Worried about Luna: Strange symptom; she's twitching (update #36)

[Kirsten]

Thanks a lot. Like I said, it doesn't look skin-related to me (fur and skin looks fine), and her blood has recently been tested. Liver and pancreas are okay.

What scares me is the mention of focal seizures. Could be something like that, I think.

Strangely, it seems to occur more often when she's in my arm, like this:


In this position, she's twitching a lot, especially with her legs. Wonder if it's any kind of nerve damage in her spine, even though my vet doesn't think it's that.

Kirsten

[lvpets2002]

Could be the position you are holding her.. She may have a sensitive spot like a funny bone type sensation that makes her twitch some..

[Kirsten]

Could be the position you are holding her.. She may have a sensitive spot like a funny bone type sensation that makes her twitch some..

Hmm, yes... you could be right. Hopefully it's just something like that, that doesn't sound too bad to me. And it doesn't seem to cause her pain, otherwise she would avoid this position, wouldn't she?

Kirsten

[lvpets2002]

Oh yes for sure if it was hurting her = she would fuss or get out of your arms.. I would say its a minor sensation she has that causes her to twitch or could use the word flench..

[Kirsten]

At least it doesn't seem to bother her because she always want to be in my arm like that!

Kirsten

[lvpets2002]

At least it doesn't seem to bother her because she always want to be in my arm like that!

Kirsten

I know my babies can lay is some goofy ways in my lap & arms & are so comfy.. Now I have a couple of babies that you cannot hold that way or even try to set them in your lap on their backs.. They will jump down pronto.. So I would say she is ok.. Like I said she will for sure let you know if she is uncomfy..

[Emeraldgreen]

Kirsten, when you mentioned that you were feeding your cats S/D, it got me thinking that maybe there was a connection to the S/D food and the twitching. But in my search for information about that I found something much more interesting. I found some info that I had never heard of before about a connection between Feline Interstitial Cystitis and the central nervous system. Maybe your vet will know some things about it and it very well could be the cause of the twitching.

Below is all the info I found on various sites but the basic breakdown is this:

Feline Interstitial Cystitis can include abnormalities of the nervous and endocrine systems. I looked up some of the particular endocrine systems that can be affected and adrenal glands are one of them. Studies done showed that cats with FIC may have mild primary adrenal insufficiency. I looked up symptoms for adrenal insufficiency and muscle twitiching is one of them among others (adrenal exhaustion include extreme hot flashes and night sweats, insomnia ( you go to bed but three hours later you are wide awake), environmental sensitivities, low blood sugar, poor concentration, low energy, dizziness upon rising, irritability, nervousness or anxiety, shortness of breath, knee problems, muscle twitching, heart palpitations, sensitivity to light, digestive problems.)

FIC can be caused by crystals:

Other Causes of Cystitis
Common causes of cystitis in cats include crystal formation in the bladder and a condition most commonly called Feline Interstitial Cystitis. Less common causes include bladder stones, drug reactions, and tumors. Each of these causes will be discussed separately.

Sometimes crystals will form in the bladder of cats. While these crystals are microscopic, they have very sharp edges which rub on and cause irritation to the walls of the bladder. This leads to inflammation, irritation, and often blood in the urine. Affected cats will show the typical signs of cystitis--frequent urination with little passed, often with blood. If large numbers of crystals are present, a "plug" of crystals may get stuck in the urethra, causing complete obstruction and the inability to urinate. This is always a medical emergency. Cats use urine to rid themselves of waste products. If they cannot urinate, these waste products build up, leading to an internal poisoning of the cat. Untreated obstructed cats will continue to strain, often becoming vocal as the bladder distends and becomes larger and larger. They will stop eating, start to vomit, and eventually be too sick to get up. Death will occur if the obstruction is not relieved and the effects of the toxin build-up treated. This is why all cats showing signs of cystitis should be examined by a veterinarian--owners typically cannot differentiate between obstructed and non-obstructed cats until the obstructed cats become very ill.

the above info came from this site.

There is alot of information to sort through but I'm wondering if your vet might be able to test for adrenal function to see if something is going on. It does seem that hormone therapy might be able to help with adrenal insufficiency, if that is what it is.

With regard to the S/D, when a few of my cats were dealing with struvite crystals they too were put on S/D but my vet always told me that they shouldn't remain on this diet.
I don't know how long your cat has been on Hills S/D but this diet is generally prescribed for a period of time, anywhere from 2-6 months depending on the severity of the condition and then cats are supposed to be switched over to a crystal prevention diet like Hills C/D or Medi-Cal Preventive. But your vet may have prescribed this food differently than my vet.
I did find some sites that say that the feline S/D is okay for life so it is confusing.


Below are some quotes from sites and the site addresses.

Based on recent research we believe that FIC may include multiple
complex abnormalities of the nervous and endocrine systems that likely
affect more than just the urinary bladder [8]. Enhanced central noradrenergic
drive in the face of inadequate adrenocortical restraint seems to be
related to maintaining the chronic disease process (Fig. 1). These systems
seem to be driven by tonically increased hypothalamic corticotropinreleasing
factor release, which may represent the outcome of a developmental
accident [8,9]. Because of these abnormalities, treatment strategies that
decrease central noradrenergic drive may be important in reducing signs of
FIC; those that do not address this aspect of the disease seem to be less
effective. Until more effective treatments to normalize responsiveness of the
stress response system are available, efforts to reduce input to this system by
environmental enrichment seem reasonable [10,11].

the above is from this site.

Here are some more sites about nerves and bladder conditions.

website

We documented the uncoupling of sympathetic nervous system activity from the hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal axis in cats with feline interstitial cystitis (FIC). Altered hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal activity was recently suggested in some humans with interstitial cystitis (IC) but to our knowledge no information exists on adrenal gland size and histopathology in this disease. To investigate further adrenal function in cats with FIC we determined cortisol responses to 125 μg synthetic adrenocorticotropic hormone (ACTH) as well as adrenal size and histology. Materials and Methods: ACTH stimulation studies were performed in 11 healthy cats and 20 with FIC. Adrenal glands obtained at autopsy in 8 healthy cats and 13 with FIC were weighed, measured and examined histologically. Results: Cats with FIC had significantly decreased responses to ACTH (2-way repeated measures ANOVA p <0.05). Mean weight ± SD (58 ± 50 vs 241 ± 60 mg) and volume (264 ± 72 vs 410 ± 115 mm3) of adrenal glands were significantly smaller in cats with FIC than in healthy cats (p <0.05). Conclusions: These results suggest that cats with FIC may have mild primary adrenal insufficiency. Decreased adrenal size has been observed in patients with chronic fatigue syndrome, which can be a co-morbid condition in some patients with IC. If these abnormalities are confirmed in humans with IC, hormone replacement therapy may be indicated in select patients.

the above is from this site.

Symptoms of adrenal exhaustion include extreme hot flashes and night sweats, insomnia ( you go to bed but three hours later you are wide awake), environmental sensitivities, low blood sugar, poor concentration, low energy, dizziness upon rising, irritability, nervousness or anxiety, shortness of breath, knee problems, muscle twitching, heart palpitations, sensitivity to light, digestive problems

the above is from this site.

[Kirsten]

Wow, that's a lot of information, and really interesting! In fact, I'm thinking about showing this to my vet. Thanks a lot for looking for all these information!

I had no idea that an idiopathic/interstitial cystitis affects the nervous and endocrine system as well! Will ask my vet re. a possible failure of her adrenal glands. It's funny that I recently had such an ACTH test done myself (still waiting for the results), as - along with my thyroid condition - my hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal axis is messed up big time. Would be almost eerie if Luna was dealing with the same thing! Most of the symptoms posted for adrenal exhaustion are very familiar to me!

Re. the s/d: It's not her regular diet, she's usually on a crystal prevention diet, but sometimes the crystals reoccur, so I need to change her diet back to s/d. Right now, there is such a time. She's on s/d for maybe two months now, and will be for one more month.

Re. the twitching: It really seems to be worse when she's in my arm. Funny thing is that whenever I put my hand on her back, she'll calm down and the twitching stops.

Kirsten

[kb2yjx]

Kirsten, I am a bit late in reading your thread. I hope there has been some improvement in Luna's condition! Prayers for you both!!!!

[ramanth]

Prayers for Luna!

[Catty1]

Maybe she's ticklish, Mom!

[weluvcats]

to those that one of my kitties has. How old is Luna? My Sam is 14 and a half, and has been having these tremors for about a year and a half. The time in between when she has these varies. Sometimes weeks go by with not much happening, and then there are periods when she does it a lot. These tremors don't seem to hurt or bother her, fortunately.

My vet ran some labs and they came back okay. She thinks that this is likely neurological, maybe epilepsy or some other seizure disorder (both are not uncommon in cats). Right now we are watching and waiting. Down the road, if it becomes necessary, there are medications we can use. I know cost of treatment is a concern, but has your vet done any labs? Often, vets will work with you on payment. Labs may be helpful in determining what may or may not be the problem.

In the meantime, try not to worry too much (I know...easier said than done). Hang in there!

[kittykatharine]

Thinking of sweet Luna and hoping all is well!

[Kirsten]

Thank you everyone for keeping Luna in your thoughts.

How old is Luna?

Luna is 8, will be 9 in April. What you describe in your Sam sound a lot like Luna. I already asked my vet about epilepsy and she said that would go along with other symptoms Luna doesn't show, but I wonder if there's a mild form of it... Luna's blood was tested three months ago, and as usual, her blood count wasn't so great. Here's the thread. But at that time, the twitching hasn't occured yet.

BTW, some days seem to be better than others; right now, she's in my lap and there is no twitching. But this morning when she lay next to me, it was bad for a couple of times, almost like a hiccup (well, maybe it was). A couple of days ago, I had my hand on her stomach when she was twitching and it seemed to me it came from her thoracic diaphragm. But I'm not sure...

Kirsten

[weluvcats]

According to my vet, it is possible for a cat to have a mild form of a seizure disorder (ie., epilepsy, etc.) As in people, some have a more severe (or mild) type than others.

At this point, it sounds like you're doing pretty much all you can do...keep a watch on her labs, condition and behavior, wait, hope and pray. Boy, it would be nice if either we could speak "cat" or they could speak "human", huh??

Try not to worry too much, love her bunches, and hang in there!!