fallujah iraq, march 31, 2004

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by Edwina's Secretary


You use personal attacks and clever word play to put down those who have different opinions than you.

Buy a thesaurus and you can play too!

Ah, personal attack????

Fat bellied old man????

And to correct everyone, "WE" are not there.

It's our fathers, mothers, sisters and brothers....it's kinda stupid to make that a collective statement when WE are sitting on our ever spreading rear ends here in America.......(big belly for me!!)


The part that makes ME laugh is the anonimity that
surfaces in the numbers game.....

600 dead and no one can name one or remember their story.....

Scott Helvetson...Google that.

It is Macho Ass Kicking...that is what war is.
It's not playing with dolls or tea parties. It's not a horticulture lesson either..

We are trying to get to the roots of the DANDELION. Your answer is to let the top dry off and blow the seedlings off....ever get one of those effers in your eye?


Here are some more of MY heroes. Pat Tillman and Kara Hultgren, Kimberly Hampton. Ordinary people... People that we forget until we need some ass kicked.

Don't dishonor people that serve our rear ends by just quoting a number from a newspaper or ticker on Fox News......remember a name, a face-remember what they did, how they died and why they went....

Our government sends these people out and they do the job that some of us find disgusting and distasteful.

Remember the macho BS when you need something heavy picked up or some other 'manly' thing done.
Yep women are equal, but then the poop hits the rotating, oscillating air displacement machine you'll want someone to take care of the mess.

And when it gets really tough you'll ask someone in a uniform to do it for you.

Again, talk to someone in a uniform and you'll get this answer- It's my job and it's what I train to do.


Cry me a river, drop your dinghy in and paddle like mad, And the next time Mr. Terrorist comes to America ask him in for a bite to eat and bottled water.


Yeah, it is about cojone size....

You have to have some really big ones to kill, burn and drag a body around a dirt street. The team with the biggest hammer wins the game....

Our armed forces have the biggest hammer and we are playing...


If war is not the answer, what's the Question, Einstein???


And let me apologize now for my clever word play-
It wouldn't garner a response if it was 'dullard' word play.


Does this make me a Pot Bellied Macho Pig??

I think so!

--------------------------

And by the way, the reason we went there was for OIL.....that's why the prices are over the roof..

[Logan]

Funny how I can disagree with Richard (about the Oil) and agree with him at the same time. I even explained to a Pet Talker, yesterday, that I agreed with Richard, and she was very surprised!

Yes, I support President Bush. No, I am not happy when more of our soldiers are killed, plus the innocent civilians who are over ther trying to make things better. This is a horrible place we have put ourselves into, but one can only hope and pray that things will improve in time. These people did not make their political decisions overnight. It will take some time to help them see some reality. I just hope that in time, it will come. I hope and I pray. I do think that we hear the "bad" things more than we hear the positive things. There are positive reports from that region that will hopefully overcome the other in time.

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by Logan
Funny how I can disagree with Richard (about the Oil) and agree with him at the same time. I even explained to a Pet Talker, yesterday, that I agreed with Richard, and she was very surprised!

Just don't invite me over for dinner.....

-------------------------

Let's put this into real life terms.

Four people work in an office, two guys and two women.

The two guys can't stand each other, and finally their dislike comes to a head in the parking lot.
They do the Macho Ass whoopping thing, later on they go to the bar sit down and have a drink.
They become best friends and that's that.

The two women will circle each other, snipe, sabatoge and never quite let go of the animosity.

Proof? the girl in grade school who ___________
to you. Women seem to hold grudges, Men?

We kick each other's ass and laugh about it later on. We bear the scars and bruises of our fights proudly and we remember the reason why, the fight and not to make the same mistake again.

It is about cojones and taking a kick in the area every once in a while. And, as I said once before, when the pain subsides and you stop throwing up, you get your hands from your groin, lever yourself up and wail on the guy that put you
on the floor.

Otherwise, prepare to take another low blow.
---------------------------------

I will apologize for tweaking people and rubbing them the wrong way, I can't apologize for feeling the way I do..

For the Record

Scott Helvetson was a Special Forces soldier, who participated in a "reality combat" program, Combat Missions. I was a huge fan of that show and I recognized his name the second I heard it.

Pat Tillman was a pro football player who TURNED DOWN a lucrative contract with the Phoenix Cardinals to become an Army Ranger,
His brother Kevin, turned down a pro baseball contract to enlist with Pat.

Kara Hultgren was killed in 94, trying to land her
F-14 on an aircraft carrier. She was one of the first women to land a fighter on a carrier.

Kim Hampton was the FIRST woman to die from enemy fire, flying for the 82nd Airborne, on Jan 02 near
Fallujah.

My heroes.

Ordinary men and women, doing extraordinary jobs.

Remembering them is the least I can do.

[Logan]

Richard, as I have always told you, if you say something that offends me, I will let you know, privately. So far, you have done nothing of the sort. In the reverse, you have made me think just a little bit more and that's a good thing!!!!!

[Edwina's Secretary]

My mother, who is as prone to meaningless generalities based on gender as Richard is, says men have selective hearing. That is, men hear "dinner's ready" but they don't hear "the potatoes need peeling!" (of course, peeling potatoes isn't nearly as macho as killing people!) Here's an example of "selective reading."

I said...

Every day in the local newspaper they run a bio on the soldiers killed. I think of the fatherless children.

Response

600 dead and no one can name one or remember their story.....

Women seem to hold grudges, Men?

Let's see the conflict in the former Yugoslavia...a grudge held from a war that took place in 1500 something. Iraq....any grudge in GW's actions there? Even WWII...and Hitler's grudge over the treaty ending WWI! It is harder to think of a global conflict NOT started as a result of a grudge. So maybe she pulls a pigtail or flirts with the other woman's man....she doesn't blow up a country.

And by the way...I see nothing ordinary in a person who can fly a plane in combat, lead troops on a march through the desert wearing 100 lbs. of gear. I believe these to be extraordinary skills.

Speaking of that....ever see the 60 Minutes piece on Kara Hultgren who was killed in 94, trying to land her
F-14 on an aircraft carrier? Her brothers-in-arms trashed her. "Women shouldn't be doing that. She was strictly an affirmative action hire, etc." I give her respect for trying something I find extraordinary.

We are trying to get to the roots of the DANDELION. Your answer is to let the top dry off and blow the seedlings off....ever get one of those effers in your eye?

Sorry about misspelling "dandelion." That must have prevented you from understanding my point. My answer is to find the root of the hatred and get rid of it and killing a bunch of people doesn't strike me as the most effective way to do that. It hasn't been terribly effective in the Israel/Palestine case!

And yet with all the rhetoric and fancy word play, there is still that pesking little question....WHY are we there?

[lizbud]

Edwina's Secretary,


A voice of reason is bound to get drowned out in a sea
of pompous boasting and prideful ignorance. Some men are
just born jerks, there's no saving them with logic. It's wasted
on fools. Score one for you here.

p.s. Just tell him you don't hold a grudge either.

[RICHARD]

Killing has nothing to do with macho.

We are in Iraq because some nitwit refused to let us in to check for chem weps....we went in there because we thought there were terrorists in Iraq.

In your world it would have been better to let that SOB stay in power.......too bad you didn't get your wish...

Go back and read about the Olympic Training center and the torture chambers there......

Wait a second, It's o.k. for Saddam's kids to run around and punk people but when it Americans being dragged down the street its a different story??


"some world views are spacious and some are merely spaced.."

Wow,
Be a little more generous with your humanity.

Why are we there? We may have been lied to, but to discount the mission at this point is really stupid...we are there, maybe not for the reasons we were told, for the reason that some despot tyrannt wouldn't deal with us and to kick his ass....

Don't be like most Americans and bury your head about the problems that the people of Iraq had with that jerk...


LOLOLOL,

Yeah, sticking with your 'pig tail pulling' it never changes. Sometimes you have to roll up you sleeves and end the story right there. Not chase each other border to border plucking hairs out of your head..

Flirting with another woman's man....lololol,
are you gender generalizing??? shame on you!!!!




LOL,

You didn't seem to be able to pull a name out of the air.....just the mention that there was some soy print on paper..

Kara Hultgren was given the opportunity to fly Tomcats...
So? a bunch of macho a-holes who were scared that she was give a chance to compete, Instead of keeping their mouths shut they had to trash a gal who was not there to defend herself.....no I don't watch 60 minutes....I am too old for cartoons and that mean old SOB, Andy Rooney.....i cannot stand the way he cries, JUST LIKE A WOMAN.



I understood the dandelion reference (get that thesaurus, I'm telling you!)

Find the root of hatered and then what??

Stand there and watch it???

They way to do it is to take a shovel or some weed killer and either pull the sucker out or kill it with chemicals....


That way the other 'weeds' get the message and leave our yard alone.....

Or better yet, Let's sit down and have a real neat Terrorist Summit. We'll invite all the scumbags our there to meet someplace with a conference room and a pool. We'll spend a weekend, trading ideas and talking about their hate towards us..

I am sure they will understand and never homicide bomb again!

I mean, it's a great idea!! Let's sit everyone around a big table and they can tell us we are infidels and non believers, we are Satan and Israel is Satan too!!!

We'll explain Democracy to them and tell them that their Iron Grip on the people will disappear as soon as people learn that they can VOTE for the people they want to represent then. We'll show them how to educate those folks and teach them no to follow a religion and the pleas for children to hate America and grow up to
vaporize themselves on a bus someplace in Israel....


By God,

I apologize for being so stupid and not realizing that you had the answer to all the woes and ills in our situation...



And before I forget........you mentioned that we were attacked in world war II...

Geez, what happened on 9/11 was probably a mistake......

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by lizbud
Edwina's Secretary,


A voice of reason is bound to get drowned out in a sea
of pompous boasting and prideful ignorance. Some men are
just born jerks, there's no saving them with logic. It's wasted
on fools. Score one for you here.

p.s. Just tell him you don't hold a grudge either.

who's keeping score?

Get off the bench and play. Don't depend on the first stringers to get you a win without you contributing to the game.

[mugsy]

I hesitate to post here because my feelings are so strong regarding this horrific event. I do NOT believe that the average Iraqi holds evil in their hearts and contrary to what the press wants us to believe, many of them truly are glad we came over there and ousted such an evil man (and I use that term loosely).

Why are we there? We now need to finish what was started so we don't abandon the Iraqi people when they need help estabilishing SOME sort of something.

Was it a good idea in the first place? 20/20 hindsight may say no, but, in the long run who knows. I supported it in the beginning, now, I'm not so sure, however, we're there...are we supposed to abandon them when they need help? We shall see if we do as we said we would and leave in June. As for no WMDs...I still believe that they WERE there, but, because we spent so many months wavering as to whether or not to go in, they moved them to other countries like Syria...no one knows except the people involved and perhaps the intel community.

As for what the original intent of this thread was.....

SOMETHING needs to be done. I do not advocate violence very often (just ask my students!), but, this is beyond the "turn the other cheek" stance. I know what my heart says, but, I need to get over the incredible anger a little bit to think a little clearer and make a rational decision.

I mourn for EVERY family who has lost loved ones in this war, conflict, whatever word you choose to describe it....American, British, Iraqi.......war is inheritantly evil.


Now...to digress again....Richard, you are so right....men fight it out and then are over it. Women hold grudges (yours truly included) and never let go. I always say, I will break up a boys fight, but, when girls fight....FORGET IT....let them fight to the death....they have no code of honor....it's no holds barred! Btw...before I get raked for that....I am making a HUGE generalizatoin....I realize that.

[Edwina's Secretary]

Sorry Richard....it is no fun debating with you because all you do is get vicious and illogical. For example...this response

And before I forget........you mentioned that we were attacked in world war II...

Geez, what happened on 9/11 was probably a mistake......

would work if we had attacked say Korea in response to Pearl Harbor.

I'll leave you to your ass kicking, cojones measuring, whopping, hammering and killing.

[Pam]

Mugsy I agree 1,000% with every word in your post. I have been reading this thread and feeling inadequate to express my opinions. You have done a superb job; much better than I could have ever hoped to, or would have even attempted to, do!

[mugsy]

Originally posted by Pam
Mugsy I agree 1,000% with every word in your post. I have been reading this thread and feeling inadequate to express my opinions. You have done a superb job; much better than I could have ever hoped to, or would have even attempted to, do!

Pam, you should be scared....you agreed with me on another thread too!!! hehehe

[RICHARD]

Originally posted by Edwina's Secretary


I'll leave you to your ass kicking, cojones measuring, whopping, hammering and killing.

But will you respect me in the morning???

But, you forgot war mongering, hateful, myopic and charming!!





------------------------------

What WMDs???

http://www.phrusa.org/research/chemi...miraqgas2.html

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When you find a weed in the yard you have to kill it to get rid of it. You may damage some grass or other plants in the process....

When you play at or below the level of you opponent in a game where life and death is the grand prize it behooves you to call upon the Marquis of Queensberry for a ruling.

I look at the war as kinda our 9/11 'gift' to Osama and Saddam.....we were just nice about it.
We gave them a little hint and dressed our guys in shirts the same color so everyone knows who our players are.

They just bent the rules for their team.

[IttyBittyKitty]

For those of us in the "coalition of the willing," we need to step back and examine the situation as it stands. I was never in support of the action in Iraq, yet I disagree with the Opposition's pre-election promise to "bring the troops home for Christmas."

Why? Well, we all think we know why the US and other "willing" countries committed their troops to battle. Many of us felt as though everyone was misled, and whether or not this is the case needs to be addressed separately. What remains is a country that we have invaded, and decimated to some extent. We have removed their previous governing structures entirely, and we cannot, and should not, walk away until we assist in the re-building of the Iraqi nation. We may not be able to remove the "roots of evil" that have planted themselves there, but walking away and leaving the nation in shambles will NOT set a good example to the Iraqis about traditional democratic beliefs.

What those Iraqi men did was disgusting, but I commend the US (and Australian) government's decision to stick to their original resolve, and not "abandon" ship when the going got too tough. We all know the cliche ... you made your bed, now you must lie in it.