110 year sentence (or 10 for good behavior)

[CathyBogart]

Throwing a temper tantrum is certain to change people's minds.

[Lady's Human]

I get called scum in a post and I'm supposed to remain calm?

Sorry, that will never happen.

[CathyBogart]

Rather than acting like a five year old in public you could have taken it to PMs...

[K9soul]

Rather than acting like a five year old in public you could have taken it to PMs...

Why not tell him that in a PM then? I don't understand when people start in with how people should PM but don't use it themselves. Being publicly condescending is no better either in my opinion.

[wombat2u2004]

Rather than acting like a five year old in public you could have taken it to PMs...

No CB.....I for one find this conversation enlightening, if you don't, then don't clickity click !!!!!
And nobody is acting like a 5 year old.....this is not an issue for children, it is probably one of the biggest issues that face your country at the moment, so lets hear it all.
Wom

[Cinder & Smoke]

I get called scum in a post and I'm supposed to remain calm?

GOSH!

I thought you WERE pretty calm!!

[caseysmom]

Gosh that is just so wrong and disrespectful. I am against the war but I still thank god for all the brave men and women who are in the military. Do you seriously think we would be safe without them?

[Karen]

There are thousands and thousands of people currently serving in the military. Each and every one has made that personal decision to serve our country for his or her own reason. I am sorry you have had bad experiences with "soldires," but stop and think before condemning an entire group of human beings. As others have said, any large group of people - whether you choose to group them by state, city, profession, hair color - each will have good and bad people within it.

What is true of any group is that the "bad people" are the ones who make the news. Let's take teachers, for example. Do you see news stories about the teachers who go to work, day after day, year after year, and work hard to teach first grade, teaching each new group of students the fundamentals that wills erve them the rest of their lives, whether it be reading, learning basic math and colors, or how to get along with others? No, of course not. But let one teacher harm a student, and it makes national news. Same for any demographic. The law-abiding, hard-working people never get press time. Same for soldiers. Same for clergy. Same for police officers - you name it.

[wombat2u2004]

I get called scum in a post and I'm supposed to remain calm?

Sorry, that will never happen.

Take it easy LH, she is obviously one of those people who don't know who has given her the right to free speech and to be able to burn the flag.
There is a country full of them, and there always will be.
Ingrates is the word that is applicable to them.
Wom

[Catty1]

When I read about the sentencing on the news here, I read about this man being eligible for parole in 10 years because of a plea bargain. Of course, that involves a hearing in ten years, and he will not automatically be free.

I understand the last man to be sentenced is in Kentucky. Not sure which soldiers of the 4 charged were supposed to 'benefit' from the plea bargain.

Heck - I was going through old mail today; I had two letters from years ago, both replies from our Federal Government, and one signed by our prime minister at the time.

I didn't get in any trouble for writing those letters - and I know the freedom I have to do that came at a very very high cost.

I have two uncles who made sure of the freedom. They came home...but for our military folks, the war is never really over.

I am totally humbled...no amount of gratitude is sufficient.

[lady_zana]

Take it easy LH, she is obviously one of those people who don't know who has given her the right to free speech and to be able to burn the flag.
There is a country full of them, and there always will be.
Ingrates is the word that is applicable to them.
Wom

Of all the posts on this board, this is the most offensive one...IMO.

You don't know her; don't call her an ingrate.

Who gave her the right to free speech and the ability to burn the flag? The Patriots.....who went to war over having to pay extra taxes. France had a revolution because the people were starving. England had a revolution because their people were starving and out of work. America had a revolution so they wouldn't have to be taxed.

The military doesn't give the right free speech and they aren't the only ones who protect it. The people who USE it also protect it....and she's using to it to voice her opinions and she has this right like everyone else on this board.

"America - love it or leave it." - One of the most Un-American ideas in my opinion. It should be "America - love it or work to change it." We have that right and are very special for it.

Being anti-military might be offending to you. It's her right to be anti-military like it is mine. It's your right to join the military if you want. However, know it is not ONLY military who defends our rights. The peacemakers do as well.

[wombat2u2004]

Of all the posts on this board, this is the most offensive one...IMO.

You don't know her; don't call her an ingrate.

Who gave her the right to free speech and the ability to burn the flag? The Patriots.....who went to war over having to pay extra taxes. France had a revolution because the people were starving. England had a revolution because their people were starving and out of work. America had a revolution so they wouldn't have to be taxed.

The military doesn't give the right free speech and they aren't the only ones who protect it. The people who USE it also protect it....and she's using to it to voice her opinions and she has this right like everyone else on this board.

"America - love it or leave it." - One of the most Un-American ideas in my opinion. It should be "America - love it or work to change it." We have that right and are very special for it.

Being anti-military might be offending to you. It's her right to be anti-military like it is mine. It's your right to join the military if you want. However, know it is not ONLY military who defends our rights. The peacemakers do as well.

A Lady Zana......how could I ingnore this post.
Ingrate = Ungrateful; an ungrateful person. (According to the Westminster dictionary). You think by calling people ingrates is offensive ???? Well, it seems then that the truth may hurt some. But why would someone be offended by being called ungrateful ????? And isn't that just what ID Rescue has indicated here ?????? She has posted her distaste for war and the military....ALL OF IT !!!!!!! How can she not see what the military has done for her in the past ???? And probably in the future ???? Is that not ungrateful ????? Even if it is her opinion ?????? And yours ????
Honey (please excuse the patronising, but I guess it is my right to say whatever I want to), I'm a Vietnam veteran, and I'll tell you exactly what offensive means.....it means being spat at, ridiculed, called a baby killer, and generally shunned by a certain section of society. But I'm not really that offended by what I experienced, simply because I CHOSE to do what I did, just like Lady's Human here did, professional soldiers, doing what WE believe is the right thing for our country. I really don't care what you believe is the right thing, as much as you don't care what I do. But I hold my peace, I don't go bashing anti war activists, in fact in all the time I have been on PT, I have probably never even mentioned war (except for on occasion with Lady's Human when we PM each other about our experiences).
But, you know, I don't really care what ID Rescue said....true....I've been there, and heard that, it just goes in one ear and out of the other for all that it matters to me. But what I do find I'm annoyed about is being told that my post is offensive !!!!! If one takes issue with being called ungrateful because of what they have said about those who ultimately are responsible for her rights and protection, then she deserves to feel offended about that.
And....for the record.....you mention US patriots, the French and English revolutions ????? Ummmmmmmmm.......they ALL actually formed militias, which is certainly akin to an army at the time.....if they never did that, they would have had buckleys chance of winning. So I stand by my statement, that soldiers have given people the right of free speech, and the right to burn the flag, and they try VERY hard to maintain those rights for you.....do not assume that they are just magically available to you....people have fought and died for that privilege you have.

""However, know it is not ONLY military who defends our rights. The peacemakers do as well.""

Really ???? And how long do you think that would be the case without a military ?????

Wom

[lady_zana]

I'm sorry if you are upset, Wom, that I called your post offensive but I feel it was and is.

The peacemakers do support our rights as well as the military. How long would it last without the military? For quite some time. Look at the good works of Martin Luther King, JR. He preached nonviolence and taught his followers not to respond to violence.

I mentioned the revolutions not because of their militias but to point out the reasons we went to war. People believe the American Revolution was fought for freedom such as freedom of speech and religious freedom. It wasn't. It was fought because they didn't want to pay extra taxes to Britain. Is that a good reason to go to war especially when they knew they were moving to a colony which was made to make money for Britain? Probably not. The militia was not fighting for free speech.

I'm sorry that you have been shunned and insulted by many in society. Believe me, I know how horrible that can be. I've seen my friends hurt, wounded, and made into outcasts - not because they were in the military but because they are gay. However, we still believe nonviolence is the best way and will continue to fight our cause through on terms

[sirrahbed]

WOW - both at reading about what these soldiers did and at the anti-soldier comments.

First off - where *I* am coming from....I was born into and grew up in - a military family. My dad served in WWII and in Korea. He retired after 27 years. My only sibling served for 25 years. I married into military, too. Hubby served in Vietnam and the Persian Gulf, then retired after 26 years. We have been civilians for ten years now. Of my three now grown children, one went through ROTC in highschool and through college on scholarship (now civilian) Our one daughter is married to military and her hubby served in Iraq. We still live in a military town near an AF base. So, I tend to be patriotic, supportive of the military, yet I am also a civilian who is concerned about the war.

What I wanted to comment on was the perception and observations of "military folks & soldiers".....

I have always felt that the military soldiers and families we have met and lived with throughout the years were intelligent, honorable, dependable and disciplined. I believe the ratio of scum among the military population is way less than average.


I am disgusted to read about this rape and murder - but do not feel the soldier will get off lightly. Probably worse. This is based on individuals that I have known about who committed any sort of crime and had to be tried in our military system. I have NEVER heard of any crime being minimized - we don't want low-life in our military! The military I know does not tolerate bad behavior.

As a whole, we are among the most committed, law-abiding and respectful people I have ever come in contact with. If new neighbors move to our area - I am happy to learn if they are military. Knowing that someone has served in the military is a plus to me. When I see young men and women while I am out shopping or whatever - they are most likely polite, clean and helpful. If my car breaks down, it is quite likely that it will be someone military who stops to help me. Hubby now teaches at the local highschool and his military dependent students tend to be the most educated and behaved of the bunch. Their parents respond if they are called!

Any scum to the civilian world is scum to those within the military as well.

What sort of experiences have you all had that make you see military as scum???

[crow_noir]

Woah now just a dam* minute! I never once stated my hatred of the military or the war in this thread (or my entire existence on this forum as far as i can remember.) Do NOT say i said things that i didn't.

My point in posting this thread is just how sick some individuals can be. How horrible it was what these humans did, these humans who are SUPPOSED to be making PEACE keeping efforts.

This thread had NOTHING to do with my dislike of this war. IF i had wanted to discuss my dislike of the war i would have STARTED or dug up a thread with a title something to the effect of "This War Blows Chunks Of Beer Vomit"

And you don't know me... I have friends and family in the military. I have never once said anything disrespectful to them about their choices. I have even gone to parades for the soldiers. I have shaken their hands, when i was younger I've saluted them. Do NOT put your interpretation of my *actions* down as if they were my own words!

A Lady Zana......how could I ingnore this post.
Ingrate = Ungrateful; an ungrateful person. (According to the Westminster dictionary). You think by calling people ingrates is offensive ???? Well, it seems then that the truth may hurt some. But why would someone be offended by being called ungrateful ????? And isn't that just what Crow has indicated here ?????? She has posted her distaste for war and the military....ALL OF IT !!!!!!! How can she not see what the military has done for her in the past ???? And probably in the future ???? Is that not ungrateful ????? Even if it is her opinion ?????? And yours ????
Honey (please excuse the patronising, but I guess it is my right to say whatever I want to), I'm a Vietnam veteran, and I'll tell you exactly what offensive means.....it means being spat at, ridiculed, called a baby killer, and generally shunned by a certain section of society. But I'm not really that offended by what I experienced, simply because I CHOSE to do what I did, just like Lady's Human here did, professional soldiers, doing what WE believe is the right thing for our country. I really don't care what you believe is the right thing, as much as you don't care what I do. But I hold my peace, I don't go bashing anti war activists, in fact in all the time I have been on PT, I have probably never even mentioned war (except for on occasion with Lady's Human when we PM each other about our experiences).
But, you know, I don't really care what Crow said....true....I've been there, and heard that, it just goes in one ear and out of the other for all that it matters to me. But what I do find I'm annoyed about is being told that my post is offensive !!!!! If one takes issue with being called ungrateful because of what they have said about those who ultimately are responsible for her rights and protection, then she deserves to feel offended about that.
And....for the record.....you mention US patriots, the French and English revolutions ????? Ummmmmmmmm.......they ALL actually formed militias, which is certainly akin to an army at the time.....if they never did that, they would have had buckleys chance of winning. So I stand by my statement, that soldiers have given people the right of free speech, and the right to burn the flag, and they try VERY hard to maintain those rights for you.....do not assume that they are just magically available to you....people have fought and died for that privilege you have.

""However, know it is not ONLY military who defends our rights. The peacemakers do as well.""

Really ???? And how long do you think that would be the case without a military ?????

Wom