Research on Dog Food & Information

[MS_PAWS]

You honestly think wolves, dogs that are wild in Africa are giving high fat, sugar, by product, peanut hulls, corn for dinner? I don't think so! If you study the food industry I think you'd have a full understanding what not, what is going in your dog's systems

[Jessika]

You honestly think wolves, dogs that are wild in Africa are giving high fat, sugar, by product, peanut hulls, corn for dinner? I don't think so! If you study the food industry I think you'd have a full understanding what not, what is going in your dog's systems

I'm actually going through school to become a veterinary technician, so while I may not specialize in that particular field, I HAVE been educating myself on this area on my own for years now.

It's all opinion. And honestly, I would rather someone feed their pet Ol' Roy and love them than leave them tied in the backyard their entire life and not feed them at all.

EDIT: And I'm sure you'll also find that many people on this board also "study" the food industry... or at least, have done extensive research on foods and what goes into them. Many many members on this board are not ignorant to pet food and nutrition.

[MS_PAWS]

Bravo to you Jessika! I'm so glad you're very aware, and Ol' Roy's are not the BEST food in the industry either

I'm actually going through school to become a veterinary technician, so while I may not specialize in that particular field, I HAVE been educating myself on this area on my own for years now.

It's all opinion. And honestly, I would rather someone feed their pet Ol' Roy and love them than leave them tied in the backyard their entire life and not feed them at all.

[Jessika]

Bravo to you Jessika! I'm so glad you're very aware, and Ol' Roy's are not the BEST food in the industry either

No, I'm agreeing that Ol' Roy is probably, in my opinion, one of the worst foods on the market, I would rather a dog eat that than not eat anything at all.

[MS_PAWS]

oh I misunderstood you. For a vet further in your hands PLEASE don't recommend science diet for prescription, my best choice would have to go with Royal Canin for prescription

No, I'm agreeing that Ol' Roy is probably, in my opinion, one of the worst foods on the market, I would rather a dog eat that than not eat anything at all.

[Glacier]

It's all opinion. And honestly, I would rather someone feed their pet Ol' Roy and love them than leave them tied in the backyard their entire life and not feed them at all.

Amen! I have a dog who was starved by her first owner. He said he couldn't afford to feed her. She came to me more than 30 pounds underweight. Kayleigh would have been better off if he had fed her the 15 bucks for 40 pounds stuff! 7 years later we are still dealing with her food issues! She lives alone because she'll kill another dog over something she thinks might be edible. I'll guarentee that somewhere in the straw in her doghouse she has stashed a chunk of meat, just in case I forget to feed her tonight.

I feed my dogs a good quality formula designed for working dogs, heavily supplemented with meat(mostly wild game). But I have, on occasion, fed absolute junk food. Sometimes I get donations of kibble that isn't a brand I would normally use, but I have 25 dogs to feed, I'm not turning down free dog food! I just mix it in with their regular stuff. When Paxil was battling cancer, the only thing she would eat was Ol' Roy Meaty Chunks. What she ate didn't matter to me, it was far more important that she eat something! When she was feeling better, she returned to her usual diet. She still gets her Ol' Roy occasionally when her appetite is off and throughly enjoys it. I use it to bait water in the winter too--2 cups of kibble in 5 gallons of water, guarenteed the dogs will all drink it before the water is frozen.

[Flatcoatluver]

WOW, now I really understand why people don't like to discuss dog food on pet talk. I thought I was passionate about feeding quality food and I still am. There is one way to educate people about quality food, and shoving it down there throat is not one way.

Let's see a year and half ago (before I had Sage) my parents fed Kirkland lamb and rice. T.j did fantasic on it, Zoey did not. I was then educated about dog food and switched to chicken soup. Again T.j did fantastic and Zoey did awful. I then switched to canidae, at that time I had bought Sage, and he was being fed IAMS. The only problem Sage had on Iams was bad teeth. I switched Sage over to canidae. All three of my dogs didn't excel at it. I then switched to merrick, then solid gold, and then canine caviar. Never really finding the success I really wanted. Zoey was still having her allergy spasms and T.j and Sage not so shiny and soft. I then tried Zoey on Innova Evo and I am sooo pleased. She does not have her spasms or dandruffy skin. But she has horrible gas. T.j and Sage are now eating chicken soup and they are doing fantastic on it. I'm sticking to that and no one is going to tell me that it's not quality, because I like the ingredients and I can still sleep at night knowing what I feed my dogs.

[Jessika]

There is a huge difference between educating and forcing your opinion upon someone.

Educating is giving someone all of the facts and information and letting them draw their own conclusion. Forcing your opinion upon someone is giving them all of the facts and information and then telling them they are wrong is they do not come to the same conclusion as you.

[MS_PAWS]

Both of my dog's are dead...

This was before I read about dog food, they were always on Science Diet from day we got them, Misty however was on Purina when she was a puppy. They both had really bad health from the start.

Misty had a rare weird blood disease at age of 9-10 her life was a rocky start to begin with she had a illness called non-genetic blood cell disease which you can read more here http://www.geocities.com/aihadogs/

When Misty started to get ill I rush on internet and did so much research it was beyond what I found that I had imagine!

We put Misty on pedigree and I didn't like the results at all, then tried Newman's Own then we decided to home-cook prepared her meals throughout her life. She had to be on meds and we had to rotate cooking and kibble. Then we finally stick with Canidae all other source of kibble like Innova, Cali Natural, Eagle Pack were just impossible to find

And Lacey however died of spleen cancer results of that she was on science diet and was living off of table scape she died at age of 12.5 yrs old

I went here to compare to other food with Natura food as well
http://www.naturapet.com/tools/comparison.asp

[Karen]

And Lacey however died of spleen cancer results of that she was on science diet and was living off of table scape she died at age of 12.5 yrs old

I went here to compare to other food with Natura food as well
http://www.naturapet.com/tools/comparison.asp

To just use this one statement as an example -

Remember, you have no proof that your dog's illnesses were caused by their food. How can you state that the spleen cancer was because of Science Diet and table scraps? Do you have any scientific data to support that? And where did you get that data? It is scientifically unsound to just make assumptions, and to try to convince others based on your own guesses is just not right.

[Spiritwind]

Both of my dog's are dead...

This was before I read about dog food, they were always on Science Diet from day we got them, Misty however was on Purina when she was a puppy. They both had really bad health from the start.

Misty had a rare weird blood disease at age of 9-10 her life was a rocky start to begin with she had a illness called non-genetic blood cell disease which you can read more here http://www.geocities.com/aihadogs/

When Misty started to get ill I rush on internet and did so much research it was beyond what I found that I had imagine!

We put Misty on pedigree and I didn't like the results at all, then tried Newman's Own then we decided to home-cook prepared her meals throughout her life. She had to be on meds and we had to rotate cooking and kibble. Then we finally stick with Canidae all other source of kibble like Innova, Cali Natural, Eagle Pack were just impossible to find

And Lacey however died of spleen cancer results of that she was on science diet and was living off of table scape she died at age of 12.5 yrs old

I went here to compare to other food with Natura food as well
http://www.naturapet.com/tools/comparison.asp

Immune Mediated Hemolytic Anemia (IMHA) (Formerly known as autoimmune hemolytic anemia or AIHA) can have MANY causes, some thought to be genetic. If it didn't show up in your dog until 9-10yrs old, I would guess its less likely to be genetic but it is thought to be genetic in some cases.. and then sometimes there is no apparent cause that can be identified.

I've worked at vet clinicis for 9yrs... several years ago we had a Havanees (sp??) PUPPY come in who was diagnosed with IMHA/AIHA.. luckily she was quickly treated and on TONS of meds for a long time, but was slowly able to be weaned off the meds and never had a recurrence as long as I worked there. The other experience I had with IMHA/AIHA was with a smooth Collie puppy a friend of mine had. He seemed fine up until about 9-10 months of age and it hit him HARD. He tested positive for the disease with the coombs tests. He wasn't so lucky though, he died a few days later.

Immune Mediated Hemolytic Anemia (IMHA) This link has a lot of info about the disease... along with the possible genetic link, its ALSO thought that it is possibly caused by over vaccinating, over exposuer to some chemicals, or heavy metals.. or zinc etc..

And a 12.5yr old dog that died of spleen cancer doesn't sound to uncommon! Again, do you have any proof to back up the claim it was caused by the food she ate??? I'm guessing no, since everytime someone asks you questions like this you don't reply to the questions.

[Giselle]

You honestly think wolves, dogs that are wild in Africa are giving high fat, sugar, by product, peanut hulls, corn for dinner? I don't think so! If you study the food industry I think you'd have a full understanding what not, what is going in your dog's systems

I never said that.

You claimed that Nutro and Diamond are low quality foods. CSFTDLS is made by Diamond. This is the shortened ingredient list of CSFTDLS:

Chicken, turkey, chicken meal, ocean fish meal, cracked pearled barley, whole grain brown rice, oatmeal, millet, white rice, chicken fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols), potatoes, egg product, tomato pomace, duck, salmon, etc.

Is this high fat, sugar, by product, peanut hulls, and corn? In my opinion, this ingredient list is SUPERIOR to that of Canidae or Wysong (both of which I've fed).

I appreciate that you are attempting to educate us, but, please, I would advise you to refrain from making such blanket statements. I have read and "studied" on what goes in my dogs' systems and I choose to feed CSFTDLS made by DIAMOND.

[MS_PAWS]

I don't trust anything with Diamonds at all, and in case you forgotten some of their chain link products has been recalled

Made a oopies on the list, need to take off Wysong nothing but grain & grain
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Read this; Look what is on top of 5 ingrendients of each food
Canidae (All Life Stages)
Ingredients
Chicken Meal, Turkey Meal, Brown Rice, White Rice, Lamb Meal, Chicken Fat (preserved with Mixed Tocopherols), Herring Meal, Flax Seed, Sun Cured Alfalfa Meal, Sunflower Oil, Chicken, Lecithin, Monocalcium Phosphate, Potassium Chloride, Choline Chloride, Linoleic Acid, Rosemary Extract, Sage Extract, Dried Enterococcus Faecium, Dried Lactobacillus Acidophilus Fermentation Product, Dried Aspergillus Oryzae Fermentation Extract, Dried Bacillus Subtilis Fermentation Extract, Inulin (from Chicory root), Saccharomyces Cerevisiae Fermentation Solubles, Yucca Schidigera Extract, Mixed Tocopherols (source of Vitamin E), Zinc Amino Acid Chelate, Manganese Amino Acid Chelate, Iron Amino Acid Chelate, Copper Amino Acid Chelate, Cobalt Amino Acid Chelate, Vitamin A Supplement, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Ascorbic Acid (source of Vitamin C), Niacin, Thiamine Mononitrate (Vitamin B1), Riboflavin (source of B2), Beta Carotene, Calcium Pantothenate, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B6), Calcium Iodate, Folic Acid, D-Biotin, Sodium Selenite, Papaya, Vitamin B12 Supplement.

Infomature on Menadione (Vitamin K3)
http://www.dogfoodproject.com/index.php?page=menadione

Nutro Natural Choice
Ingredients:
Lamb meal, rice flour, rice bran, rice gluten, ground rice, dried beet pulp, sunflower oil (preserved with mixed tocopherols, a source of natural vitamin E), poultry fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols, a source of natural vitamin E), natural flavor, potassium chloride, dried kelp (source of iodine), dried egg product, zinc sulfate, vitamin E supplement, ferrous sulfate, taurine, choline chloride, biotin, ascorbic acid (source of vitamin C), manganous oxide, garlic flavor, niacin, riboflavin supplement (source of vitamin B2), calcium pantothenate, vitamin B12 supplement, vitamin A supplement, pyridoxine hydrochloride (source of vitamin B6), thiamine mononitrate (source of vitamin B1), calcium iodate, vitamin D3 supplement, menadione sodium bisulfite complex (source of vitamin K activity), sodium selenite, folic acid

Wysong
Ingredients:
Chicken, chicken giblets, ground brown rice, ground wheat, ground corn, ground oat groats, poultry fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols as a source of vitamin E), eggs, plums, dried wheat grass powder, dried barley grass powder, whey, dried yogurt, lecithin, citric acid, natural extractives of sage, natural extractives of rosemary, dried kelp, fish oil, salt, garlic, black pepper, artichoke, l-carnitine, dried bacillus subtilis fermentation product, dried entercococcus faecium fermentation product, dried lactobacillus acidophilus fermentation product, dried lactobacillus casei fermentation product, dried lactobacillus lactis fermentation product, dried saccharomyces cerevisiae fermentation product, dried aspergillus oryzae fermentation product, dried aspergillus niger fermentation product, ascorbic acid, zinc proteinate, iron proteinate, vitamin E supplement, niacin supplement, manganese proteinate, calcium pantothenate, thiamine mononitrate, copper proteinate, pyridoxine hydrochloride, riboflavin supplement, vitamin A acetate, folic acid, biotin, vitamin B12 supplement, vitamin D3 supplement

Chicken Soup for the Pet Lover's Soul
INGREDIENTS
Chicken, turkey, chicken meal, ocean fish meal, cracked pearled barley, whole grain brown rice, oatmeal, millet, white rice, chicken fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols), potatoes, egg product, tomato pomace, duck, salmon, flaxseed, natural chicken flavor, choline chloride, dried chicory root, kelp, carrots, peas, apples, tomatoes, blueberries, spinach, dried skim milk, cranberry powder, rosemary extract, parsley flake, yucca schidigera extract, L-carnitine, Enterococcus faecieum, Lactobacillus casei, Lactobacillus acidophilus, Saccharomyces cerevesiae fermentation solubles, dried Aspergillus oryzae fermentation extract, vitamin E supplement, iron proteinate, zinc proteinate, copper proteinate, ferrous sulfate, zinc sulfate, copper sulfate, potassium iodide, thiamine mononitrate, manganese proteinate, manganous oxide, ascorbic acid, vitamin A supplement, biotin, calcium pantothenate, manganese sulfate, sodium selenite, pyridoxine hydrochloride (vitamin B6), vitamin B12 supplement, riboflavin, vitamin D supplement, folic acid.

Diamond
Ingredients:
Chicken, chicken meal, whole grain brown rice, whole grain white rice, wheat flour, rice bran, beet pulp, chicken fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols), egg product, flaxseed, natural chicken flavor, brewers dried yeast, potassium chloride, salt, dried chicory root, glucosamine hydrochloride, choline chloride, vitamin E supplement, chondroitin sulfate, beta carotene, iron proteinate, zinc proteinate, copper proteinate, manganese proteinate, ferrous sulfate, zinc sulfate, copper sulfate, potassium iodide, thiamine mononitrate, manganous oxide, ascorbic acid, vitamin A supplement, L-Carnitine, biotin, calcium pantothenate, manganous sulfate, sodium selenite, pyridoxine hydrochloride (vitamin B6), vitamin B12 supplement, menadione dimethylpyrimidinol bisulfite (source of vitamin K activity), riboflavin, vitamin D supplement, folic acid

[Spiritwind]

Just curious what formulas of Royal Canin you think are low quality?

Some of their formulas are very good. In the past I have fed Royal Canin Natural Blend puppy and adult formulas... the ingredients are quite good, not the best out there, but not horrible.. far better than many other brands..

Royal Canina Natural Blend Adult:

Chicken meal, brown rice, chicken, oatmeal, brewers rice, chicken fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols), natural chicken flavor, dried tomato pomace, flax, fish meal, brewers dried yeast, dried egg product, canola oil

Currently I feed most of my dogs Canidae and Diamond Naturals Chicken and Rice formula. While I don't care for some of the Diamond products, and wouldn't feed them to my dogs.... Diamond Naturals has very good ingredients and my dogs have done very well with it.

[MS_PAWS]

Looks like I'm doing your home work

Chain linked companies
Royal Canin & the Prescription Royal Canin has two different ingredients
http://www.mars.com/global/Global+Br...oyal+canin.htm

Diamond was on Recall List
http://www.fda.gov/oc/po/firmrecalls/diamond12_05.html

Also food chain linked by Schell & Kampeter, Inc.

Canidae is their own private companies and I trust them