Who do you blame???

[Soledad]

Here it is.

Seems like lots of people had "unfit" mothers and fathers.

[popcornbird]

YAY! You found it!

Looks like a lot of the previous generation people here were left unattended for like forever when they were little kids. This poor mother already has enough pain to bear than to be held responsible when she has to deal with the worst loss possible for any person to have.

[Logan]

In my opinion, what happened in this particular case could have happened just as easily 30 years ago or more. At no point should a parent ever leave a two year old child, unattended, outdoors. But with no fence, the thought of doing that is even worse!

I used the word "blame" in the question that led off this discussion. I truly wanted to know how folks felt about it, and that's what we've gotten. So please, don't get angry at people "blaming" because it is the question I asked! Some people would blame the humans, and protect the dogs. Some people would blame the neighbor, but not the dogs and not the mother of this child. I feel the "blame" should be distributed among all of adults in this situation, and yes, including the mother of the child.

[Cincy'sMom]

Just becuase I blame the adult humans in the situation does not mean I am saying the mother was unfit or a horrible person. Yes, she made a mistake. But for every decision we make, there is an outcome....cause and effect.

Becuase she left the child alone, the oppertunity was there for this to happen.

Because the dog owner did not properly train or restain her dogs, this happened.

Maybe it still would have happened if the mother had been outside. It doesn't sound like the pack of ten came tearing into her yard and grabbed the child though. At most, maybe one came, and most parents could protect their child from one dog ( obviously it may depend on that dog, but in general)


I think throwing in the thread about years ago is comparing apples to oranges...sure we ran the neighborhood with our friends, and our didn't know exactly where we were...but NOT at 2!!

I'm sorry if I sound harsh or judgmental, but I feel that no one wants to take responsibilty for their own actions anymore. "It's not my fault I killed my parents, they abused me." "It's not my fault I killed those people with my car, I was on drugs and didn't know what I was doing."

I know I am repeating myself, but for every choice we make, their is an outcome. The mother made a choice to leave the child alone and there was a horrible outcome. If hadn't been the dogs, it could have been something else...a kidnapper,a drunk driver, anything. But by leaving that child alone she provdied an an oppertunity for for that to happen.

[mugsy]

Originally posted by Cincy'sMom
I'm sorry if I sound harsh or judgmental, but I feel that no one wants to take responsibilty for their own actions anymore. "It's not my fault I killed my parents, they abused me." "It's not my fault I killed those people with my car, I was on drugs and didn't know what I was doing."

Thank you Amy! This is exactly what is happening. As for this....I blame the mother because she wasn't supervising her daughter, especially when she knew the kid was terrified of dogs. I blame the stupid woman who owns the dog because she keeps Great Danes outside in a pen for God's sake. The only blameless ones are the kid and the dogs and now the dogs are probably going to pay for their stupid owner's choices with their lives.

[clara4457]

I think the frustration (to me at least) is knowing what will eventually happen. The dogs will more than likely be put down, and the owner of the dogs will be slapped with a small fine.

The mother of the child will have to live with her lapse in judgement for the rest of her life. Should she have been more vigilant? Yes, but how many times have you read things like "I only took my eyes off her for a second" or "I thought my husband/wife/boyfriend/friend was watching her" or "I thought she/he was asleep in their bed - I had no idea he/she had wandered into the pool".

Where I put the most blame is on the owner of the dogs. You are right Kfar - Great Danes that are properly raised are gentle giants, but any dog that has not been socialized or has been abused or neglected is capable of serious aggression. We teach our dogs to live in our society, which is a bit foreign to them. If we do not teach them - they will absolutely revert to instinctive behavior and protect what little they posses, even if it is a 4X4 patch of yard.

Actually I would like to correct myself - I also blame our lawmakers for letting people mistreat or neglect animals and doing very little to prevent it. How many more children will have to be hurt and how many more studies will have to be done that link serial killers to an early history of animal cruelty, before our lawmakers will realize that this is a serious issue and needs to be taken more seriously. Slapping people with a $200 fine for tying their dogs out and starving them to death seems like too little too late. And when will they start realizing that mandatory spaying/neutering will solve the overpopulation problem, thus helping to eliminate unsocialized and mistreated animals that roam neighborhoods.

I also don't think that having different opinions constitutes personal attacks. Having different opinions is what makes these forums so interesting to read. IMHO

[2kitties]

What a terribly terribly sad thing to have happened. In hindsight, we all see 20/20, don't we?

The victim here is a child. Any animal can be dangerous if left untrained. It is sad no one loved the dogs enough to teach them how to be gentle. The mother will live with this for the rest of her life- only she will know if that punishment is harsh enough.

[Twisterdog]

Also interesting in the middle of that thread is Karen's post:

Thinking about this, I realize that not everyone DID live to grow up. A friend's brother was killed when their mom's car hydroplaned and hit a tree. No airbags ... so he lay in a coma for a month then died.

I think every generation looks back on their childhood as "the good old days". Were they really so good, or is it just human nature to wax nostalgic?


I think if the child had been 12 instead of 2, people might be seeing this a little differently. There IS some blame to be laid with a parent whose 2 year old is outside alone, where perhaps there is not with a parent whose 12 year old is outside alone.

Keep in mind, though, in my original post on this subject, I said that none of have enough information from this short article to be judge, jury and firing squad for this woman. She could have been oh so guilty of horrible parenting - partying or sleeping while her child was alone unattended all day. But, she could have been a good mom, who took a quick ten minute shower while her two year old was supposed to be napping. Maybe the child got up and wandered out the front door an older sibling left unlocked, even though the mom had locked it before showering. We don't have enough information to judge her.

[Kfamr]

Twisterdog, the story states that the little girl was playing outside when her mother went back inside to get ready for work. It seems as if the mother WAS outside with the child, but, left her -- unattended, while she got ready for work.

[Twisterdog]

Twisterdog, the story states that the little girl was playing outside when her mother went back inside to get ready for work. It seems as if the mother WAS outside with the child, but, left her -- unattended, while she got ready for work.

Oh, I missed that then, thanks.

[tikeyas_mom]

Originally posted by Logan
Do you blame the dogs? Or do you blame the mother who left her two year old child, outdoors, unattended???



2-Year-Old Mauled To Death By Neighbor's Dogs


ROEBUCK, S.C., 4:50 p.m. EDT October 2, 2003 - Authorities are investigating the mauling death of a 2-year-old girl near Woodruff Thursday.




Crystal Sinclair told WYFF News 4's Beth Brotherton that her daughter Mikayla was playing on a bike outside their Shaw Road home Thursday morning.
Sinclair said she went inside to get ready for work. When she came back out a few minutes later, Mikayla was gone.

Sinclair and a neighbor searched for the girl and found Mikayla's body in the neighbor's back yard inside a pen with 10 dogs, including nine Great Danes.

Sinclair said she believed that one of the dogs got loose, grabbed Mikayla, and brought her to the other dogs. She said Mikayla was terrified of the dogs and wouldn't have gone near them on her own.

However, Spartanburg County Coroner Jim Burnett said he believes that Mikayla wandered too close to one of the chained Great Danes and was pulled into the pen and attacked by that dog. Burnett confirmed that one dog was loose, but he did not believe that dog was responsible for the attack.

Burnett has ruled the death accidental.

Animal control officers have taken the dogs to the Spartanburg Humane Society as part of the investigation. The dogs' owner, Patricia Hancock, has been issued six tickets for failure to provide verification of rabies innoculation.

Spartanburg County environmental enforcement officers visited Hancock's home in March as a result of complaints of dogs running at large.

I dont blame either!!!

I blame the person who raised the dog!!!..... I can leave a 2 year old around Tikeya and she would hurt it, because thats how I raised her!!!

[Dogz]

I would probably blame the mother for- Leaving her child unattended
and the owners for raising their dogs like that, etc. I agree with Kayann though, the mother shouldn't have let the child UNATTENDED.

Just wanted to say that I am not scared of any dog unless I am warned that it can be aggressive, and I LOVE Danes, Rottie, Dobermans, Pitt Bulls, etc.

[curiosityrats]

Originally posted by Kfamr
PCB -- Great danes are big gentle giants. There's no reason to be afraid of them. Unless of course, they are mistreated.

I thought that too. If I would "blame" anyone, I would be inclined to look at the dog owner. What dog would kill a child? Maybe they were defending their territory or being teased and not necessarily mistreated or anything...

Still, you would have to wonder about a person with ten large dogs not of a generally aggressive breed--that actually attack and kill a child?? Add onto that that one of these dogs was loose. Regardless of whether that dog attacked anyone, NO responsible dog owner would let a dog run loose, regardless of its breed or nature. Dogs and children both need to be contained and watched, because they could get hit by a car or stolen or WORSE. Is that a caring dog owner (or parent for that matter)? Add onto that the fact that this person, owning this many dogs, doesn't have vaccination records for them! It all sounds very irresponsible. Whether this person is accountable for a child's death, I don't know, but he is showing some real lack of responsibility when it comes to his pets. A loose dog can be hurt. An unvaccinated dog can get sick or will be destroyed if it bites someone...

Given the facts presented, I can say there is some question to this dog owner. I don't know the mother and child's situation so well... Is the child vaccinated? Is the neighborhood generally safe? How long was she unattended? Do the other neighbors watch out for the child? Has the child been left alone without problems before? We don't know, so I don't think we should judge. (Whereas, the story makes some obvious statements about the dog owner...)

It is NEVER the animals' fault. Animals rely on two things: training and instinct. If they are mistreated, their instinct is to attack or flee. They will do as they are trained or they will follow their natural instinct. In cases like these, it is generally all people involved are to blame to some extent. Animals do not plot. They cannot be expected to reason or follow laws. They can only be expected to behave as they were taught or in a way to defend themselves or follow instincts.

[carole]

I tend to agree that responsibility here lies with both the mother and the owner's of the dog's NB: I used the word responsibility not Blame.

However as a mother, I can honestly say I watched my children like a hawk, when I first moved into my then new home, it was unfenced, my son was only 16mths old, Do you think I could leave him to play un-attended? not on your life!!!!

I remember an incident a while back here, people around the corner had a family of four children, the youngest being about 18mths to 2 yrs, they had a gate on their property that could be closed, I happened to notice this little girl wandering fast down the road, not an adult in site, I had to run to catch her, she was way down the road, anything could have happened to her, run-over, snatched.

I grabbed her and took her back, her father never even said Thank you, and said oh the older kids were meant to be looking after her. GEEZ I was so annoyed.
Just the day before I had approached my neighbours , who had set up a paddle pool , left it full of water, on an unfenced property, they were unaware this was against the law, and emptied it, thank goodness , or else this little girl would have been instantly drawn to it, and we can guess the rest.

Neverthless this is indeed a sad and tragic case, and one can only feel empathy for the parents, regardless of the situation.

One more thing , just imagine how that poor dog owner is feeling right now?