Do you agree with horse racing????

[buttercup132]

It's quite possible for a horse to get injured plodding down a trail or running around a field. ANYONE can take a misstep.

Exactly. I used to race other horses with mine. When went out riding with people we'd always go running. And using a crop on a horse's shoulder or butt isn't a bad thing. They have tons of muscle is both those areas a hit from a crop is usually just to tell them to smarten up or to speed up it's not intended to hurt them. And crops aren't very strong they would break before being hit hard enough to hurt the horse. I went through so many when I had Trigger. Any sport is dangerous. People and horses die fom competative jumping too.

[Argranade]

It's quite possible for a horse to get injured plodding down a trail or running around a field. ANYONE can take a misstep.

That's true but you see the thing is ..

There is a BETTER chance of a horse getting injured while racing.

My friends boy friend got a horse for chariot racing, he said if it ever broke it's leg he would shoot the thing, now he was joking but there are people out there who don't want to deal with a injured horse while they can get a new healthy horse, I also hope my friends boy friend gets rid of that poor horse because I don't want it to pull some stupid wagon around a feild with a whip.

[Taz_Zoee]

I voted no, but honestly I'm more of an undecided. I know that I can't watch horse racing. I burst into tears whenever a horse falls down. I can't even watch western movies for the same reason.

[sprokett]

I do NOT agree with it at all they are trained to early they get mistreated, have to race on hot days (what about heatwave's) and are constantly getting whipped

[sprokett]

Exactly. I used to race other horses with mine. When went out riding with people we'd always go running. And using a crop on a horse's shoulder or butt isn't a bad thing. They have tons of muscle is both those areas a hit from a crop is usually just to tell them to smarten up or to speed up it's not intended to hurt them. And crops aren't very strong they would break before being hit hard enough to hurt the horse. I went through so many when I had Trigger. Any sport is dangerous. People and horses die fom competative jumping too.

NOT true actualy i was watching tv the other day and they were taking a lokk at all the crop and everything and they said that the kind of crop's that pro jockey's use do hit really hard whethter the horse has muscle or not its not fair how would you like it ????

[Suki Wingy]

I went through so many when I had Trigger.

Ha, I bought a new crop this fall and the first tme I used it it broke. Solo was being stupid and he knew it so he got what was coming to him!

[Ceph]

I agree with racing...I am pretty sure horses are much more likley to be hurt in Eventing or Cross Country or Jumping - they jump so high and hit so hard on the way down that their fetlocks strain the tendons and ligaments that are meant to cup it and keep it up.

Horses are also very likely to be hurt doing things as mundane has carriage rides. Hitting the solid ground can seriously damage the horses feet, to the point where they need special boots.

Quite frankly though - you see many more horses being injured today in racing than thirty years ago - that's mostly a breeding problem - when they bred for faster they bred for lighter...thats why they get injured.

Barbaro kept on running for a tiny bit even after he was injured - not because his rider wanted him to (I dont think such a tiny guy could keep such a big boy movin' )...but because he wanted to keep running....that should tell you something about these horses - they love to run, they love speed, they love showing and moving...horses are seriously hams - they know when they are being adored or when they are doing something important.

I see it in the program that my school runs - we breed warmbloods and sell them in a big benefit sale in october. With some of the show oriented horses (The hunters, jumpers, eventers, and dressage types) you can just tell - they almost light up when we work with them in the ring (never long enough to injure bones mind you, and never backed). We had one big boy (17hh 1yr old ) named Primo who was a bred jumper - he had top have surgery on his tendons to lengthen them because he was just so dang big, and he was always so grumpy when he had the bandages on...and whenever he got let out to do some exercise he would prance and be happy and bounce (dangerous for the handler...but very funny to watch.)

As far as the crop - I have been smacked by them before...it hurts, but we also have alot more nerves on our skin and alot more hair and thickness to it...when we use whips in training we really just trail them behind the horses to get them moving - rarely do they get touched...if they do its lightly (or when you're inept with the whip and lunge line like me...you whip yourself and the horse starts at the crack and moves faster).

Just some insight from someone who majors in horses.

[ontariogreys]

this video is of a horse that wants nothing more to do than race and put himself in a lot of danger because of his desire to run and be first,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-xR1HErmH8

I know many have discussed injuries as a reason they do not agree, tracks whether at dog tracks or horse tracks are engineered the turns are pitched. special sands are used and groomed to provide the safest possible surface to run on, owners invest thousands of dollars into their animals, the last thing they want to see is them getting hurt so design of a track is critical

My dogs have a far greater risk of injury running in my yard(I have clay based soil which becomes rock hard in summer so have no shock absorbing properties , in the rainy period can become very slick and slippery which had resulted in falls, with repetitive running grass get ripped out and ruts and uneveness occurs which then adds to the hazard of misteps, objects in the yard like trees, patios sets, sheds can become collision hazards especially if the dog is running a slips losing it balance when testing themselves and having fun running tight figures 8 around these objects which can result in skin tears since they have thin skin to start with, or slipping and falling on stairs rushing in and out of the house. So a home has far more hazards than the track has, and greyhounds have dies and have had serious injuries just running around in family yards or at dog parks, we just do not hear of it as often as there is no media to capture the accident on film or large audience watching

Everybody seems to think racing equals lots of money and profit, only a few horses ever make money, the majority are lucky if they earn enough to pay off what money was invested into them and a few dollars extra, that is the same with dog racing, people that get it too that realize that, they mostly are involved to the the love of working with the animals, I know horse require quite a bit care so probably just like dog racing owner they also invest long days into caring raising and training, on greyhound farms and kennels the days start at 5 am getting yourself ready before starting first turnouts and not over until 10 or 11 at night with last turnout, but can turn into a 24 hour day if animal are sick or about to give birth, and it is a 365 day a year job, with no holidays. Greyhounds and horses are very sensitive, hard handedness will likely destroy any handling or racing ability because trust is breached and they lose self confidence, if one invested all this time, energy and money, why would anyone purposely abuse a ruin a potential racing career, it just makes no logical sense.

For that reason abuse is far from common as people claim, having a money earning winner is rare enough without ruining your chances by abusing the animal by hurting it and losing it's trust.

Here is my greyhound Maya data page
http://greyhound-data.com/d?z=uz4m7D&d=leonor+chick

For here your can look at her entire litter and see how many made money consider that each pup out of the litter costed approx $4,000 to get to racing age(stud fees, vet care, feeding, registering, tatooing, training, licencing, transportation, track adoption fee{mandatory fee to race at most tracks nowadays} etc) they were all owned by the same racing owner, the owner breeds his own dogs, cost would have been much higher if he had to buy a pup

Maya(aka Leonor Chick) had zero races, she was too shy to race
So owner is in the hole $4000 with her

Abby (aka Abacu Racey) had 14 races all were training races no money earned the best he did was a 5th place win. Add in Abby and owner is now out $8,000

Gracie (aka Chola Chick) had 7 training races best was a 4th place finish again zero earning. Owner now has a $12,000 loss

Doroteo Racey had 27 races he had 15 training races had placed first, second and third but they were in training so no money but in actual money earning races bombed out. so 4 dogs zero wins now in the hole $16,000

Lola (aka Lolita Chick) had 40 races she had 2 first place finishes, a second and 4 third place finishes. She basically paid for herself

Perico Racey had 14 races never made it out of training races so zero earnings so at this point the racing owner is out $20K

Lucas Racey had 80 races, if it was not for Lucas the owner would have lost a lot of money on the litter. His first year was just a so-so racer, and the later part of second year he proved himself moving up into higher grade races and winning a stakes race. He was not phenemonal and ended very quickly but his winning would have been just enough to offset the losses the owner accrued with the rest of the litter and made a few extra dollars but not even close enough to support oneself for the 3 years spent raising and racing this litter, it would take an exceptional litter to actually make a living on and they are very , very rare. Horse racing would be even tougher since a mare one give birth to one or two foals and the cost of raising a horse is much higher than raising a dog so odds of making money is even less, so owners are not in it for the money as many seem to think, the odds are like buying lottery tickets the chances of losing money is much higher than earning money, those that are involve do it for the love of the sport and love of the animals that participate in it. Standardbred racing is big in my area and a few people I work with have stardardbred racers and when they talk about it, they are talking about their horses amd their antics and the pride they have in them much like any other pet owner does, not about the money they will earn.

Inorder to stay racing or to move out of maiden/training races a dog must place within so many if they don't they get disqualified as a result a dog that is no good or has no heart to race will become weeded out of racing naturally, only dogs who love to race and have the capacity for will stay in racing.

Current regulations require that all adoptable dogs that go to a track to race must be adopted out in the US the exceptions is the dog returned to the farm for breeding, one that becomes too severely injured and euthansia become a kindness instead or those who have severe temperament issues(which is extremely rare in greyhound but there are the odd ones who are extremely agressive and have a biting history)

The owner is one of the top breeders in the country the family has been involved with greyhound racing for a few generations, he is a staunch supporter of greyhound adoption, when one track adoption kennel ran into severe trouble because of other track closures and was not able to place dogs as fast as they were retiring, which put them at risk of being euthanized because there was no place for the dogs to go to, he stepped in and saved the day by taking in 200 retirees and boarding them of his farm until adoptions places became available and worked closely with Greyhound Pets of America allowing representatives to come onto the farm to assess all the dogs taking photos, making behavioural and personality assessments and testing them with small dogs and cats, inorder to help get them placed into suitable homes, it took almost a year before they were all moved into homes or adoption agencies,


I am not a racing owner, but a pet owner, I have had 3 greyhounds of my own, fostered several, and did volunteer work with local adoptions groups included travelling to the US to pick up dogs, I have gotten to know a few dog trainers/owners , and have friends who race horses. I grew up with hunting dogs so understand their love of going to work, and witnessed all to often their misery and unhappiness if they left at home instead of taken on the hunt

Injuries occur all the time in homes, some injuries are fixable like broken legs but like in racing not every owner can afford a 2 to 3 thousand dollar vet bill, so owners are often faced with the painful decision of euthanizing rather than allowing the dog to suffering if they have no money for vetting.

One of my greyhounds was fortunate, the track adoption kennel at the time had no money for large vet bills and had a policy that require all dogs being placed for adoption must be walking on all 4 legs, being this is a low end track the payouts to winning dogs are low, it is a track where people starting off in the business would get there start or those who fell on hard times that could not afford to race at the bigger tracks so money was scarce to pay for orthosurgeries, Sunny was one of the more exceptional racers on the track plus a couple others in his litter was also doing well, so when he broke his leg there was money available to pay of surgeries and 4 months of recovery care till he was fit to enter the adoption kennel.

Over the last few years there has been publicity about dogs that break their legs, which in turn helped with fund raising to help raise monies to help get more broken legs treated and now the dogs that do break their legs get a chance for a couch, interestingly enough most of these dogs are very outgoing in nature and really want to please and they also tend to have outstanding track performances, their whole nature of wanting to press themselves to the ultimate limits is what results in their injuries not the racing conditions. Most common is a right rear hock fracture due to the stress of propelling themselves so hard wanting to be first. In the video above with the horse it can help you understand the drive that can push these animals to the limits, they don't need people to force them

To prove the point take a look at these dogs most are all broken legged racers , http://www.floridagreyhounds.com/spneeds.htm

copy their names to greyhound datas search box and then click on their races on the heading, you will see they are either grade A racers or that they will have greater than a hundred races to their name

example this is Jimbo Mikey results http://greyhound-data.com/d?l=715641

What makes them good racers also makes them excellent perts, Most of these dogs will make easy transitions to homes and have a sheer love of people and love getting attention. And being broken legged does not mean the end of running either Sunny still has enough power to knock me off my feet if he runs into me when he is feeling playful and silly 5 years after breaking his leg though this picture was taken about 8 months after breaking the leg, and even in a home he has had to have additional vetting due to running injuries in his desire to still be first,

[IRescue452]

Nope. I don't agree that horses naturally race like that either. Horses in nature might race each other for play, but they don't run in a line so tightly and they don't have a person on their back. Should they get tired or injured in the wild, they can stop anytime. In a race, they don't get to stop like that.

[Ceph]

lol, most of the time they do....

Its not hard to tell if a horse gets injured from their back...their gait changes, it becomes less even and you will probably loose the groove that you've been in because something changed. Most (good) jockeys will stop the horse at this point...however it is sometimes hard because the horses dont want to stop running....you should watch it...they have an amazing amount of heart, and sometimes they just dont realize it.

I would worry...horses are more likley to break legs in a pothole ridden field than on the track.

But then again, horses can break their legs doing anything....they just have so little muscle on those lower legs...everything is operated by stored and released energy, they are like rubber bands, so there is alot of tension and therefore it is not difficult for things to break in general.