I give up!

[sirrahved]

I thought I could express my opinions in a non debating way, but everyone wants to attack me, hurt, me, etc. No one wants to hear what I have to say, obviously, so this is THE END (go have your little party now, you raging liberals)

I refuse to maintain that my opinions about things that must have an outcome are merely my speculations. Things are very clear in the bible. In the end there will be one truth. I don't feel I should have to say "Well I think, maybe, himhawhimhaw" I stated what I believe, always with a *my opinion* afterward.

You can think I'm attacking everyone, but look in the mirror! REREAD My posts, and look at yourselves. You're trying to tell me that I'm wrong for saying what I believe, which you are DOING TO ME! But I make you SO angry...

There are many people that I love and respect on this board. There are many more that I do NOT love and respect. So I'm leaving. I hope all of you feel right good for hurting me, for being malicious, and for jumping to conclusions and THINKING you know what I'm saying.

If you would take time to ACTUALLY listen, I believe our pets could be in heaven, or other pets could be in heaven. I have no rage against homosexuals (I have no idea where this thought came from).

I came here because I love my pets, but people have even debated the fact that I care for them at times.

I don't know what you all have against me, but I hope you are all proud of yourselves!

[Kfamr]

Might as well re-subject this post

"Please give me all of the negative attention I wish for."

[Uabassoon]

(go have your little party now, you raging liberals)

I'm proud to be a raging liberal! And while I don't think you have rage against homosexuals I do think you have made some very rude comments. I understand and respect your beliefs, but some of the things you said really offended me.

edit: I want to apologize, after going back and reading your posts I realized you weren't the Harris who made the comments that hurt and offended me.

[dukedogsmom]

Put me in the Liberal class, as well. Especially if liberal means more tolerable.

[popcornbird]

Originally posted by sirrahved
(go have your little party now, you raging liberals)



Oh I am not a raging liberal at all. Not at all..........so that doesn't apply to me. :p I have nothing against you, at all, but I do wish you would realize why your comments upset us all so much. It is not about you, but about what you said, and I quote:


Originally posted by sirrahved
but children have souls and animals don't.


Originally posted by sirrahved
??? It's the truth. You don't have to believe it...

After saying its the truth.......THEN you said you just posted your OPINION. If you posted your *opinion*, that would be fine and well, but you did post that its the truth, which made it seem like you're saying *I'm right, and you are all wrong.* Opinion? Nope......there's a difference in posting your opinion and posting your opinion and saying its the truth.

Perhaps the definition of *soul* is different in your eyes, but I can tell you that I believe in Heaven and Hell, and I believe that human beings will be accountable for their deeds and animals won't be. Our souls, from my beliefs, will be questioned......but the souls of animals will not be questioned. A *soul* from my definition, is our inner self.........or what you can call *ME* or *YOU* or *HIM* or *HER*. For something without a soul, those words won't apply. You don't go up to a tree and refer to it as *YOU* etc. Your body, mind, heart, organs, skin, hair, whatever, is all a part of you, but it isn't YOU. You're soul is YOU........your soul is what keeps your body alive, which without the soul, would be a dead body, and nothing else.

When you look at an animal, they are alive beings. They are born like us, breathe like us, and die like us. When they die, their souls leave their body, just like our's, and in the same way, their body remains, but the soul is gone. Their souls may not be accountable for what they did in this life, as our's are, but they STILL have a soul that was in them during their life in this world, and when they die, their soul leaves them. That is what I, and I think pretty much everyone, sees as a soul. The soul is the individual self in the body, and whether its in the body of a person or an animal, it is still, a soul. Now if you take plants as an example, that would be different, because though they are living things, they do not have a soul. They don't move, don't think, don't have organs, don't have a soul and don't lose a soul from their *body* when they die either. Animals on the otherhand function just like us. I don't believe God will question their souls when they die, but they still have a soul, and though it may not be accountable like our's, it is STILL a soul. That is what I was trying to say.

I have nothing against you, and I want you to know that we all have times on this board when the majority doesn't agree with us. That doesn't mean they have something against you.......it only means they don't agree with your view, so please don't be so offended, as I don't believe anyone meant to offend you. I'm sorry if I said anything that offended you, because I, very honestly, did not mean to hurt your feelings at all. I was just shocked because I have never heard the idea of animals not having a soul in them, in my life.

[CathyBogart]

BYE BYE!!

[guster girl]

It's all good to express an opinion. But, with everyone on this thread always expressing how they believe in the rainbow bridge, and, all of the stories when beloved pets leave us, you HAD to know that the majority of the people here were going to disagree with you. I read all the posts and really didn't see how anything anyone said to you was any more offensive or insulting than things you said. And, I didn't have a problem with what you said, because it is your belief and your opinion. I had a problem with you stating it as the truth, and, as FACT. And, I've read the bible. I believe that it most definitely is NOT clear, cut and dry, reading material. I believe many people interpret the bible differently. I don't see how at 21 years of age, you've already figured out what the bible means, word for word, and, that you can say it's 100% clear. Anyway, I think it's rude to lump everyone into a category such as raging liberals because they have opposing opinions. I wouldn't label you, and, I don't think it's fair to label others. But, if you're leaving (and, my opinion is that it was a very immature way to say goodbye, I had to check your profile for your age)....farewell.

[Logan]

I have to say that the only post you ever made that stands out in my mind is one comment on a Pet of the Day thread many, many months ago. This forum was never meant for that type of hateful commentary, especially in a section that was to "celebrate" the Pet of the Day. I have never forgotten that. It indicated to me that maybe you weren't too much of an animal lover if you could make such a comment, whether it was true or not. I hope I was wrong. I'm not even going to repeat it here, hoping that it was missed by most of our readers at the time. Today's situation and the way it was originally worded made me wonder about your true feelings about animals again.

I think your mother and your sister are lovely people. I'm sure you are too, but you haven't posted as often, nor as compassionately as they have (not that I have seen, anyway). I'm just surprised that you say your feelings have been hurt today, when it was obvious that others were hurt by your comments too. It's a shame that such a good discussion got so far off track and that so many people were hurt or angered by it. It's just not what Pet Talk has ever been about, at least not for me.

I really, really need to stay out of the Dog House.

Makes me sad.

[PJ's Mom]

Well said, Logan.

Sometimes it's not what we say, but how we say it that can hurt people. :(

[captain]

Sometimes it's not what we say, but how we say it that can hurt people

Those are the words you should take to heart.

I respect other people's opinions, but that does not make mine wrong, incorrect, not worthy, not true, not worth reading ......... and I think there are some other people on the board who need to understand that too!
By all means, have an opinion, but respect everyone else's opinion too.

Logan, I usually stay out of the Dog House too ......... it does make me sad sometimes.

[trayi52]

I guess I find sorrow when anybody talks about leaving Pet Talk. I just can't help it, it bothers me. I may not agree with everything that they have to say, but nevertheless I still hate to see anybody leave.

I miss Micki so bad I can't describe to you the feelings I had when she left. I don't know what her reason was, but it really bothered me.

I just feel very sad.

[shais_mom]

I have apparently missed what happened. But I have to echo Logan's thoughts exactly.
If you don't think that animals have soul's then go look into an abused animal and tell me what you see. You will see a broken beaten soul that just wants to love again.
I grew up in Church also and from a pretty religious family but I never ever ever ever remember anyone ever telling me that animals do not have souls. B/c to pull that context out of the Bible and interpret it to your beliefs I don't like it when anyone does it.

[Tonya]

I disagreed with you when I first read your post...I believe animals have souls. But I also personally know that I'd save a human soul over an animal's soul.

I'm not offended by your posts....Everyone has their opinions. I think life is to short to make everyone believe the same thing. Although I don't agree with you, I have no hard feelings. I will be sad to see you leave PT.

I think people are way to judgemental. Like I've said a thousand times, we are all here because we love animals. We don't necessarily believe the same things, but our intentions are good.

[captain]

Originally posted by Kfamr
Might as well re-subject this post

"Please give me all of the negative attention I wish for."

Kay,

THAT was NOT a nice thing to say!
Yes, it is your opinion, but really ...............!

Tonya,

:eek:
I know you speak your mind, but lets not call each other names.

It is sirraved's choice, opinion, whatever ........... let's just leave it!

[Tonya]

I don't care anymore...I'm done with pt too. It is to judgemental for me.

[trayi52]

Tonya, not you too! Please tell me your joking and just pulling my leg.

What would we do without your funny stories, I enjoy them so much. You can make a bad time sound funny. We need that kind of joy in our life, I do anyway. I need that laugh, you are one of my favorite pt'ers.

Willie

[shais_mom]

whoa
NOW I see the what the problem was.
And I have addressed it in that thread but must say that this comment


And if a Christian doesn't believe this, then they aren't interpreting the bible correctly, IMHO

is this most unChristian like and simply not nice opinion I have heard. I have been called a lot of things in my life. But this is the most hurtful.

[Twisterdog]

Oh my. Another whiny, "Waaaah, I'm leaving thread." I really hate these ... from ANYone.

For Pete's sake ... it's an internet bulletin board, people. If you want to quit posting on it, just quit. Just stop posting, and go away. I have NEVER understood the need to announce it to everyone. It's not a job, it's not a marriage ... it doesn't require two weeks notice.

Just MHO.

[ziron]

OMG debating is not attacking Why post your leaving if u can't stand it anymore because u want attention just leave I doubt if anyone would feel so broke up about it so whiney

[Vio&Juni]

Sirrahved, I may not agree with everything you say... I am baptised as a Christian, but I don't believe in God, so, the Bible for me it's not the ultimate truth. Again, I may not agree with something that others say...

Here's a quotation for you that I received last night:
What I must do is all that concerns me, not what the people think… you will always find those who think they know what is your duty better than you know it. It is easy in the world to live after the world’s opinion; it is easy in the solitude to live after our own; but the great man is he who in the midst of the crowd keeps with perfect sweetness the independence of solitude. –Ralph Waldo Emerson

I am sure that you are a kind person, otherwise sirrahbed wouldn't call you daughter-in-love :)

A great person is who knows that his opinion is not the best, is who gives credit to others too. Sometimes, when you want to reply, save it in Word and review it later. If you still want to post it, do it, but try to see how it could affect others. And this is not a piece of advice to you, is to all the others too. All the others, which when seeing a good bye thread NEED to reply with "bye bye" or things like this (this is not a personal attack to wolfchan, it is an observation. I've seen this happening so many times and very often it was the same people).

PEOPLE, BE NICER to each other!

It IS important to have your own opinion! Just not for the sake of it.

Sirrahved, once again (revenons a nos moutons), don't leave. This is a pet lovers forum. Post in the discussions on pets, have fun! What doesn't kill us, makes us stronger. Learn from this situation.

[Cataholic]

Good Lord Almighty! What a HUGE attention getting, pity partying, poor wolf crying, nobody loves me thread!!! What in heck's name were you thinking when you posted this? It isn't enough that you manage to offend many people on the pets aren't in heaven comment, but, then you call us all raging liberals?

Yet, YOU want compassion and understanding? HELLO? Is everything connected? Why not tone down your over the top religious "ain't nobody know the bible like I know the bible" attitude, and practice what you preach to all of us day after day?

Practice your Christianity at home, Devon. Look into the mirror, and tell me what YOU see...I bet is it one sad, angry at the world young lady, searching for happiness. I can't see why else you would be so dern inflammatory.

And, to the Logans and the Willies..(meaning the mature adults that never say mean things, kind of like what I should be), don't say don't be mean, nasty, hateful and evil. This wasn't a random attack...this was in response to a VERY hateful thread, posted by the offender. This was, IMO, a solicited attack.

My language skills are poor- I can only say this in English- SEE YOU NEVER, Good bye.
Johanna

[bluekat]

I really don't come to the dog house much, so I don't really know much about what's going on and what the reason for leaving is.

I agree with Willie though, I do get sad when people leave. I have nothing against any of you. And Tonya- I hope that you're not really planning on leaving for sure.:(

[catlady1945]

I too never understood why people have to announce they are leaving. Just go already. Also if you start a controversial thread on a pet talk forum, you should be ready for the consequences. You can consider other peoples' opinions (maybe they have something valid to say) or just ignore what you don't agree with. What's the big deal about being 'hurt?'

[2kitties]

Johanna, do you think you could get out of my brain for just a few minutes? It's getting a little cramped in here and you know there wasn't much room to begin with! ;)

[Randi]

Originally posted by 2kitties
Johanna, do you think you could get out of my brain for just a few minutes? It's getting a little cramped in here and you know there wasn't much room to begin with! ;)
DITTO!!

[Cataholic]

Look, you two clowns, if I didn't tag along in someone else's head, and use their brain, I wouldn't have anything at all to work with!

:D

[Denyce]

Uhh....ditto here too.

Devon,

The fact that you refuse or can't see how you didn't just express an opinion but instead stated an arrogant and rude "fact" only shows your immaturity, arrogance and lack of empathy. I think you have the potential to add interesting discussions to the board but not until you grow up some and realize that there are many many "truths" out there and yours is not the only one.

Tonya,

I really dislike it when people claim that others are being too judgmental. When someone does so they too are being judgmental....everyone is judgmental. We all do it all the time. What is wrong often is not the judgement but the people who cannot look at any critisicm without being overemotional and overly sensitive and taking everything soooooo personally.

I believe the world would be a boring, bland gray place if there wasn't somewhere to discuss and learn and debate differences of opinions. It only gets ugly when people can't see the debates for what they are and instead have a temper tantrum like a 2 year old in a playground and taking their toys and leaving.


I think there are many great people that post on here....I am often blown away by the thought and intelligence of some posts. Especially from some of the younger members such as Popcornbird. By the same token I am also blown away by some of the immature drama queens on here. I mean...get a life already...grow up and do something really meaningful and contribute to the world in a more positive manner than just trying to get attention.

My....once again....NOT SO HUMBLE OPINION

Denyce

[aly]

It seems like most of the people who leave PT do so calling us judgemental. I have even had that directed at me personally several times from people on here. Never in "real life" have I been accused as such so I am not too worried. However, it does irk me a bit.

We all love animals here. We love every animal. We have some members who are more knowledgable about cats, some about reptiles, some about bunnies, etc etc etc. I'd say 90% of the people who give advice about what they are knowledgable in, do it in a very constructive manner. They care about other animals and want to help others take better care of their own animals.

Does that make them judgemental? Is someone judgemental if they try to educate you about declawing your cat? Is someone judgemental if they give advice on proper bird nutrition? No. It means they care.

As far as the religious debates, most of that even gets discussed in an appropriate manner. Most of us are very respectful and nonjudgemental of other peoples' views. There are a few bad apples, but there always will be, anywhere you go.

Regarding the conversation about animals having souls, if the original opinion was expressed in a less aggressive manner, I'm sure it would have been respected. It was played off as fact and pretty hurtful to us animal crazies.

As I type this, my Shiloh is in my lap. She's making biscuits and gazing into my eyes purring. I try to think of her without a soul .. and well, its just not possible.

Some people complain about how they have to censor themselves on this board. Well, think about it. We have people of all origins, ages, and backgrounds here. Would you go to a public place and start yelling out your opinions without thinking who's feelings you may be hurting? People have to censor themselves in the workplace, at school, with friends, with family, everywhere. It is just part of life that you don't go around flapping your jaw offending people just because you're safely hidden behind a computer monitor.

Remember the Golden Rule : Do unto others as you would have others do unto you.