Mom says no to spay/neuter

**aly** · 03-17-2003, 12:52 PM

Originally posted by popcornbird
None of my cousin's cats are fixed, but they are indoor/outdoor cats so who knows what they do out there.

OMG!!!!! PLEASE educate your cousin on the importance of getting them fixed. I know you don't like it but her cats are out there reproducing with all the other outdoor unfixed cats and adding to the feral problem I'm SURE!

**aly** · 03-17-2003, 12:53 PM

Yeah - I've never had a bird before so I'm not sure. If vets don't routinely do it, then I won't have mine fixed either

When I finally get them that is *Sigh* I want some SO BAD!

**Ann** · 03-17-2003, 12:54 PM

One more thing:

As for the whole pain part, I think I can safely say that male cats aren't in pain at all/much. I did part of the neutering of a male cat once when I was working at the vets, and it was a very simple, fast and clean procedure. Didn't even bleed much and he wasn't in any obvious pain either when he woke up.

**aly** · 03-17-2003, 12:56 PM

Oh yeah - males bounce back VERY quickly from the surgery. Most females do bounce back pretty quickly too, but I have seen some pretty out of it and sicky for a day or two. But a day or two of not feeling well makes up for a lifetime of being healthier and happier.

**popcornbird** · 03-17-2003, 01:00 PM

Originally posted by aly

OMG!!!!! PLEASE educate your cousin on the importance of getting them fixed. I know you don't like it but her cats are out there reproducing with all the other outdoor unfixed cats and adding to the feral problem I'm SURE!

I'm sure too, but she lives in England, where almost all cats are indoor/outdoor. She refuses to keep them in all the time. Her cats are seniors now (14 - 18 years) so I don't think she would even think of it now. When they were young, I was young too, so I knew nothing about it! I'm sure she knows. She's just freaked out from the the idea of removing a part of their body. I have a friend that is so scared of it, she declines from taking her bunny to the vet ( I know, bad. Very bad) because she's afraid they will convince her to "remove" its organs. I told her to take the bunny to the vet at least for a checkup. He's a backyard bunny with a huge hutch, so he can't go out and get bunny kids, but I still try to convince her to take him for a check up. I tolf her the spaying/nuetering is her choice. The vet won't do it without asking so she doesn't have to worry about that. She's just SO scared.

I do believe spaying a female bird would reduce the risk of egg binding, which can cause death if not taken to the vet immediately (its when a bird is laying eggs but the egg gets stuck and won't come out), but I doubt vets do it often, so I believe the risk would be very high. I wouldn't risk it. Personally, I don't know anyone that has spayed/neutered their birds.

**Logan** · 03-17-2003, 01:26 PM

I don't think people neuter their birds in reality. They can separate them, if necessary, but as much as I have read, and I'm no expert, I don't know of any situation where that was done.

I can't add much to the original thread except to say that I totally agree with the masses here. There was never a doubt whether to spay or neuter any of ours. Never has been in the past either. I chose to do it at the earliest possible date with my dogs and with Mimi. Butter was taken care of the day after he walked in the door of my house. Even with an inside only cat, I experienced "heat" with Shrimp Boat and I don't know who was more miserable, Shrimp Boat or me, but I surely wouldn't want to repeat that. Wish your mom would change her mind for the sake of the health of those animals, and for their well being.

Logan

**Daisylover** · 03-17-2003, 02:18 PM

Getting back to rabbits I can tell you that if you do not neuter your bunny eventually you are going to have some problems with him.

Not only is he going to want to have the overwhelming urge to mate but when he can't, he will probably go after things that belong to you. I volunteer at a rabbit sanctuary and all are neutered for not only the overpopulation problem but for health reasons as well. Rabbits are prone to reproductive cancers..it is untreatable and a horrible way to die. Male bunnies will also spray urine to mark their territory and urine from an unneutered bunny is MUCH stronger in smell than from a neutered bunny, after all he and his hormones are trying to attract a mate.

Also I would expect that he will become very romantic with your feet. He is going to follow you around and trip you up. He will become aggressive towards you, probably biting to get your attention. Most likely try and mate with your shoes and will probably pee on any of your things that has your scent on it....clothes, blankets, toys, it doesn't matter to him.

And you know what's going to happen then? The adults in the house are going to get angry. It doesn't matter that he is only following his instincts, and that the decision NOT to neuter is what is causing this behavior problem. Not many adults are willing to put up with all that peeing, being underfoot and aggressive behavior. In most cases, the bunny ends up being tossed out the door.

I am trying not to say this is what will happen with YOUR parents but in doing rabbit rescue work for over 5 years, I see this neglect and the bunny getting blamed for following his natural instincts all the time. It is way too sad and so unnecessary for a rabbit to lose his home over something as simple as neutering.

And while I am on a roll, let me add that domesticated rabbits DO NOT have the survival instincts of wild rabbits. Domesticated, i.e.pet rabbits, expect to be cared for, fed and housed. Being tossed out the door is a death sentence.

Good luck with your mom and dad. I really hope you are able to make them see that neutering is the right thing to do.

**CathyBogart** · 03-17-2003, 04:56 PM

I would definitely continue to talk to your mother about neutering. Show her websites that state some of he health/behavioral problems that unaltered male rabbits can have. Mention that getting him neutered will significantly reduce any odor problems and eliminate spraying. It is, IMO, just as important as having a dog or cat neutered. I have had one altered and one unaltered male rabbit, and if I had it to do over I wouldn't hesitate to neuter the other.

Also, the surgery to alter a male rabbit is inexpensive and noninvasive.

Please please PLEASE convince your mom to do the responsible thing!

**Jessica12345** · 03-17-2003, 05:05 PM

Ask your mom this:

if she could do somthing about homeless kids and save them, would she?

If she would then why not save the animals?

**catlady1945** · 03-17-2003, 08:05 PM

We must be responsible citizens and spay/neuter our pets. If one visits an animal shelter, one sees the consequences of our irresponsible behaviour.

**popcornbird** · 03-17-2003, 10:36 PM

Where'd your post go Floppsy?

I was going to reply to it and it disappeared.

**shais_mom** · 03-17-2003, 11:26 PM

Originally posted by aly

OMG!!!!! PLEASE educate your cousin on the importance of getting them fixed. I know you don't like it but her cats are out there reproducing with all the other outdoor unfixed cats and adding to the feral problem I'm SURE!

The sad truth about cat overpopulation:
Just one pair of cats, plus all their kittens, add up to :
First Year 12
Second Year 66
Third Year 382
Fourth Year 2,201
Fifth Year 12,680
Sixth Year 73,041
Seventh Year 420,715
Eighth Year 2,423,316
Ninth Year 13,968,290
Tenth Year 80,399,780

**popcornbird** · 03-17-2003, 11:29 PM

Originally posted by shais_mom

The sad truth about cat overpopulation:
Just one pair of cats, plus all their kittens, add up to :
First Year 12
Second Year 66
Third Year 382
Fourth Year 2,201
Fifth Year 12,680
Sixth Year 73,041
Seventh Year 420,715
Eighth Year 2,423,316
Ninth Year 13,968,290
Tenth Year 80,399,780

OMG!

In that much time, a human would only add 2-6 normally to the population.

**wolfsoul** · 03-17-2003, 11:31 PM

I'm not sure of the statistics on bunnies or cats, but I know that there are THREE TIMES as many STRAY dogs in the world as there are people...isn't that sad? There are probably more cats in the world, so why not show your mom these statistics and tell her that there are even more cats?

**petsbestern** · 03-18-2003, 02:44 AM

Well, I printed these replies out for mom, but she still won't agree. She said we are not removing any part of any of our pets' body and that was it. Our not spaying/neutering our animals is not going to add to the population at all, so don't worry about that. We are not going to have a spraying problem either, because my cat and bunny have their own rooms. When we renovated our house a few years ago, we have a very big yard, so my dad made 2 special pet rooms that we could house our pets in. They are made in the yard, but they are attached to the house by a hallway, so its basically part of the house. Both rooms have full air conditioning and heating and they are properly ventilated with many windows. They are insulated too. Its part of the house and what we call "the pets palace." There is no carpet there. The floors and walls in both my kitty and bunny's rooms are fully marble and we made a few drains in the floor. There is also a pipe connection in the room, so in case the cat or bunny sprays, we can wash the whole room. Its very easy to clean.

My kitty's room has 3 different cat trees in it, a box full of toys, 2 beds, her food and water dishes, and everything a kitty could ever ask for.

She does come in the main house area ALL the time though, but that's the room where she lives, goes bathroom, etc. I guess it doesn't matter that she's not spayed because when she grows up, she has her room, and there is no way she could get out. Its not mean to her in that she will see a cat through the window and can't get to him, because she can't see any other cat. We don't have a 2nd cat (though we might get another female one) so she can't see any male kitty. Its not going to add to the population in any way. My bunny has his own room too with everything a bunny could ask for. Its connected to an outdoor run, and he has an indoor/outdoor hutch there too. We can also wash his room if he ever sprays. I don't know if you understand how the setting is, so I kind of made a drawing of it to give you an idea. Yes my dad dedicated a lot of money for our pets by making those special rooms just for them! My parents cannot handle a spraying problem, so if the bunny sprays in his room, we can easily wash the entire room.

I'm in those two rooms all day when I'm not with the birds. The three birds live in the living room, so they are around us all the time, and the kitty and bunny are just around the corner. Its like going to the garage, but not really because its part of the house.