Question about trusting your dog to run free for exercise ...

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Your dog is not a candidate for going off lead. And, as Applesmom said, NO dogs should be allowed off lead in an urban environment. I teach my students that only hunting dogs should be allowed off lead AFTEr much training and a 100 % reliable recall and then only in a hunting environment (the country).

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I have to disagree with this... with some basic recall training Kenny could be just fine. No dog is going to have a 100% recall, they are dogs after all. Things must be a bit different here as most dogs are allowed to run off lead at parks (Un fenced, but council permits them to be offlead).

A drag line is a great idea.. Tinny wears one when we go hiking out bush in the middle of no where.. she has a fondness for hunting and getting lost ;). Goodluck with your training Kim, i would love to know how you get on & have fun Kenny.

Kiara is only ever left off lead when we are at the beach. And even then, I often put her on the lead because I get paranoid.

Kiara has one of the best recalls I've ever known in a dog. She rarely wanders from myself or someone in my family. She has no prey drive, little to no interest in other dogs or animals, and couldn't care less about other people unless they are throwing a frisbee or tennis ball.

However, she still ran off one day because she was spooked. She will never be allowed off leash in a neighborhood again.

I often put her on a 30ft leash and allow her to run with that in our front yard. If her recall doesn't work I can easily run atleast 30ft behind her stepping on her leash.

I trusted her but after her missing for 5 days, that trust has been broken, and I will not trust any of my other dogs off leash in a urban area again.

Shaianne my greyhound who all but one time - the only time she was "loose" was an accident! I took her to a ball diamond once but was so nervous that even tho it was enclosed I stayed right behind her the entire time and she never even knew she was offleash!
Keegan on the other hand is usually pretty good unless a neighbor is out and she goes visiting. My parents call her the neighborhood PR person.
At their house they have 3 acres so she is rarely on the leash at their house. If we are taking a walk - she is on leash.
At my parents cottage - if we walk I have her leashed - now my dad can take her for a walk down the road and have her off leash and you couldn't tell it - she stays right by him and listens. She knows she has too. Me - PUSHOVER - ehh not so much. So I don't chance it - when we take walks unless its in the middle of a trail or woods - she is leashed.
I would try some of the local schools or parks if they have baseball diamonds fenced in - just make sure you clean up after him to be a good "neighbor". :)
Does Kenny like to retrieve? that is another incentive - if we go walking at the resevoir I usually keep a couple balls with me b/c she just LOVES tennis balls and keeps focused on them so she doesn't go far. I've even take them to the vet before!
Also Keegan is 5 years old but with her bilateral hip dysplasia - she doesn't run off much anymore **((knocks on wood))** b/c after awhile her hips get tired and she lays down.-
having a big dog is so much fun. I mean you can do all of this with a little dog but romping in a field isn't the same. :) And the only reason I say this is b/c my neighbor is an avid hunter and they have a 10 pound shih tzu and he has tried taking her with him before just to check his stands and she can't jump over the fences or gets stuck in the weeds - and her hair is so long then he has to spend an hour brushing the cockleburrs out of her coat when they get home (or catch h-e-double hockey sticks from "mommy" ;)). Zoe the shih tzu LOVES to go with daddy but he has to pick her up and carry her half the time. :)
good luck and have fun

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Originally Posted by Freedom

We don't have a dog park here in my city. BUT . . . thanks to the jerks who don't pick up after their dogs, city council passed a local ordinance that dogs are NOT permitted in the parks.

So yu may want to check or at least keep it in mind if you don't know for sure that dogs are OK in the park you are heading out to.

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We have a park right behind our house. It is dog friendly, but they MUST be leashed at all times. Yeah, well we don't always abide by the rules. :p
Zoee is pretty good about staying close to us, and if she chases a squirrel it usually runs up a tree or fence so she doesn't go far. And we stay at the back of the park, away from the road. And I have to leash her when another dog comes around anyway.

Good luck Kim with Kenny! :D

My guys can haul you know what in a run- see dog general post 3 Borzois in the snow first video to show you how fast- ..

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Originally Posted by borzoimom

My guys can haul you know what in a run- see dog general post 3 Borzois in the snow first video to show you how fast- ..

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:)
reminds me of my greyhound - my dad always said she was beautiful when she runs as long as she was RUNNING TOWARD you and not AWAY from you! which didn't happen very often.
ahhh the stories I could tell in the 2 short years I had her....

We trained Star to come when called with a long rope, as described in above posts. We were concerned that she learned to stay away from the fence in our old house, it was only 4'. She has pretty good recall for a husky, but we would still never try leaving her off leash except in the backyard with us standing there. I have to keep an eye on Sherman at all times - he's escaped from the back of my car twice when I've unclipped his leash - jumped right back out & ran off at the park once, and once in the parking lot of petsupplies plus - nearly gave me a heart attack with all the traffic!
Just keep working with Kenny, try him in fenced areas, but I would always be careful in public places - you never know what might catch his attention and he's off ina flash.
*for the pulling, try a Gentle Leader head collar, they work great.

honestly there are VERY FEW dogs that I would consider 100% reliable off leash. there are plenty of dogs who are close to it, but in my opinion if you cant call your dog off a squirrel, or away from another dog, it has to stay leashed- PERIOD (unless in a dog park). I worked for over a year with Alki before I would let her off leash, and even then I can only do it in certain places, and at certain times. I know there are times when she is in a certain mood and is not going to reliably come to me from a dog.

when I lived in the city more, I took my dogs to the big park across the street often, one leashed & one not. this park was not an offleash dog area but most people let their dogs off leash there anyway, and *most* were good. but there were plenty of times when other dogs whose owners were clueless, came up to my dogs- who are NOT friendly with other dogs when onleash or playing fetch, and Ive had to literally yell to owners yards away, to call their dogs! to people like myself that have dogs who arent always dog friendly, its really stressful and annoying to have an unleashed dog rush up to your leashed (or 100% under voice control) dogs. so anyway, thats just my little pet peeve/rant! ;)

that said! I agree with everyone else- get a long nylon leash, they sell them from 20-50 feet at most petstores. you could also get a flexi since they you wont have leash dragging around to trip on. but even with long leashes, only use it in pretty unpopulated places, and after youve worked up to a pretty decent recall, because a non-friendly person or dog could come within your long-line's reach. (AWESOME article on training a reliable recall: http://pets.aol.com/articles/petfind...12102509990003 written by a top person in the animal learning theory world of dog training)

as for the pulling- buy this: http://www.premier.com/pages.cfm?id=74 or this: http://www.premier.com/pages.cfm?id=17

They are humane (unlike prong & choke collars), and they WORK instantly. You can find them at petsmart & I believe petco as well, and most other pet stores I imagine.

GOOD LUCK! :)

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Originally Posted by applesmom

Always bear in mind, there are some breeds, and some dogs that no matter how well behaved or well trained should never be allowed off leash in an urban environment.

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When I join new forums the first thing people usually do is harp on me for letting a grey off leash. :( :mad:

So that people don't harp on me here either. Yes, she is a grey, but I trust her recall completly. I have called her off hot pursuit of a rabbit before.

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Originally Posted by GreyhoundGirl

When I join new forums the first thing people usually do is harp on me for letting a grey off leash. :( :mad:

So that people don't harp on me here either. Yes, she is a grey, but I trust her recall completly. I have called her off hot pursuit of a rabbit before.

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WOW MICHELLE!!! :eek: THAT IS QUITE A FEAT! No way would mine do that one!! VERY VERY VERY GOOD!!!! :D

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Originally Posted by critter crazy

My Duke cannot be trusted to be off lead. Being half bloodhound, once his nose catches a scent, he is gone, no matter what!:rolleyes:

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Same problem, my beagles normally have excellent recall, but once a scent catches their attention, they go deaf :rolleyes: .

As for my big mix, she's got even better recall, but I think if coming back to us meant leaving 'her' beagles wandering alone, she'd stick with the beagles.


That aside, in the areas around here that are rural enough to go off-leash, coyotes, mountain lions, skunks, and rabid wildlife are a concern (rabies is a concern due to aggression, my dogs of course have their rabies shots), so it really isn't an option.

I still work with all of them on recall though, and would strongly encourage you to follow some of the recall training suggestions given here. Recall is super-important to try to instill and periodically reinforce, even if you don't plan on using off-leash. Accidents happen, and it could be a life-saver.

I teach grass barriers, I start with a long lead or a flexi and play loads of chase games(AKA dog chases ME, never ever ever the other war round) when the dog gets near the edge of the grass I ran away bouncing and calling lik "oh happy day!" lol when the dog comes running(placing front paws ON me) I praise and praise like no tomorow, play tug and such. once the dog has that down at least 99% of the time I start letting the dog off leash for short periods, when apporching the edge of the grass, run away calling and bouncing, when the dog comes a running more praise and games. eventually they figer out that edge of grass mean run back to mom! I have never had issues with this, and I have done this with 3 dogs and it has yet to fail. it was pretty funny how impressed people were when a biker went by on the other side of the street and Misty went galloping and barking right to the edge of the grass and went right into a U-turn back to me as soon as she reached the edge lol

You should look out for off-leash Obedience classes, with an Obedience club. Gonzo has a very solid recall & stay after going through a few months of classes and practicing a lot.

I also don't recommend bringing him off-leash in any unfenced area until you've practiced a lot in fenced areas with distractions, and you're fully confident. I would never let my dogs off-leash near any cars, ever.

Hello

I found this information in one of my dog behaviour books and thought it might come in handy for you to use on your dog.

"Recall
This is probably one of the most difficult problems to overcome because, from the dog's point of view, not coming is more rewarding than coming. If the dog does not obey, the walk is extended, if he does obey, the walk is stopped and he is taken home. Ultimately, the responsibility of keeping the pack together should lie with the pack leader, and if the dog is ignoring the owner's command to return, the owner should look at his relationship with the dog in general.
Whenever An owner complains about his dog's failure to return when called, I usually ask how readily the dog responds in the house or garden. Generally he tells me that he has no trouble, but after he has been in my office for about ten minutes and I ask him to call the dog over to him, it usually takes three or four calls before the dog obeys. I am not suggesting that owners like this have told me a lie about the dog's readiness to respond at home, it is just that it has not created a problem and therefore they have no noticed.
At the end of the day, if the owner has to keep repeating the recall command to the dog in the confines of their own home, they can hardly expect the dog to obey them when they are out in the park with all the added distractions of different smells and other dogs. Obviously, they should first improve their recvall at hime and garden before the dog is allowed off the lead in wide open spaces.
Assuming this has been done, the first few sessions should be carried out in a fairly enclosed area, with the dog trailing a light line. One command only should be given, and if the dog does not emmediately respond, the line should be tugged, not as a correction, only to reinforce the command. It is a good idea to feed the dog only after it has had it's run and, if the dog id only fed once a day, changing to two or three smaller meals. with each portion following his exercise, will increase incentive to return. Failing this, taking a portion of his daily food ration to the park should to the trick.
Once the recall response has been improved, the owner should get into the habit of calling the dog three or four times during each walk. Praise the dog and give a tit-bit or play with a toy and then allow him to run off again. This will overcome the dog's idea that being called back is a prelude to going home."

This might also help you if your dog is particularly stubborn....from the same book.

" There is a method that has been proved to be successful in the past and its effectiveness is thanks to a ruissian scientist called Parlov. You may be aware of the research that he did into conditioned reflexes, but if not, one of the experiments that he conducted was on the dog's salivory rate. he proved that, by rining a bell and then blowing meat powder into the dog's mouth, he could quickly get the dog to salivate when he rang the bell on its own. What has this got to do with the recall?
Simply that a conditioned reflex is something that the dog has no control over; therefore if you teach your dog to salivate when it hears a certain sound, you are more than halfway towards curing your problem. If the dog is salivating, it will need to satisgy the physiological urge that has been triggered off. If you have any juicy tit-bits with you, it's a dumb dog that will run in the opposite direction.
Buy yourself a whistle - any whistle will do providing the dog has not heard that tone before. Whenever you want to, give your dog a tit-bit, and I would arrange that part of his daily food ration is given in the form of tit-bits so that they can be given about a dozen or so times a day. Prior to giving him one, blow the whistle, but do not say anything. Do the same when you feed him the remains of his food. If you continue this regime for a few days, you will notice that the whistle will produce the same results that Parlov achieved.
You can then start to blow the whistle when your dog is in the garden and you are in the house. By the time he comes through the door, he should be well and truly drooling. This unpredictable regime of whistle, salivate, tit-bit/daily food ration should be continued until the recall itself becomes a conditioned reflex. Once you stop the tit-bits, the salivation at the sound of the whistle will quickly extinguish."

Greyt advice by all but I just wanted to add to the whole greyhound thing: most American greyhounds owners are vehemently against letting their dogs off-lead in unfenced areas. We've seen FAR too many cases of lost/hurt/killed dogs. Trust is a very deadly disease. When people say their greys have solid recalls, I invite them to let their dogs lure course, wait 5 seconds (since that it usually one's reaction time), and recall their dogs. I would eat my arm if the dog came back.

On that note, I would also like to add that many English greyhound owners routinely let their dogs off-lead. I assume it's a regional thing. And FWIW, I walk my other dog off lead. It's a matter of training, breed characteristics, and the environment itself.