I have to say something

[Heather Wallace]

JUST TO LET YOU KNOW i ALSO HAVE SEVERE ASTHMA, i DON'T CARE THOUGH, i WOULD RATHER HAVE THE LOVE OF MY ANIMALS AND PUT UP WITH MY ASTHMA - i COULDN'T BE WITHOUT MY FURRY FAMILY!!!

[CathyBogart]

WHY ARE YOU SHOUTING?

[Twisterdog]

My big dogs once were house dogs, but like I said, my son is allergic to animals. Do you think it would be better to rehome them? We're an active family outside most of the day everyday, so I don't think there is anything wrong with it. We take our dogs everywhere we go.

Well, that's hard for anyone but you to determine. If you truly do spend a lot of time outside with your pets everyday, and you live in a mild climate, and your dogs are types that aren't easy to rehome (i.e., large black lab mixes) ... then perhaps they are indeed better off with you. However, if you could find a home for your dogs where they would be in the house with a loving family all day and all night, then perhaps they are better off being rehomed. Only you can say ... and you can only determine this if you look at what is in the best interest of your dogs themselves, and try not to let your emotions cloud your judgement. I am a little confused, though ... your son is allergic to dogs .... yet he spends time with them outside, and you take your dogs everywhere you go? This doesn't bother your son's allergies?

It's an individual basis .... Everyone is entitled to make the choices that they think is right and suits their circumstances for their pets.

Not necessarily. If my neighbor choose to let his cats roam free, and his cats come onto my property and cause problems for me ... then my neighbor is NOT entitled to make that choice, and it ceases to be on an individual basis. If his cats stay 100% on his property ... fine. But cats rarely do that. I choose not to own a cat, because I am allergic to them, and because I have dogs that think cats are snacks with fur. It is rude ... not to mention illegal here ... for my neighbors to let their cats wander onto my property, shedding on my lawn furniture, making me sneeze, pooping in my flower beds (what if I were pregnant?), using my trees as scratching posts and my cars as sidewalks. Not to mention how very, very unpleasant it is for me when I have to go rake up the pieces (literally) of a cat that was stupid enough to jump into my dog's yard. If I wanted to put up with all this, I'd get a cat of my own. I shouldn't have to put up with it from my neighbor's cats. My neighbors aren't exposed to my dogs.

[Nomilynn]

Originally posted by Twisterdog
Not necessarily. If my neighbor choose to let his cats roam free, and his cats come onto my property and cause problems for me ... then my neighbor is NOT entitled to make that choice, and it ceases to be on an individual basis. If his cats stay 100% on his property ... fine. But cats rarely do that. I choose not to own a cat, because I am allergic to them, and because I have dogs that think cats are snacks with fur. It is rude ... not to mention illegal here ... for my neighbors to let their cats wander onto my property, shedding on my lawn furniture, making me sneeze, pooping in my flower beds (what if I were pregnant?), using my trees as scratching posts and my cars as sidewalks. Not to mention how very, very unpleasant it is for me when I have to go rake up the pieces (literally) of a cat that was stupid enough to jump into my dog's yard. If I wanted to put up with all this, I'd get a cat of my own. I shouldn't have to put up with it from my neighbor's cats. My neighbors aren't exposed to my dogs.

While I agree that cats who are allowed to roam make for pests, and it's very inconsiderate of the owners to not keep them in their own yards, I think your description of a "stupid cat" is a bit out of line. That mental image is not very pleasant and you could have said it in a nicer way. It's tragic when someone loses a pet - REGARDLESS of the situation. Yes, if a cat jumped into your yard, and it was sadly killed, it would be one of those situations that could have been prevented with a bit more vigilance and care on the cat owners part.. but do you really have to describe it so crudely?

[NoahsMommy]

Whoa....that's a pretty harsh way to put that Twisterdog. I mean...ick!! Would you mind censoring that a bit? Your post made me (and a few others ) literaly ill.

It is illegal in California to have cats roaming as well. I don't think its widely enforced though. Which is sad....

[popcornbird]

Woah TwisterDog! That was HARSH! My neighbors' cats come to my yard all the time and I honestly don't have a problem with it. They just come, walk around on the fence, relax in the sun for a bit and get up and go some place else. Honestly, I cannot compare roaming cats to roaming dogs. Totally different animal, totally different behaviors. It doesn't compare in any way. Cats roaming around usually just walk around minding there own business. They usually will never hurt a human or child, and do not cause any threat to local inhabitants. They might stomp/poop in gardens, but I have grown many vegetable plants and flowers in our garden, and the cats that come never touched them, nor have they ever pooped in our yard. I don't have a problem with cats roaming free. They mind their own business.

Now for dogs roaming free, I have met several, and they were NIGHTMARES! They had no one with them, roaming free, running back and forth across the streets, chasing people and barking there heads off, and trying to bite anyone they could get their teeth on. A dog roaming alone can very well be a threat to people/children/other pets on the streets. *Note, I'm talking about dogs roaming ALONE, not those with owners and on a leash* Dogs don't normally roam alone, but sometimes irresponsible owners don't care to securely lock their dogs in their yards and let them go out into the dangerous world, where not only can there be dangers for the dog, but an unattended dog *can* very well be a danger for people and other smaller pets. I don't mean to condemn dogs in ANY way. I just mean to say that roaming cats are not comparable to roaming dogs. I would rather have 10 cats roaming alone on my street, than one dog roaming alone with no guardian.

I don't have a problem wth cats roaming in my yard as long as they don't cause mischief or poop. They never have. Kitties have a place in this world too, and the outdoors in not just for humans. Its for animals too, and animals don't need a visa to go anywhere. They just go. Just my 2 cents.

[tikeyas_mom]

wow twisterdog, I think you are over reacting, what if you were pregnant?? what different does it make?? it doesnt! My cat is an outdoor cat it would be crule to keep him in after all his life being a wild outside cat, He comes in at night to sleep and during the day at times to eat and drink, other times of the day he is out an about playing with other cats and birds and catching mice. big fat deal, he is a cat it is his nature. and he is sweet just the same .

[aly]

She's referring to being pregnant because of the whole issue with litter boxes and pregnant women.

I don't think a roaming cat is "stupid", but rather just owned by irresponsible people. I agree with everything else Twisterdog said, but could have done without the graphic part (I'm too sensitive, I know).

PCB - It seems that almost every dog experience you have is negative for some reason. You should go to a shelter near you and play with some puppies. I just get the feeling you're not comfortable around dogs and maybe that would help.

[Logan]

I just read through this whole post, and I've totally forgotten what the original purpose was!! I promise I'll go back and reread it, Tonya. With the exception of our birds, all of our other pets (cats and dogs) are indoor/outdoor. I wish Murphy and Lilly would enjoy being outside a little more, to tell you the truth. Honey keeps a pretty good balance, but there are nights that she simply refuses to come in. I have finally gotten over worrying about her, and sometimes when I wake up in the middle of the night, I go to the door and call her, and she'll come on in. Other nights, she is too busy staring at a tree (possums, for sure), and she simply isn't interested in coming in. As she has gotten older, and I have gotten more accustomed to her personality, I have relaxed more with letting her stay outside (properly fenced, of course).

As for the cats, that is a tough subject for many, I know, and we have been round and round about it. I hope that I am not judged for allowing my cats to come and go. Butter simply could not be an indoor only cat, given his "semi feral" beginnings. But the nice thing is that he really enjoys coming inside when he is ready. And Mimi, in her advanced years, hardly ever ventures farther than the deck, or a shady spot in the yard. I have "introduced" my neighbors on either side to our cats, and warned them of Butter's personality. I would never want one of them to be bitten or scratched by him. He can act quite sweet, then "get" you when you least expect it. And I've also told them that if I need to do something to keep them from coming into their yard, all they need to do is tell me (not that I know how I would fix that ). The nice thing is that neither of them are bothered by the cats. In fact, both have told me, over and over, that they enjoy watching Butter climbing trees, sunning in their yard, and the fact that he is a great mouser and keeps our homes free from those pesky rodents. Plus on one side, there is a little girl who is about 1 year old, and she LOVES to see our animals, all of them! So it is a win, win situation for us. If we were on a busy city street, then I would have to do something else, but thankfully, we are on a quiet cul-de-sac and there is little or no traffic here. As long as they stick close to home, which they do, then I am willing to take the risk and allow them outdoors.

[popcornbird]

Yep, Aly misunderstand me yet again. :sigh:

I didn't mean to say anything bad about dogs. That was NOT my intention, and I KNOW most dogs are wonderful, sweet balls of fluff, no matter there size. What I was saying is that dogs roaming free with no owner, ALONE *can* be a danger. I have heard this from many dog owners on PT, that they wouldn't ever trust their dogs alone around young kids. Dogs are big, strong animals, and there have been many people hurt by free roaming dogs in the past. Do I mean dogs are bad or rough or whatever by saying this? NO! I'm just saying that dogs roaming alone can be dangerous, because if not raised properly, they can cause danger. I'm not specifying any *type* of dog here. ANY dog that has irresponsible owners and wrong training can turn out like that. The only reason I pointed this out is because Twisterdog was comparing free roaming cats to free roaming dogs, and I don't believe its something even comparable. Other than that, I have met very very sweet puppies, so I KNOW that dogs are wonderful, sweet animals. Its just that a free roaming dog is not comparable to a free roaming cat. Cats cannot really cause any hazard, no matter how vicious they may be.

[PayItForward]

Originally posted by aly
I don't think a roaming cat is "stupid", but rather just owned by irresponsible people

Not all inside/outside cats are owned by irresponsible people. I have litter trays to encourage my cats to do their business in my home not others gardens.

We have decided that as we live on a quiet road with a garden, that we want our cats to be able to experience freedom, to have a full cat life.

Bear in mind in this country, most people think USA people are very cruel for caging animals inside 24/7 with no/little access outside.

My personal opinion is whatever a loving owner knows is right for their animals is right, be that inside or Inside/outside. I would NEVER call someone for keeping there pets in 24/7, as I respect others decisions

Please do not condemn people with a different lifestyle choices than yourself.

[aly]

I didn't misunderstand you PCB. I knew you weren't badmouthing dogs. I was just sensing some uncomfort. Nothing wrong with that. I just wanted you to have some positive experiences too

PayItForward - I have actually read the way you introduce your cats to the outside and completely respect it. I don't think you're irresponsible at all. I have learned from this board that its a lot different in other countries and I respect that. I disagree, but completely respect. I didn't mean to say that *ALL* outdoor cat owners are irresponsible. I meant that *SOME* or even *MOST* are (especially in the US). I just got carrried away and didn't pay attention to my typing.

My cats have a full cat life too

[tikeyas_mom]

we tried making Fuzzy a house cat when we firt got him, but he was 6 years old and hated staying in, he would just sare outside and meow at the door and wouldent use his litter box, so one day we let him out and he came back about an hour later for food, my cat does his buisneaa (poop) in our yard under our fron window thingy, it is ok, is itnt in anyones way or anything. He pees all over his naibourhood because he likes to mark his territory, he is neutered. My cat loves us and we love him just the same as anyone here loves there inside cats, I personally think it is crule to keep a cat inside when it has been an outside cat all its life. JMHO..

[Tonya]

Twisterdog, pet dander settles on the couches, carpets, bedding, and is nearly impossible to remove even with Hepa filters. Being outdoors with the pets isn't perfect, but it is much more tolerable for my son.

[Twisterdog]

Sorry if I offended people ... sometimes I forget that this board is way more sensitive to things like that than most other boards. However, if it's offensive and sickening for you to just read about it, imagine how it is for me to DEAL with it. THAT was my point ... that outdoor cats often meet with horrible deaths.

And, sorry, I have to say that I stand by my "stupid cat" comment. I have TEN dogs ... terriers who jump up against the fence screaming, snarling, drooling and barking when they see a cat. These dogs do not in any way, shape or form give the impression that they want to do anything less than kill that cat. Now ... honestly ... would a smart cat jump off the top of a six foot wooden privacy fence into a yard full of dogs behaving like that? Ummmm ... I don't think so.

And, yes, Tikeyas mom, it makes a world of difference if you are pregnant and are near cat feces. Perhaps you should do some research on that if you are not familar with the issue.