

First, imitate your daily departure routine. Do you usually put on make-up, search about for keys, gloves, etc, pack a gym bag or throw out the garbage. Make the dog think that this is just like any other daily departure.

Second, while giving him his special goodbye toy, get eye contact and tell Jim in a firm and matter-of-fact manner to be quiet until you return. Please, no longwinded emotional scenes; no begging, pleading or whining for him to be quiet. It will only serve to emotionally charge the situation and further stress-out the dog.

Leave -- for a brief period of time. Just a minute or two to start out with. If you normally lock the door with keys, make the right noises, but don't lock it. You must be able to enter quickly if the dog begins to bark; this is not the time to fumble around with your keys. If you wait for an elevator, ring for it and get in. Go one floor down and come back up using the stairs. If the dog has not barked, return and gently praise. If you hear him begin to bark, burst back into the house hollering QUIET! Then turn and leave again.

This time, if the dog barks, punctuate your command for silence with the rattle of a shaker can (empty soda can filled with 15 pennies, fewer for fearful dogs) to startle the dog into silence. Praise the dog when he quiets down and leave again.

The goal, of course, is to be able to stay away for longer and longer periods of time without having to go back in and correct the dog for barking. The time away must be built up in small intervals. Set goals (5, 10, 15 minutes) and go back in and praise the dog if he remained quiet for the set amount of time. Don't wait for an undetermined amount of time and only go in to correct the dog for finally barking. Silence must be praised. Appropriate behavior must be acknowledged.

Most dogs that can remain silent for two hours can usually stay quiet for an 8 to 10 hours work day. It is building up to that first hour or so that may take several days of set-ups to achieve.

For the dog that believes that negative attention from you is better than no attention at all, you will have to intensify your response. When you return, do so quietly, do not shout QUIET, but instead toss the shake can near him (not at him); do it without the dog seeing you take aim. Do not do this with a fearful dog. The dog gets an "environmental" correction for barking, not a correction associated with you (verbal). A throw chain aimed at the dog's rear below the tail can have the same effect, resulting in a startled silence which you then praise.

Barking controlling products can be find here: opentip.com

Barking set ups can be tedious, but they usually work if you take the time to do them properly; barking problems are rarely solved in a day. Let your neighbors know that you are not ignoring their complaints; that you understand their discomfort and you are taking steps to correct the problem. Quite often, they will cut you a little slack if they know that their complaints have not fallen upon deaf ears.

[poodleempire]

I think I may upset a few people round here by my reply...but what the heck!
1.your pup will cry!..she's a baby(duh!) and she has just been seperated from her mum and the life she knew...so regardless if you follow some folks theory and 'crate' her she will still cry until she has settled and feels secure in her new home.
I do not agree with crates/cages unless the 'dig dog' is poorly or a medical condition needs...
Yes our little one sleeps upstairs and I will not defend or justify that choice,it does not make her any less 'rounded' or a 'needy poog' it just means she likes to sleep where the family sleeps.
If this isnt practical for your little one (and for many it isnt)...try getting an old wind up clock and wrap it in her blankets this is used as a substitute for her mom's/siblings heart beat and does act as a calmer.
Another thing to try is a D.A.P (get this from your vet) it is a plug in type air fresher which releases pheromes which again can calm your little one(I have used one in the past)...you cannot smell anything only your 'dig dog' can.
Its a big thing getting a pup and not just for you!...that little one has been taken away from her world,so to shove her in a crate cause she howls (sorry) gives off in my opinion the wrong vibes....
Our 'poogs' or should I say little girl(Jakey passed away in April)..are family members and whilst they do have bounderys they are not any less of a life than anyone else..and should be treated as such.
Yes pups have to be socialised and toilet trained and yes when you go out it is best to leave her in a safe secure area,but that does not automatically mean CRATE...
I hope your little one settles down for you,as I am sure she will,its time and paitence....and your job at the minute is to ease her fears and maybe if you tried the 2 suggestions her bed time might be better for both of you.
Try not to worry...we all (even us who have had a few 'dig dogs') are still learning such is the joy of having a fur baby!