I think Ivy is going back to his breeder or original owner.

[buttercup132]

Before I even begin I am NOT making this to be bashed.
That being said I will explain.

I went to work at the vet on Tuesday and the vet who my boss is very close with was in. She talked to him for over a hour about Ivy and all the test they want to have done on him. She said he has a grd 3 heart murrmor and a possible polyups. He said if it's grade 3 then he need to go to a cardioligist (sp?) and have a bunch of test done there. My boss said for him to say that it means it's serious. He is usually a laid back vet who doesn't b.s and try to con you out of your money.
He said grd 3 is a very serious grd and he needs testing and most likley be on meds all his life. He said the TESTING alone will be $2000 and up he thinks it will be more then the other vet quoted.

Ivy's previous owner finally got back to me last night saying it said he had a grade 1 suspected on his medical sheets. And continued to say he doesnt have chlymidia and poylups. Which still obvioulsy means she hasn't brought him tothe vet since she got him. When I contacted her I asked her a ton of times if he was perfectly healthy and even my mom e mailed her and she said the same thing.
Well she e mailed me again last night saying she will take him back and refund my money.

Everyone who knows the situation is telling me to give him back.
I know I even use the quote "If you can't afford the vet you can't afford the pet". BUT I obvioulsy wouldn't have taken him knowing he had these problems. I expected to be getting a young cat who had a clean bill of health. I know things do come up when you have animals but it's not like I've had him for years and all of a sudden he has this. He was sold to me with the sickness and without me knowing.
I don't know what to do right now.
I'm 17 and only have a part time job and I have to pay for all the bills.
I am also going to contact the breeder of him and see what she says and see if maybe she would like to take him back because she did want him back in the first place.

[Catty1]

I'd talk to the breeder.

I wonder if the breeder or the owner would treat him for his conditions?

Otherwise...I wonder if there is someone, either on PT or elsewhere, that would be willing to take him on.

[Pawla]

Oh, Buttercup, I'm so sorry! I just love your boys. I know this is an awful situation for you. Just know that you, and Ivy are in my thoughts, and prayers.

[wolflady]

That's strange, because my heart cat Marius has a grade 3 heart murmur, and my vet indicated that it's really nothing to worry about at this point. Marius never had a heart murmur before, so having it appear suddenly (about 3 years ago now) was alarming. They did an ultrasound on him and discovered a grade 3. He doesn't require meds at this point, but I do have to keep a close eye to see if any of his behavior changes. My vet told me that as long as he's acting normal, that there's nothing to worry about. I'll just have to bring him in once a year or so to make sure it's not advancing. That was 3 years ago, and he's still consistent, which is good.
I would ask for a second opinion? How is Ivy acting? Is he behaving differently/more lethargic? It seems to me that they're treating this grade 3 as a grade 5 or 6, but maybe they use a different scale?

Regarding what to do with him if this really becomes serious, it probably would be in his best interest to go back to the breeder. Good luck and let us know what happens!

[buttercup132]

WolfLady going to the vet I work at was my second opinion. I had already taken him to a vet which is how I discovered he had the grd 3. They mark it on a scale of up to 6.
After hearing you say that your vet said it was nothing to worry about it makes me think if I gave him back it would be for no reason and that I would be wrong.
How he acts is kind of weird he has this odd routine it seems. One day he will just sleep all day and not move from that spot all day, not even to eat or drink and usually the next day he is more active (active as in walking around the house and eating/drinking). Sometimes though he stays sleeping for 2 days.

The only thing I'd worry about with sending him back to his breeder is that he would have to fly and he's not UTD in shots because of his stupid previous owner. I wouldn't want to put more stress on him with his heart because with high murrmors they can have heart attacks more easily.

[kuhio98]

What is an OG?

Pepper has a SIX heart murmur. No medication will help. She is going strong 4 years after we adopted her. She's never been sick a day in her life -- except as a reaction to her vaccinations.

[buttercup132]

What is an OG?

Pepper has a SIX heart murmur. No medication will help. She is going strong 4 years after we adopted her. She's never been sick a day in her life -- except as a reaction to her vaccinations.

The Original owner I don't know why I put OG it doesn't make much sense.
What did your vet say to do about Pepper's murrmor?
Ivy also has problems breathing and coughs alot because of it. There are different things that can be wrong with the heart with each grade. Some can be a lower grade but still be bad.

[kuhio98]

What did your vet say to do about Pepper's murrmor?
Ivy also has problems breathing and coughs alot because of it. There are different things that can be wrong with the heart with each grade. Some can be a lower grade but still be bad.

Back in 2002, the vet listened to her heart. He shook his head. Said it was the worst heart murmur he had ever heard. On the scale of 1 to 6, it is a 6. No medication will help. No treatment -- they don't do kitty heart transplants. He told us to just take her home and love her. That she might not have a long life, but she could have a good life.

Pepper is only 6 pounds. The vet said her small size is easier on her heart. Pepper runs and plays but takes frequent naps (don't all cats?) She is like a little kid. You know how they play, play, play and then collapse and sleep deeply? You can see that she breathes very rapidly but she's never had problems breathing. She doesn't cough at all.

It sounds like she's been very lucky so far. Even though it is a bad murmur, she doesn't have the symptoms that Ivy has.

[carole]

What a dilemma for you, I really donot envey your decision making ahead of you, only you and you alone can make the call, and i am sure you will do what is best for Ivy and you.

My older cat Ash has a heart murmur, i am not sure of the grade, but it is considered low, and he is fine, he sleeps more and tends to sneeze a lot,and has a few unwell days, but we are not sure if that is due to the problem or not, in general he is a healthy old boy for his age,despite the usual age related problems.

Good luck and i hope all works out well for you.

[jenluckenbach]

Gee, I don't know what to say except to agree with WolfLady. Both Willow AND Fern have a grade 3 heart murmur and have NEVER been on any medication nor ever had any tests. I am just to watch for signs such as labored breathing etc. But they have never been sick in their lives (Fern is 11 and Willow is 7).

[buttercup132]

See that's the thing though. Some of you are saying your cats have them but don't show any signs. Ivy dose, I even posted a video of what he sounds like. He has troubles breathing and he coughs alot.

[Catty1]

Okay, just remind me - is the vet sure that the coughing and breathing problems are because of the murmur?

[Freedom]

If you haven't already, I think you should speak with the breeder.

Do you know if the breeder has a website?

I ask because I found this contract on line from ONE sphynx breeder. http://www.doggydayscatnapacres.com/sphynxcontract.html It specifically states that no kitten will be sold with even a slight heart murmur. So if nothing else, the breeder will want to KNOW that one kitten in one litter developed such a condition.

The breeder may actually have some suggestions which none of us will; depending upon how much experience the breeder has.

I do think you are right to return to the cat to one of them and get your money back. This cat is currently not only with a heart murmur but also with many symptoms. This should have been disclosed to you before you even put down a deposit!

What a difficult situation.

[buttercup132]

They are pretty positive. They can't know for sure unless there are test done. They think he could have too much fluids in his heart which would be shown on a ultrasound and he would have to be on meds for life to keep that under control.
They thought maybe a poylups but the other vet didn't see anything and the second vet said he highly doubts it a poylups.
He went on antibiotics for a URI because she said it could be that but it's also unlikley and they didn't help him.

Do you guys think I should just leave him then and say no to all these test? I was thinking about that the other day but then again he does cough and have trouble breathing so maybe that wouldn't be a good idea.

EDIT: Sorry Freedom I never saw your post .
Yes the breeder has a site. I don't think she breeds anymore and if so not often at all because she is into rescuing now.
http://www.defuzzld.com/
I have emailed her I said almost exactly what I said on here (just different wording because I can't copy paste) and asked her what she thinks I should do. I also told her I have been advised by a few people (which means the people on PT and my family and boss) to contact her and see if she will take him back.

The thing I am scared of with giving Ivy back to the person I got him from is I don't think she will give him the proper vet care (being as she failed to before) or that she will re sell him to someone and not say he has a heart murrmor again and then they obvioulsy too will not give him the care he needs or they will go to the vet and find out the same thing I did.

When the breeder replies to my e mail I will ask her if she has a copy of the contract she is always helpful like that and always offers to give me previous vet papers she has and she offered to give me another copy of his pedigree papers (if the very very original owner even signed a contract). I also don't know if it would apply to me because I'm not the person who bought him and signed the contract.

I Probably Would Return Ivy And Buy A Healthy Cat.

That's what my boss said. But I don't know if thats right..I don't know if I would even want another one after Ivy. In all honesty I got him because he had be up for sale in the classified ads for so long and I felt bad for him or else I don't think I would have got another cat. But I'm also worried about Duck if Ivy dose go. I don't know if another cat for him to bond to would be better for him or not.
Either way if I did sent Ivy back and decided I want another one it wouldn't be for a long time. I'd like to do it properly this time and go through a good breeder who has a good contract.

[catmandu]

We Are Certainly Not Going To Pass Judgement As I Do Not Know What I Would Do If I Had A Cat Whoses Tests Would Start At 2000 Especially If I Was Starting Out.
I Probably Would Return Ivy And Buy A Healthy Cat.
We Are Praying That That Sweet Dear Little Cat Will Be All Right And Our Prayers Go Out To You.