Cross between a mini schnauzer and a soft coated Wheaten Terrier

[IRescue452]

Do you realize that a wheaton-colored standard schnauzer would be the exact same thing? That's basically what you're looking for isn't it? Wheaton-colored purebred schnauzers do exist.

[cawicker]

I realize it's kind of late to pipe in here, but want to anyway as somebody who's had both a wheaten cross and a schnauzer. My wheaten might have been purebred, I'm not sure since like the schnauzer he came from the pound. Both were delightful dogs, although the schnauzer was awfully yappy until he blessedly started losing his hearing at 10 ;-). He lived to 19, BTW.

There are a couple of things the AKC folks fail to mention. For one thing, many breeds out there are the result of people breeding particular breeds together in order to get a new breed with particular qualities. So, when did the evolution of dogs stop? When the AKC decided? Some of the toughest, adaptable and smartest dogs out there are the indeciferable mixes you see in places like Mexico. Sled dogs that are mixes often fetch much bigger bucks than a Husky (better for speed in races but otherwise not the best sled dog for regular work).

Another thing is that the AKC has bred into breeds many of the problems that plague them. For example, somebody somewhere decided that "sloping hips" were a desirable trait for a German Shepherd. Now it's very hard to get one that doesn't have hip problems. Short noses and squished in faces for dogs like pugs and shiz tzus resulted in breathing problems. Ever heard a little pug on a hot day? Wheezing and snuffling? Wouldn't he be better off with a longer nose? But then he wouldn't pass the beauty contest!

I'm really not trying to rip the AKC - but I resent the fact that they try to say that these dogs are somehow "better" than a mixed breed mutt. My beloved Wheaten cross just died of cancer, and I'm seriously thinking about a designer mutt to replace him. I have allergies and a whoodle (wheaten/poodle) sounds like a smart, soft, and good natured mix. So, maybe they aren't recognized breed according to the AKC, but I don't think labradoodles are yet, either. Yet they are extremely popular. A shnoodle, whoodle, labradoodle? Why not? Maybe they'll be "recognized" one of these days. A shnauzer without skin problems, a less high-strung version of a poodle? How could these possibly be considered bad breeding?

[IRescue452]

Crossbreeding dogs stops when responsibility stops.

REPUTABLE breeders who want to crossbreed for certain traits start a parent club. They select a set of traits they want to try for. They select well-bred purebreds to start with. The take records of each generation. They get numerous health tests, not just from veteranarians, but from specialists in canine eyes and hips and spines and genetics and so fourth. Its a very long process and carefully planned. The breed becomes elegible for purebred consideration only after about 20 generations of breeding the hybrids to each other, not counting any generations where you bred back to a purebred of either breed you are using.

Bybs, puppy mills, non-reputable breeders do not have a parent club. They do not start with good stock because good breeders will not allow their dogs to be sold to a hybrid breeder. They do not do all of the health screening beyond a regular vet. They often do not even breed past the first or second generation hybrids.

This is why the evolution of breeds is such a controversial problem.

Believe it or not, the cockapoo has been eligible for purebred status for many years now. The parent club has more than enough generations behind them and the standard is developed enough that if they wanted to pursue it. But I suggest they give it a new name or people are going to start breeding hybrids from two purebred parents thinking they have the same thing as the parent club.



All of the arguements in this thread say that wheaton/schnauzer crosses were "the best dog ever" or "well-behaved" or "well-tempered". You would be saying the same thing if you had gotten a purebred and had it for life. Do you have any arguements that put the hybrid above and beyond what a purebred pup has to offer?