Originally posted by 7up
Maybe I could mention one little thing without getting attacked?
Dogs don't grin. They pant. They only look like they are grinning because their mouths are open. This is not to say that they are not happy after they run. I believe they are. I think they feel great when they are exhausted. We can tell that dogs are happy from other types of body language as well.

The only reason I bring this up is so people can be aware that there can be times when your dog is not feeling well and may be panting because of it and you should not assume that your dog is smiling and overlook the signs of illness. I know it has nothing to do with this topic but I thought it was important for people to know and couldn't see opening a new thread about it.

That's all.

Jay
(real name witheld for personal reasons. If you want to know them, PM me)
Well, I've kept quiet long enough. First, you berate my friend (yes, GD is a friend and I know him fairly well) and turn his thread regarding a beautiful creature he's thrilled to adopt into a hate-spewing debacle. THEN, you have the audacity to claim that dogs don't smile??? True, scientifically they may not be able to "smile" as humans do, but they damn sure do SMILE in so many other ways.

The grin is sometimes associated with panting, yes, but often times it's not. I can't tell you how many times I've photographically caught my dogs "smiling" when they were neither panting before or after the photo was taken. Often times, the smile might be caused by the musclature movement of their face, perhaps due to excessive jubilation (hence a smile) -- this is also evident in the widening of their eyes and other facial movements such as a twitching nose, which might also indicate curiosity. I've pored through book after book with dogs smiling and I seriously doubt they were all for the reasons you state (http://www.powells.com/cgi-bin/bibli...7-0761129030-2.)

Granted it's best to be aware of what you stated above, but condemning an idea that dogs smile (which is perhaps just as much fluff as it is based on what people see with their own eyes) in a thread where it wasn't even called for in the first place is not too far off from the people who used to claim animals can't feel or acknowledge emotion. My dog smiles, acknowledges my emotions and the whole rest of the 9 yards regarding intelligence and perception that most don't accredit to the canine species. And just because you can't scientifically prove it doesn't mean a hill of beans to me or to any other real dog lovers.

Overall, my point is, no one came here to this thread looking for a fight or debate except you. I came to see beautiful pictures of Icee (Uncle Speck says hi, Icee!) and if you're looking for that kind of conflict, take thee elsewhere. It ain't here, sister. As much as we appreciate differing (and rational/non-abrasive) opinion in other threads, there was nothing to debate here. Your feelings about racing are rendered useless here and only serve to blind you to what is otherwise just a thread about appreciating the beauty of a dog.