Non-debating religious thread...let's learn!! :)

[sirrahbed]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by NoahsMommy

Baptism is desplay of one's faith in Jesus and God.
That is a denominational difference - I do not believe baptism is a display or symbol - but rather a sacrament - a means of grace that is done by God and a miracle. My belief is that the outward show of faith is done later at confirmation and reaffirmed continually throughout life. Not a matter of salvation - just a difference. .

-Here's a hot topic...tithing. I feel that by giving $$ to God's children "counts" in the giving category. Not all giving needs to be at a church. I believe God puts certain things on people hearts, for me its His animals and sick children.
Yes, tithing has become pretty legalistic. To me and my understanding of the Bible, tithing is not just $$ - it includes time, talent, etc - just as Kelly has said. It does not mean 10% either. It *can* but that would be legalism IMHO.

-Another hot topic...church membership.
The Bible says we are not to neglect the gathering together - but church membership - I dunno. I did a search on Google and found that there are over 1000 denominations of Christians!! Sheesh! And of course each is the RIGHT one! (just kidding) I believe we need to gather with others who have similar beliefs but I have been burned by the institutional church but still belong to the Church with a "C". The closest thing I can claim is Lutheran but I do not belong to a Lutheran church. I am just a Christian.

This is a great thread. I didn't know ANYTHING about Paganism and I find it so very interesting. Thanks for starting this thread.

I agree - I have also enjoyed hearing about LDS, Muslims etc. Hope it continues!

[Christiansmommy]

I am a Born Again Christian.

I was raised in the Methodist church, and was also baptized as an infant (sprinkled with water). I find nothing wrong with that...i believe it is just a statement from the parents to God, saying that they want to raise up the child to be a follower of Him...it doesn't make the child become saved, and of course there is no guarentee by doing that, that the child will walk with God in their future years.

I now attend a Baptist church and feel that once you are saved (have repented, accepted Christ and want to live your life for Him), that it is important to become baptized as an adult (or whenever that time was that you became a Christian). This baptism is a public display of your faith to God...before the congregation...if you are not truely saved, and have not asked God to take over your life, and truely walk with Him, then you shouldn't become baptised. This baptism is by submersion.

I, as a child, asked Christ to come into my life an save me. However, for me personally, i don't believe that i actually became "born again", until i was older (early teens), and i was sitting in a conference in my school (Christian school), and a man teaching there one day, just said some things that clicked with me, and i felt that i had been calling myself a Christian all of those years, but not truely walking with the Lord. And no one, but myself and the Lord would ever have known...but i just felt like, now i am really gonna start living my life for Christ. And i truely became a born again Christian at that point in my life. You might ask what i mean by becoming "born again"...i had believed in God before, and read the bible, attended church, but i was lacking the personal, close relationship that I now have with Jesus...and i hadn't realized it until that day. Christ is my Savior, Father, Friend...whom i love with all of me.

[sirrahbed]

...about *Born Again*....that is a another of the 1000 denominational differences - I do not believe baptism is a display or symbol - but rather a sacrament - a means of grace that is done by God and a miracle. My belief is that the outward show of faith is done later at confirmation and reaffirmed continually throughout life. Not a matter of salvation - just a difference..... thus born again and again and again continually... Continuing in faith happens when the parents continue to bring that child to God's house and/or teach the child God's Word (another means of grace) This way of understanding baptism leaves all the work up to God - so we cannot take any credit for ourselves for making this good decision (known as "Decision Theology" in some circles) I do not believe it because it gives too much credit to US, IMHO - only the Holy Spirit can bring us to faith because we ourselves are spiritually dead and unable to do so. This is my belief. We are NOT going to agree. 1Peter3:21 clears it up for me - comparing the waters of baptism with Noah being saved from death - stating clearly that baptism does save. But again - a baptist will not agree with me here and it does not matter. This is not a debate - just sharing differing beliefs.

[NoahsMommy]

Originally posted by sirrahbed
Originally posted by NoahsMommy
Baptism is desplay of one's faith in Jesus and God.
That is a denominational difference - I do not believe baptism is a display or symbol - but rather a sacrament - a means of grace that is done by God and a miracle. My belief is that the outward show of faith is done later at confirmation and reaffirmed continually throughout life. Not a matter of salvation - just a difference. . [/B]

I didn't mean to make it sound only symbolic. Its a very, very spiritual thing. I was trying to convey that I personally believe, as so most churches I've attended, that it isn't a required act for salvation. Someone here asked if a baby wasn't baptised, would they got to hell. That's what I meant by it.

Tithing with time...I agree 100%!!

I, as a child, asked Christ to come into my life an save me. However, for me personally, i don't believe that i actually became "born again", until i was older (early teens), and i was sitting in a conference in my school (Christian school), and a man teaching there one day, just said some things that clicked with me, and i felt that i had been calling myself a Christian all of those years, but not truely walking with the Lord. And no one, but myself and the Lord would ever have known...but i just felt like, now i am really gonna start living my life for Christ. And i truely became a born again Christian at that point in my life. You might ask what i mean by becoming "born again"...i had believed in God before, and read the bible, attended church, but i was lacking the personal, close relationship that I now have with Jesus...and i hadn't realized it until that day. Christ is my Savior, Father, Friend...whom i love with all of me.

I love this paragraph. Its always very cool for me to see/read how other's come to their faith, regardless of what religion it is. Yours is very similar to how I came to be Christain as well.

[sirrahbed]

Just want to clarify and hope I did not border on debate about the *born again* - have been in heated debates with others about this and some who have been born into a church, baptised as infants and have never really had such a *moment* can be made to feel they missed something when in truth - they have not...I am an adult convert and while I do not really believe a *born again* experience is necessary - I do believe such experiences DO happen and sometimes repeatedly. Even Martin Luther - staunch Reformist had such an experience in his "tower" but it was the result of reading God's Word and was a renewal of growth on his journey. I can recall a time when I had been going to church for several years, I did already believe because the holy Spirit allowed me to believe, but was doing an intensive Bible study on my own in the book of John and suddenly, something just *clicked* and head knowledge became more real in my heart. Was I saved before this? Yes. Had I grown in faith? Yes. Have I *arrived*? No. It is an ongoing process. Hence being born again and again and again....etc.

But again - many Christians that have always been part of a church are no less Christian just because they have no moment of salvation or decision in their memory to claim. They were "saved" 2000 years ago when Christ died on the cross.

These are my beliefs

[Christiansmommy]

Originally posted by sirrahbed
Just want to clarify and hope I did not border on debate about the *born again* - have been in heated debates with others about this and some who have been born into a church, baptised as infants and have never really had such a *moment* can be made to feel they missed something when in truth - they have not...I am an adult convert and while I do not really believe a *born again* experience is necessary - I do believe such experiences DO happen and sometimes repeatedly. Even Martin Luther - staunch Reformist had such an experience in his "tower" but it was the result of reading God's Word and was a renewal of growth on his journey. I can recall a time when I had been going to church for several years, I did already believe because the holy Spirit allowed me to believe, but was doing an intensive Bible study on my own in the book of John and suddenly, something just *clicked* and head knowledge became more real in my heart. Was I saved before this? Yes. Had I grown in faith? Yes. Have I *arrived*? No. It is an ongoing process. Hence being born again and again and again....etc.

But again - many Christians that have always been part of a church are no less Christian just because they have no moment of salvation or decision in their memory to claim. They were "saved" 2000 years ago when Christ died on the cross.

These are my beliefs

To me, it doesn't matter how you became saved...the fact that you are, is what matters. If you were rasied Christian, strayed from God and came back to Him in your older years, that is a blessing to know that the Lord never left you, and was waiting for you to come back to Him...and if you became saved as a 5 year old child and grew to love Him more and moe everyday, staying close with Him your whole life...that is a wonderful thing as well..,it would be a shame to think that someone would make a Christian feel that their experience becoming a Christian was "better" or more "moving" than another...just the fact that you are one is all that would seem to matter to me.

When i think of calling myself "born again", i think of the fact that i was born a sinner, and upon recieveing Christ as my Savior, i then become "born again" (made new) (although still a sinner). And i agree, that as you grow in your Christianity, you do continue to renew your faith (or become born again), and again with Christ.

[CathyBogart]

Wow...I just want to say that I'm VERY happy with how this thread is turning out. I hope it keeps going!! I've thought of a few questions, but I'll save them for when I get back form work.

[ramanth]

I agree WolfChan.

[smokey the elder]

Originally posted by popcornbird
How many sects are there in Christianity? I always knew there were several, but I didn't know they differ so much.

About 6.02 x10^23. (Sorry chemist geek humor.) There are probably hundreds, and they all disagree on the tiniest of minutiae, missing the Rabbi Jesus' point.

[PJ's Mom]

I want to bump this back up since Kay pointed it out to me.

The Pagan religion is something I'm very interested in. Reading this has led me to the decision that it might be right for me.

I'd really like to read more about it, I think.

[IRescue452]

Felt like answering thought it'd be fun...
Do you perform magic? What kind if so? Does it work and can you tell us about something magical that happened? If you do magic - is it you or does a god help you? Is it good or white magic?
Yes, healing usually, yes it works all the time, spirits help me, mostly good as bad tends to backfire on me more than the usual person and I've learned to accept that I can't help myself through magic too much. Also I can scry which is to see images is a pool of water (as compared to a crystal ball type scrying).

Why is your wand a "she" ? Is this usual? Would a man have a wand that was a "he"? Wand? What wand? I suppose it'd be from a tree which is usually described as feminine.

What do you call a man witch in your religion? Gardnerian Pagan- same as everybody else. A warlock is a bad witch- males and females.

How are you different from Wiccan? That is the only "witch" I have heard of. I prefer not to use wiccan because too many teenagers go through a fad stage in which they pretend to be "wiccan".

Do you dress differently to identify yourself? Nope but I wear a pentacle for protection and strength.

Do you find that people are fearful of you? Are they curious? If fearful, is it better if you explain what you believe? More likely prejudice and rude to me and try to convert me. I try to educate them. Some are afraid of so called black magick.

Do you have a group to meet together with? If so, is it regular like a service most people would be familiar with - that is - a Saturday or Sunday weekly service? Yes but not very often.

Do you believe in the Judeo-Christian God at all? Yes very much so, just not as the only one and all-powerful.

Do you believe in evolution? No.

Where will you go when you die? Do you believe in a heaven? Summerlands or possibly reincarnation.

Are people basically good or bad in your religious belief? Good but they are taught to be bad by popular culture.

[DJFyrewolf36]

Originally posted by PJ's Mom
I want to bump this back up since Kay pointed it out to me.

The Pagan religion is something I'm very interested in. Reading this has led me to the decision that it might be right for me.

I'd really like to read more about it, I think.

Good for you! I am always glad to see people educating themselves!

"God wants spritual fruits, not religious nuts" Don't ask me where I got that from, I just happen to believe very strongly in that philosophy.

[JenBKR]

This is such a great thread, I really wish I had seen it earlier. It was so interesting to read about different beliefs. I am Christian, went to a Baptist church when I was little, then an Alliance church for a while, now a Weslyan church. They are all very much alike. There's so much I could talk about, I don't even know where to begin. I don't believe that you have to go to church to be considered christian, it's not for everybody. I personally love going to church, I have friends there and learn so much. The most important thing about a church to me is the ride home...if you can't wait to get home, are tired, or anything like that, the service may not have been right for you (if I feel that way every week, like I did after a while at my last church, it may be time to look for a new church, or just pray on your own). If on the ride home you feel good, want to be a better person and help others, and are thinking about how much you learned, it was beneficial.

I think it's great that everyone has put in their opinions and not much debate going on. It's amazing how many different religions there are, and how lots of them actually come down to a lot of the same beliefs (not just in christianity)

[CathyBogart]

What a surprise to see this thread at the top again...but a good one!

[CathyBogart]

I'm not trying to start an argument about this, although PM me if you want to talk about it...I am just bringing it up as something I thought a lot of people might find interesting.

An interesting topic that a lot of pagans disagree on....using magick to help yourself. A lot of pagans feel that it is wrong to use magic to help yourself more than you *need* to, and that seems to be almost unanimous(sp?) among Wiccans (that i've met).

However, I feel that magick is just a tool, like any other, and I tend to use any tool at my disposal to better my life and those around me. Lately, I've been wishing for more spending money. I have plenty of money to pay rent and buy food, even to get something fun every now and again, but I really wanted a little extra.

Am I a bad person for asking the aid of my dieties in finding a source of extra money? I asked, and a major pet-sitting job that made me around $600 popped up. I am very grateful that Goddess responded to my request so strongly, and I don't feel that it was bad to ask as long as I give thanks, but I know a lot of people who would disagree.

****************

I just re-read this whole thread and I think it's wonderful. Thanks for bringing it back up PJ's Mom.