Sep. 11th Picture!

[Ann]

Dixieland Dancer:

"I went to the quiz sight and from the beginning realized it was not a true quiz to determine what we know about the Bible but how much someone wants to demean the belief of those who follow the Bible as the inerrant word of God. I do mean inerrant too!!! The quiz was a slander and joke obviously written by someone who does not believe in God!" - It was written to point out things about the bible that most christians do not know, or will refuse to accept (like yourself). How is it slander when everything in that quiz is TRUE? And it is most certainly not a joke either, it's written by a respected organization which does it best to make people see the truth about some of the major religions. And of course it was written by someone who doesn't belive in God, if it had been it would just have been some bias statement ignoring the truth and the full story. The only reason you think the quiz is slanderous is because you refuse to be open-minded in this situation, you refuse to see all the contradictions in the bible and keep going on with how your god is inerrant and so on.

"This is not an open minded discussion because through these last two links you posted for us to look at, it is apparent you also are not open minded." - Just because I do not belive in your god does not mean I am not open-minded. The only ones who are refusing to see the other side in this discussion is yourself, not me. When have I said in this discussion that there is no supreme god? I am just saying that I don't belive in it and give the reasons why I don't.

"I will pray that the Lord will touch your life in some way and that there will be a possibility of him revealing himself to you." - Please stop cramming your beliefs down my throat. Please. I don't want anyone to pray for me, I've had enough of that already. Imagine how you would feel if I were to say "I pray that the dark lord Satan will reveal himself to you and show you how stupid God is". I'm sure you wouldn't appreciate it, so try to think about that before you tell me you are praying for me.

jackiesdaisy1935:

Why would I? I try to belive in a life after this one, but YOU can bet that I would not pray to some vengeful christian God that would throw me to some burning hell just because I didn't aknowledge him. Take a look at that loving god of yours for once.

WendyW:

What's up with you? You haven't even posted much here and you're telling me I shouldn't be here?

"To the few that hate God and everything about America, why do you bother to hang out around us idiots?! That does not sound like someone so sure of themselves. Oh I get it, lets say God and America is crap and live life bitter, telling everyone how screwed up they are." - I hang here because it was supposed to be a forum about pets, but I am just getting fed up with seeing the same stuff over and over and over. And when did I EVER say I was selfconfident? I am most certainly not. I don't lead a bitter life for no reason, I just hope to be able to open a few people's eyes and make some people a bit more open-minded. I see that that will never happen with you.

Rottieluver45:

Thank you for being open-minded and so nice about this all. If the God you belive in really does exist, he will have a spot for you in heaven. And yes, I am serious.

----

I don't have the time to respond to the other stuff posted, but I would be interested in seeing people respond to some of the other things I pointed out instead of just copying bible quotes over and over.

Maybe Niina is right... This is probably just a waste of time and will do nothing but make everyone think I'm an ******. Oh well... A few good men will do nothing when evil triumphs, right? LOL

[Former User]

Ann, you are not an bad person! I agree totally with what you have said. I'm also fed up with people who believe in god to try and make me 'see the light' too. Each and every religious person I've met, has tried to turn me to believe. I can't believe them, they are rude! Why can't they let me be alone with what I believe? Why don't we non-believers have the right not to believe without everyone jumping onto us and telling how wrong and lost we are because we don't believe. I for once would be much happier without all the religious crap we have in this world, and world would be a better place without these religious fights.

If you believe in god, fine, good for you, it's YOUR desicion, but PLEASE, leave us non believers alone! It's OUR desicion, and your moaning about it won't make us change our minds, quite the opposite.

[Randi]

Good God! What one picture can start! I have only skimmed this thread and I can't say I'm religious - but I do have two friends who are christians, and I have not once experienced they've tried to convince me otherwise. I say, let people have their religions as long as no harm is done to anybody because of it!

I wonder if there's a religious forum somewhere on the net, that may be the right place to discuss this subject!

Have a nice day, all! Peace!!

[jackiesdaisy1935]

Well, I for one will not post in PetTalk anymore if I have to listen to these people with their nasty dispositions, all they are looking for are arguments, not discussions, I will post in Dog of the Day, Pet of the Day and Cat of the Day. I can't say I care to associate with people like this, I don't think religion has anything to do with it, I don't care for their language either, I thought we were above this kind of thing, I guess not.
Jackie

[SugarGirl]

Everytime an agnostic/atheist states their beliefs, they are expected to sublimate their beliefs over another religion's because it's not valid enough. So, if we take a stand against pledging to God it's a huge deal. We always come out looking bad.

I get sick and tired of that "there are no atheists in foxholes" rhetoric. You wanna know what? I have had three close family members die, and not once did they revoke their lifelong held beliefs and start crying out for Jesus. They lived their lives in utter dignity and grace, and if there is an afterlife (which no one can prove or disprove) they will in good standing. It's like Casper & Kitty says: stop getting so stuck on Bible quotes and defending what you believe. The life you lead is example enough. I'm sick of this patronizing "one day you'll believe or you'll roast". I don't see any of the "non-believers" casting consequences on the "believers".

[Sara luvs her Tinky]

I don't see any of the "non-believers" casting consequences on the "believers".

True... because they have no consequences to cast.

So, if we take a stand against pledging to God it's a huge deal. We always come out looking bad.

Not true. If a christian is witnessing through the goodness of their heart and love of God with their testimony they will never try to make anyone look bad they will just spread the word like they are suposed to and LOVE THEIR ENEMIES! (and I am by no means trying to emply anyone is anyones enemy) BUT when a person comes out attacking another with snide remarks and ugly words THEN they make themselves look bad.

When christian tells someone about God it is solely because we care about people and know the love and joy God has to offer. NOT to cram anything down anyone's throat. A person has a free will to decide what they want to believe. But as a christian I have to defend the Bible and put the truth out. No one HAS TO ACCEPT what I say. They have a right to state their opinion as I do. We are all human and as humans we can get offended and take insult at what people say.... but we should not be attacking people with hatred and mean words.

[Aspen and Misty]

(This is not ment to offend anyone)

I personally, dont know what I beleave in. IN a way I don't beleave in god, but I also do. I have seen him work in many situations, but at the same time I wonder to myself if it is just chance? I guess I am just another mixed up teen. My parents and there friends beleave strongly in god I mean they beleave in god to no extent and bring us kids up to beleave in him to. I have nothing at all about people who beleave in god. INfact I now go to a christian school and am sureounded by people who beleave in him and they are the best peopel you could ever meet. O they are just great kids and the teachers are so nice. But I ahve some trouble beleavening in everything that I hear about god, weitehr it be in church or in School. I will not question your faith as you can beleave in what you want to and I can beleave in what I want to. '

So I guess I am classifed as a none beleaver. But I would like to say WENDY that just because I am a none beleaver does NOT in anyway make me a bad person. Yes I make mistakes and I am not perfect, infact far from it. No I do not ask for forgiveness from god nor do I pray everday, but does that really make me that bad of a person? You hate me because I do not beleave in what you beleave in, thats not very far, is it? Also I think what you said about non beleavers and there country. I am an American, I am proud one at that, and I love my country. I woudl be more then happy to scream that out loud or wear a shirt that says it. I don't care what other people think, I love my country and thats that.

I also have great respect for those of you who beleave in god. You are able to walk through life feelign like someone is always there and that must be a great feeling.

Ash

PS: I once saw a man stand in a HUGE crowd and yell Jeuse Christ frogive these people's sin for we all have done wrong. It was a Beautiful experince to see a man so strongly beleave in somethig that he would stand infront of a crowd of people and pray for us and not care what we thought about him. I always will rember him and the homeless man who read the bible in the park to kids. They were two great men who have touched my life.

[SugarGirl]

What about the consequence of a life wasted on lies. That seems quite formidable to me.

What if it was my sacred mission to spread the word that God didn't exist? What if I took every chance to make sure that everyone knew believing in God was like believing in the Tooth Fairy? Would that offend you? But, hey, I'm just doing it because I love you and don't want you to waste your life.


Get the message?

[SugarGirl]

My words were not full of hate, and I'm sorry you read them that way. They were full of urgency, though. I was attempting to show you how your words affect people like Ann and me, by reversing the situation. Maybe now you know how it feels to be at the end of your words, or maybe you'll just continue to ignore how you make others feel. It's up to you and your free will. Like my mom said, don't dish it out if you can't dish it in.

[Andie]

Ok let me start out by saying I have faith and yet no religion. I believe there is a God and there is Satan but I don't believe in church! ( I have had many arguments with my best friend (who is close-minded when it comes to religion) because of the way I think where we have to stay away from each other for a while and yet I can have same arguments with my fiancée where we finally came to a conclusion just cuz we were willing to hear each other out.

Ok, that being said I would like to comment on some of what you guys have said. (Remember these are just my opinions and I don't mean to hurt anyone with my words)

Ann:
I have to agree with some of what you say (didn't go to any of your sites though sorry) and I can't agree more with your animals & God comment.

Dixie:
No one knows with complete authority on how anything and anyone arrived on this planet. I've taken a class (Origin of Life) and I am still confused as ever about the subject.

Wendy:
I don't think you want my comments on how you’re acting.

Rottieluver:
You have a great attitude! Don't ever lose it.

Kohala:
Bravo!

Sugar Girl: Point taken



About America issue:

I am a Proud American (along with my heritage which is why I have both an American and a Rebel flag in my room) but I can also admit when my country is in the wrong. No one can take away my patriotism just because my Grandfather, 2 Great-uncles and future brother-in-law serve(d) this country well. That's all I have to say about that.

Once again I want to say that the above was just my opinions so please don't hate me and I apologize in advance if I offend any one! Thank you for listening to my ramble!
Hugs for everyone and kissies for all the furbabies!



Andie

[kohala]

... of the terrorist acts of Sept 11 2001, let's keep in mind what the professed motive was: Religious beliefs.

The best Christmas card I ever got was from a friend who showed Jesus at a Birthday party table, with cake and balloons, and seated around the table were Mohammed, Buddha, Lao Tsu, Shiva, Baha'uallah and other representatives of different faiths. They were depicted as all singing Happy Birthday to Him, in a very beautiful, serious artistic rendition. She happened to be Baha'i.

What greater act of evil (or act of Satan, if you wish) than to acheive the ultimate goal of destruction of those beings called human by inspiring their vanity through "religion". Boy, do we ever have a tendency to forget "God is Love".

I love my cat; she knows God personally, and she doesn't talk about it. But then, feline beings are far more aware than we are, canine beings, too!

Thanks, Andie - and being a typical human, I had to say more

[zippy-kat]

Andie, I can (semi-)relate to your disagreements with "Church" itself; I do attend although I admit it is not regularly. I think numerous churches are there for the "pagentry."

I am Christian and it works for me. I realize and respect, that there are many other religions (or lack thereof) that work for other people. I'll readily & openly talk about different religions (or lack thereof) with others, though it is a sticky subject; tempers can flare! Regardless of how I feel, I recognize that not everyone is Christian & not everyone wants to be. If asked, I'll account for my personal experiences of how God has revealed himself to me. Maybe even ask if they'd like to know more, etc. I think a "gentle nudge" is more effective than an all out "attack."

I do have friends of different religions (a steadfast Wiccan, being one of them). I do find all religions/pracitices interesting (particularly Shamanism) and like to know the histories, the foundational beliefs, etc. I have taken a "Bible" course (dealing with new and old testament) in college; the professor was agnostic or athiest (I could never tell--he seemed to vary between the two). Though I disagree with much of what he taught us, it was great class and I learned much from it.

I don't want to be part of this debate as it really doesn't seem to be accomplishing anything except angering members of both "sides." However, I do applaud both "sides" in sticking up for themselves (regardless of whether or not the points are valid to you); defending yourself is sometimes really hard to do.

All this having been said, let's remember what brought us all together in the first place....our pets and the love we have for them....

[zippy-kat]

Originally posted by kohala
[BThe best Christmas card I ever got was from a friend who showed Jesus at a Birthday party table, with cake and balloons, and seated around the table were Mohammed, Buddha, Lao Tsu, Shiva, Baha'uallah and other representatives of different faiths. They were depicted as all singing Happy Birthday to Him, in a very beautiful, serious artistic rendition.[/B]

Sounds like a REALLY neat card! Do you still have it? I'd like to see the pic!

[Nomilynn]

I just got back from vacation so I just found this topic. I want to say first that I try to be open minded about everything, I respect everyone's decisions whether I agree with them or not, and a lot of what has been said in this topic is very interesting. I am a Christian, and to be honest, a lot of times I find Christians who witness to people who don't want to be witnessed to offensive. If someone comes up to a person and starts witnessing, and that person says, "No thanks, I don't believe and I don't want to hear that message" or whatever, I believe the other person should back off. It's a Christans job to spread the message. Once it's been said, it's not a Christians job to keep hounding a person. All anyone can do is say it, and then it's the other person's choice to believe it or not. I think it's rude when ANYONE of ANY religion tries to shove a beilef down one's throat. I include atheists. I have my beliefs and they are just that.. my beliefs. I agree with Ann and Niina when they say they should be respected when they ask that no one either pray for them or make them believe something they don't want to. That is their choice, just like being a part of any religion is a choice. I hope that we can keep this thread alive and have calm, respectful discussion because I think it's important that everyone has a chance to say what they believe. I hope I haven't offended anyone at all.. and if I have I'm sorry.

Have a great day to all!

[Sara luvs her Tinky]

a lot of times I find Christians who witness to people who don't want to be witnessed to offensive.

Nomilynn...
I like what you said...
I have pm'ed a few people to apologize if I have offended them in any way... I just have strong beliefs and like a good debate... although... this topic is really not a good one to debate seeing how it is easy to forget that I am in a forum full of people from all over the world.. so I just wanted to make my apology public... I by no means ment to offend anyone or make them feel attacked.