Please, let's not continue this discussion in this thread. Poor petlover feels bad enough, we do not need to debate training methods in her thread.

Start a new thread if you want to, okay?

Jan (petlover) I am glad you had the nice walk, and ice cream silliness, and am just as glad that you seem to have learned, and promise never to do that agin. It's even better that Hallie has forgiven you, but still be careful about raising your hand quickly around her, or yelling around her, for a few days, okay?

Trust and respect can be earned. I am sorry you have had bad examples in your life. But you are young, and can learn! Keep in mind that Shelties are bred to herd sheep, and often will nip at sheep to keep them going the way they want them to. Have you ever done agility training with her? She might really enjoy that, as might you, and it'll help strengthen communication and trust between you two. Give it a thought, anyway.