Contaminated Dog Treats

[MonicanHonda]

Not true. Many dogs are on a raw diet and a big portion of that can be made up from chicken which of course, carries salmonella. Dogs have short digestive tracts like wolves that are very acidic and short for a reason. So the bacteria is either killed or gets moved through fast enough that it doesn't affect them. Delta eats chicken every day right now because we're transitioning to a raw diet and that's the easiest on the belly. She hasn't croaked yet. I'll look it up in the book I was reading about processed kibble for ya. And actually, almost all dogs that come down with salmonella poisoning are on kibble.

[Lady's Human]

MYTH!

And I'll leave it at that.

[MonicanHonda]

I sold the book... but here is an excerpt from this website http://www.bornfreeusa.org/facts.php?more=1&p=359 It contains most of the same information

Bacteria. Slaughtered animals, as well as those that have died because of disease, injury, or natural causes, are sources of meat, by-products, and rendered meals. An animal that died on the farm might not reach a rendering plant until days after its death. Therefore the carcass is often contaminated with bacteria such as Salmonella and E. coli. Dangerous E. Coli bacteria are estimated to contaminate more than 50% of meat meals. While the cooking process may kill bacteria, it does not eliminate the endotoxins some bacteria produce during their growth. These toxins can survive processing, and can cause sickness and disease. Pet food manufacturers do not test their products for bacterial endotoxins. Because sick or dead animals can be processed as pet foods, the drugs that were used to treat or euthanize them may still be present in the end product. Penicillin and pentobarbital are just two examples of drugs that can pass through processing unchanged. Antibiotics used in livestock production are also thought to contribute to antibiotic resistance in humans.

Now if you're feeding a good quality dog food, this probably won't happen because they don't use diseased animals (we hope) but never the less, it's in the lower quality brands.

Basically, yes, a lot of dog foods contain salmonella but the way the dog's tract works, it digests the food and gets rid of it fast enough that they don't get symptoms. A lot of dogs can have salmonella in their feces but not carry symptoms. If your dog is immunocompromised, this can be a problem and definitely cause the bacteria to be able to take over the body and you will see symptoms.

How is that a myth? Dogs have only been on dog kibble for 60 or so years. Their GI systems have not had time to convert to eating a grainy based kibble. Are you telling me that my animal nutrition and animal classes in general are wrong that all my professors are lying to me so I will give my dog salmonella and hope it dies? >.> So are you saying dogs can't have RAW chicken bones too? I have actual proof of that every day on my floor when my dog eats. :-/ Not trying to sound mean or anything... but I don't really know how to put it in other words.

[Lady's Human]

I'm going to make one last post concerning salmonella poisoning and I'm out.

It has been discussed many, many time on this board and most of the references quoted are questionable at best.

There are many disagreements about what to feed animals, they get heated, no one convinces anyone of anything, and it's buried for a while until someone brings it up again.

IIRC, the book you quoted (the quote looks extremely familiar) has little scientific study to back it up.

The statement "all dog food contains salmonella" is myth. Pure, total and complete fabrication.

Also, the statement that canine stomach acids are more acidic than human is questionable at best, being that human gastric acid has a Ph between 1 and 2. You can't get much lower than that.

[MonicanHonda]

Your right, I will retract it and say most, mostly including the not so grand brands. I don't think people need to get uptight and defensive about it. What you feed your dogs is what you feed your dogs. But the true plain god given fact is that dogs are 99.8% related to wolves and they can breed with wolves. Obviously their systems can't be that different. Before dog food, there have been dogs eating roadkill and table scraps.

This is what I'm going to be doing for a living. I don't think I would give anyone false information. I LIVE for this stuff.

Oh and actually there are many different answers to the pH of human stomachs. Lots of places say less than 4, 1-2, 2-3, 3-4. Most places say dogs are 1... possibly 2. And there really isn't an argument against the shortness because dogs are meant to eat meat (not trying to convert anyone. One of my dogs still eats kibble... she lives with the grandparents... long story. But I really hate it when people think I'm trying to convert them)

[Lady's Human]

Not much argument about the Ph of human stomach acid, as it's a fairly strong hydrochloric acid soup. Without the thick layer of protective mucous lining the stomach, it would literally eat through flesh.

As to the relation with wolves, yes, they are, but a wolf in the wild lives 8-10 years. Frankly I'd like to keep Lady around a little longer than that.

Salmonella poisoning certainly happens in dogs, and if "most" dog food contained salmonella vets would be making a lot more money with the frequent visits resulting from illnesses.

[MonicanHonda]

Mhmm, and giant breed dogs are living longer on a raw diet. My mentor's newfie's have long passed at least 12 years old instead of the usual 8. Most wolves die because they can no longer catch their food, they are larger than most of your dogs (except your giant breeds) and if you think about it, that's longer than most Great Danes and other giant breeds *edit here* are SUGGESTED to live.

And like I previously stated. Dogs have shorter and stronger digestive tracts than we do. They don't have more cases in salmonella poisioning because healthy dogs can fight it off. Immunocompromised dogs are usually the ones showing symptoms.

And yes, I know all about the mucousal membrane. If you would like to discuss all the layers in the stomach, I would be glad to. The fact is just plain truth that dog's stomachs move the food faster through than a human's stomach.

Here is a book from a DVM: http://books.google.com/books?id=swI...=PP1&dq=Donald +R.+Strombeck&client=firefox-a&cd=1#v=onepage&q=bacteria&f=false

Page 44ish will be what we're discussing.Basically saying that cooking does kill bacteria but it can just regrow on it once the cooking process is over. Also, some dogs dine on nuggest left in the backyard. Here is what my friend told me once, it made me chuckle:

dogs will snack on poop every chance they get, cat poop is a delicacy, rabbit poo is a treat, etc. Poop is FULL OF E.Coli and probably salmonella too. All the rubbish from the digestive tract is chock full of bacteria. Well, dogs eat poop all the time and don't get sick. Right?! *edit* I know I have to run Delta away from little rabbit poos every time she finds them. LOL!

I have given my information, I hope someone learns from it. Have a good day.

[Freedom]

Thanks for the heads up! I've cross posted and emailed to all my friends w/dogs, as I have no idea who of them may buy that. I never heard of it, lol.

Appreciate the posting.