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Thread: What am I not doing?

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  1. #1
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    Quote Originally Posted by luvofallhorses View Post
    Um punishing a dog for growling will NOT make them aggressive in my experience.
    Punishing a dog for giving a warning signal, such as growling, will teach the dog to ditch the warning signal and bite instead.

    My JRT Micki growls constantly. He'll growl and snuggle into your lap at the same time.


    Sowa, all that talk about entering doors first, not sleeping on the bed, etc is all bologna in my book. Do what you can to build a relationship and trust with her and try not to make it so much as you being 'in charge' and dominant over her.

    Ashley & Crossbone ("mini ACD")
    Living with my parent's: Jack (Lab/Beagle), Micki & Mini (JRTS)
    RIP Kyra: 07/11/04 - 11/3/12; Shadow: 4/2/96 - 3/17/08

  2. #2
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    Count me in with the ones who do not believe in punishing a growl. All you're going to do is create a dog who is fearful of expressing itself. When my dog growls (which is very rare, because I usually spot his behavior prior to growling and act accordingly), you know what I do? I back off! A growl is a symptom, not the underlying problem. You need to take a step back, think about what caused the growl, and then take a different approach. You need to work on changing her underlying emotions around food.

    By punishing her, you are, at the moment, actively creating a negative association with people being near her while she is eating. This will create a dog that is defensive and timid while eating. I've seen it in plenty of dogs, including in my OWN dog, after I used force-based training methods to fix his mild food aggression (and, no, I didn't do it "wrong", I actually have good natural timing, which has come very handy in clicker training)

    Here is an good excerpt from Sophia Yin's article on how to deal with resource guarding. This is method 1 -
    "At every meal, while Fido's eating his plain dog food, stand a safe distance away and toss a steady stream (10-30) of bite-sized treats that he loves. Then, when he's finished and has nothing left to guard, move closer and toss more treats to him or into his bowl. Note that you'll have to cut back on his regular food so that he gets his normal daily caloric alottment of food. After a few meals using this method, move a bit closer each day, always staying outside Fido's defensive range. If Fido tenses up or even growls, then you've moved too close, too quickly, so watch his body language closely. The key is that he stays relaxed at all times around the bowl and learns to expect even better treats from you. If this method takes you any more than a week, or Fido looks tense, or you're in any doubt about your ability to safely read Fido's mood, then you should go to method 2."

    I also suggest "trading" the food bowl for a high value treat, and feeding by hand.

    I also need to add this. Sowa, it seems as though you are very concerned with your dog's behavior. That's very good! But what's worrying me is that you appear to also be concerned about constantly making sure you are the "boss."

    Please, do yourself a favor and don't think that way. I did the same thing for many years of my dog's life. I was a rabid Dog Whisperer fan and was constantly correcting my dog. Our lives were not happy because I was always so concerned about whether or not I was the "dominant" one. I read a great book by ethologist and dog behavior specialist Dr. Patricia McConell called The Other End of The Leash and it really changed my mindset. I stopped worrying and just starting enjoying him. He's much happier and so am I. This does NOT mean he does not have boundaries and does whatever he pleases. He doesn't, but I rarely have to redirect him anymore because I'm always making it clear what I want him to do, not what I don't want him to do.

    Instead of looking for reasons to say NO, look for reasons to say YES! That's the fundamental idea that has totally changed the way I relate to ALL the animals I work with, whether it be dogs, cats, horses or birds.

    I'm only saying this because I wish somebody would've told me this earlier. I wish somebody would have recommended books like The Other End of The Leash and The Culture Clash. I don't know if I would've listened, but I hope I would have.

    Sowa, I really hope you can enjoy your dog as a puppy as much as possible. It's such a precious time.


    "In rescuing animals, I lost my mind and found my soul." -Unknown

    "Animals are such agreeable friends - they ask no questions, they pass no criticisms."
    - George Eliot

  3. #3
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    Nobody ever said anything about hitting the dog. If you tell a dog not to growl, it's only showing it that warnings are pointless. This causes you to create a dog that bites without an obvious warning.

    I'm not saying you should ignore the growling, but you need to address the problem and not the symptom. The dog is obviously uncomfortable about something and that issue should be addressed, not the dog telling you that it's uncomfortable.

    Ashley & Crossbone ("mini ACD")
    Living with my parent's: Jack (Lab/Beagle), Micki & Mini (JRTS)
    RIP Kyra: 07/11/04 - 11/3/12; Shadow: 4/2/96 - 3/17/08

  4. #4
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    I don't agree with you

    Quote Originally Posted by k9krazee View Post
    Nobody ever said anything about hitting the dog. If you tell a dog not to growl, it's only showing it that warnings are pointless. This causes you to create a dog that bites without an obvious warning.

    I'm not saying you should ignore the growling, but you need to address the problem and not the symptom. The dog is obviously uncomfortable about something and that issue should be addressed, not the dog telling you that it's uncomfortable.

    I am not sure exactly what you're addressing in this comment. If you tell a dog not to growl (unacceptable behavior) it is not going to drive them to bite! Get real. I TOTALLY do not agree with you! You can't read a dog's mind. How can you determine why the dog is "obviously uncomfortable"...... My dog has growled at me - when she was young and guess what, she has NEVER bitten me or anyone else. She was told NO when she growled.


  5. #5
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    I agree with k9krazee and K9soul. Worry less about "asserting dominance" and focus more about building trust between you and your dog

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by sasvermont View Post
    I am not sure exactly what you're addressing in this comment. If you tell a dog not to growl (unacceptable behavior) it is not going to drive them to bite! Get real. I TOTALLY do not agree with you! You can't read a dog's mind. How can you determine why the dog is "obviously uncomfortable"...... My dog has growled at me - when she was young and guess what, she has NEVER bitten me or anyone else. She was told NO when she growled.

    Three rolly eyes, I win!

    Growling is unacceptable behavior to whom? Growling is the dog's way of letting you know that they feel threatened, uncomfortable, possessive, defensive, whatever. I don't have to read the dog's mind to know that that.

    Let's say a dog has a bone and it growls at you because it doesn't want you to take the bone. You tell the dog not to growl. He STILL feels uneasy that you're going to take the bone away. You stopped the growling, but you didn't stop the way he feels in the situation. I'm not saying that it will "drive the dog to bite", but he's not left with many other options to let you know how he's feeling. Some dogs may submit to the correction and you won't have any problems, some may feel like they have to use physical means to get the point across. All dogs are different and all situations are different.

    I'm not advocating letting the dog get away with growling, just that you should look into the cause of the growling. In the bone situation I'd play trade games until the dog felt comfortable giving up his bone, thus eliminating the growling without correcting the dog for doing it. I want to teach the dog not to feel possessive or uneasy that I'll take it away.

    Or in Clover's situation I'd probably cut back on sticking my hands into her food bowl. Too much of a good thing can be bad. Maybe instead I'd hand feed her or use her meal times as training times. I'm a huge advocate of hand feeding your dog anyway, I think it's a nice bonding thing.

    Ashley & Crossbone ("mini ACD")
    Living with my parent's: Jack (Lab/Beagle), Micki & Mini (JRTS)
    RIP Kyra: 07/11/04 - 11/3/12; Shadow: 4/2/96 - 3/17/08

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