Mr. Biggles is being put to sleep tomorrow

[king2005]

You people wern't there & haven't seen the amount of damage he did to Chad. Hes being PTS end of story!

If this was a just a bite the story would be different. but it wasn't!

[areias]

Just saw the replies to my other post-yes, I would do the same thing for a big dog. I have always thought that a dog involved in an attack should not be put down (in most cases) and that the court should order the owner pay for rehabilitation for the dog. And yes, I have been bitten (attacked?) by a 90 lb lab. The dog would not let go of my arm. I triggered it by turning towards/at the dog, he was nervous and he surely did grab ahold of my arm. You know what? That dog is still with its family. They took the proper steps in rehabilitating the dog. No, change won't happen overnight, but it will start taking place sooner than you expect. I'm absolutely not trying to be mean, thats not my intention, I just hate to see any dog PTS. I know it's hard, and it's a difficult decision, but I urge you to at least contact a behaviorist before you do anything.

[Taz_Zoee]

Ok, I guess it's final then. Goodbye Mr Biggles. Play hard at the bridge, tell DJ hello for us. Watch over Bear as well, and assist in her weight loss endeavor.
Good Luck, Jess (I'm guessing that's your name) with Bear, I hope all goes well with her. Give her hugs for me.

[king2005]

Just saw the replies to my other post-yes, I would do the same thing for a big dog. I have always thought that a dog involved in an attack should not be put down (in most cases) and that the court should order the owner pay for rehabilitation for the dog. And yes, I have been bitten (attacked?) by a 90 lb lab. The dog would not let go of my arm. I triggered it by turning towards/at the dog, he was nervous and he surely did grab ahold of my arm. You know what? That dog is still with its family. They took the proper steps in rehabilitating the dog. No, change won't happen overnight, but it will start taking place sooner than you expect. I'm absolutely not trying to be mean, thats not my intention, I just hate to see any dog PTS. I know it's hard, and it's a difficult decision, but I urge you to at least contact a behaviorist before you do anything.

What if he attacks again? or gets out & goes after someone else?

I'm not putting other people at risk, its not fair to other people. I've been there too many times & being traumatized isn't fair at all!!

Its not like I'm jumping in joy that I'm having him PTS. We rescued them cause they needed a 2ed chance (well its more then a 2ed, but we wanted to try at least, before they both were PTS at the shelter)

[BC_MoM]

I have a friend in Ontario who is amazing. However, I don't think Jess is the kind of person who is patient with things like this.

[Daisy and Delilah]

Let me say one more thing Jess; you have put this entire story out there for everyone to read. If you didn't want responses, and now it seems you're getting angry, why did you make all of this public? You have asked for advice from everyone here and most everyone has given you help. We feel attached to these dogs ourselves. What do you expect? I hardly think you should get angry with anyone.

Don't forget.....when you first got bitten by Mr. Biggles, you decided to hide it from Chad. As I said before, now Chad is the good guy and Mr. Biggles has to be PTS. Forgive me if I am just very confused

[Pawsitive Thinking]

I have a friend in Ontario who is amazing. However, I don't think Jess is the kind of person who is patient with things like this.

Does your friend have any suggestions to get round this?

[BC_MoM]

I haven't spoken to her, but yes. She is a homeopathic woman and an amazing behaviourlist (but it isn't her career).

If Jess is interested, she can PM me. But I will not give her any information unless she is willing to work with Mr. Biggles. Sorry.

[Pawsitive Thinking]

I haven't spoken to her, but yes. She is a homeopathic woman and an amazing behaviourlist (but it isn't her career).

If Jess is interested, she can PM me. But I will not give her any information unless she is willing to work with Mr. Biggles. Sorry.

But this dog's life is at stake - if there is anything you can do to help I beg you to do it whether Jess asks or not

[areias]

Pleading here, have you done any NILIF (nothing in life is free) training? That would be step #1. This can be solved. If it is solved, then no it won't happen again. I swear to god, I'd pay for you to ship him to me if there weren't children in this household.

[caseysmom]

I think you could find a jrt rescue group that would be happy to take him. Someone familiar with jrt's needs him, that breed definetely is a handful and it doesn't sound like your in a situation to deal with him right now, please call a rescue.

[Catlady711]

In the states home owners insurance policies can be cancelled if you have a known agressive dog. In the states also you can face personal lawsuits from a person bitten, whether friend or delivery person, and have to pay court costs, medical bils, and pain & suffering which can be very costly. And in most states there are dog bite laws that will have the biting dog PTS, particularly if it's not a first offence.

I took the liberty of looking up the Dog Owners Liability Act of Ontario and found the following information...

(1) The owner of a dog is liable for damages resulting from a bite or attack by the dog on another person or domestic animal. R.S.O. 1990, c. D.16, s. 2 (1).

(3) The liability of the owner does not depend upon knowledge of the propensity of the dog or fault or negligence on the part of the owner, but the court shall reduce the damages awarded in proportion to the degree, if any, to which the fault or negligence of the plaintiff caused or contributed to the damages. R.S.O. 1990, c. D.16, s. 2 (3).

(3) If, in a proceeding under subsection (1), the court finds that the dog has bitten or attacked a person or domestic animal or that the dog’s behaviour is such that the dog is a menace to the safety of persons or domestic animals, and the court is satisfied that an order is necessary for the protection of the public, the court may order,
(a) that the dog be destroyed in the manner specified in the order

5. When, in a proceeding under section 4, the court finds that the dog has bitten or attacked a person or domestic animal or that the dog’s behaviour is such that the dog is a menace to the safety of persons or domestic animals, the court may make an order prohibiting the dog’s owner from owning another dog during a specified period of time. 2000, c. 26, Sched. A, s. 6; 2005, c. 2, s. 1 (14).

Proceedings against owner of dog
4. (1) A proceeding may be commenced in the Ontario Court of Justice against an owner of a dog if it is alleged that,
(a) the dog has bitten or attacked a person or domestic animal;
(b) the dog has behaved in a manner that poses a menace to the safety of persons or domestic animals; or
(c) the owner did not exercise reasonable precautions to prevent the dog from,
(i) biting or attacking a person or domestic animal, or
(ii) behaving in a manner that poses a menace to the safety of persons or domestic animals. 2005, c. 2, s. 1 (6).




And I HAVE to comment on this.....

I was watching Animal Cops last night and it made me so mad A dog came in off the streets after being abandoned(That sticks for life in there heads i dont care what anyone has to say about that)Anyways they were doing a temeperment test,She put that rubber hand in the food dish and pulled it away,The dog snapped offcourse(THE DOG HAD BEEN STARVED FOR HOWEVER LONG,WOULDNT YOU SNAP)Anyhow the dog was put to sleep because it was"Food Aggressive".With an appropriate trainer you could most likely fix his problems these people can read your animals minds and know what to look for,

They use the testing methods they do to simulate real life situations the dogs may encounter in a new home whether accidental or deliberate. I think it's far better they test them first rather than adopt out an animal that may attack or even kill someone without knowing what kind of temperment they have.


Not knowing which animal cops you were watching (New York, Huston, Detroit) however in all cases those places that take the animals in for treatment are ASPCA. Those places are basically funded by donations, not federal money. There is only so much money to save/treat x amount of animals. As we all know there are millions of homeless, abused, neglected, abandoned animals out there needing homes. There are only so many homes available for all these animals.

To spend the extra $$ to pay for special training for agressiveness, the additional food & medical care the dog would need in the meantime would cost alot! That money and time could be used to spend on probably saving FIVE other animals in more dire circumstances that are perfectly adoptable. The more adoptions, the more money comes in, AND opens up cage space for yet another animal to be saved. By keeping a known agressive animal, spending the money on training that may or may not work, jeopardizing the staff in the meantime with an agressive dog, and taking time, money and cage space, would put other animals that need help and are adoptable at risk of not being helped.

Sometimes you have to look at the numbers. Sometimes it's necessary to sacrifice a few to save many.

[king2005]

Catlady711 thank you for that.

[Catlady711]

Catlady711 thank you for that.

You're welcome.

I totally understand the legal liability & consequences that influence your decision.

Besides an ethical/reputable vet would never agree to PTS a healthy animal without extenuating circumstances, such as an attack/mauling. However in the interest of the safety of humans and other animals most will agree to do it in a case like this. They don't like doing it anymore than other people, but they also understand the legal liabilities and consequences of it. And most laws are designed to protect humans as well as other animals from such incidents.

On a side note, we recently had to PTS a dog that was agressive despite a loving home and good care it was getting now. It was a rescue foster dog from a troubled home and she was his last chance also. The catalist event that caused the owner to schedule this appointment was that the dog had killed another dog in the house. The owner was distraught at not only having to make a decision like that about this dog, but she'd seen the mauling happen and was horrified at watching the other dog die at the mouth of this one. She loved both dogs very much.

[Lori Jordan]

In the states home owners insurance policies can be cancelled if you have a known agressive dog. In the states also you can face personal lawsuits from a person bitten, whether friend or delivery person, and have to pay court costs, medical bils, and pain & suffering which can be very costly. And in most states there are dog bite laws that will have the biting dog PTS, particularly if it's not a first offence.

I took the liberty of looking up the Dog Owners Liability Act of Ontario and found the following information...

(1) The owner of a dog is liable for damages resulting from a bite or attack by the dog on another person or domestic animal. R.S.O. 1990, c. D.16, s. 2 (1).

(3) The liability of the owner does not depend upon knowledge of the propensity of the dog or fault or negligence on the part of the owner, but the court shall reduce the damages awarded in proportion to the degree, if any, to which the fault or negligence of the plaintiff caused or contributed to the damages. R.S.O. 1990, c. D.16, s. 2 (3).

(3) If, in a proceeding under subsection (1), the court finds that the dog has bitten or attacked a person or domestic animal or that the dog’s behaviour is such that the dog is a menace to the safety of persons or domestic animals, and the court is satisfied that an order is necessary for the protection of the public, the court may order,
(a) that the dog be destroyed in the manner specified in the order

5. When, in a proceeding under section 4, the court finds that the dog has bitten or attacked a person or domestic animal or that the dog’s behaviour is such that the dog is a menace to the safety of persons or domestic animals, the court may make an order prohibiting the dog’s owner from owning another dog during a specified period of time. 2000, c. 26, Sched. A, s. 6; 2005, c. 2, s. 1 (14).

Proceedings against owner of dog
4. (1) A proceeding may be commenced in the Ontario Court of Justice against an owner of a dog if it is alleged that,
(a) the dog has bitten or attacked a person or domestic animal;
(b) the dog has behaved in a manner that poses a menace to the safety of persons or domestic animals; or
(c) the owner did not exercise reasonable precautions to prevent the dog from,
(i) biting or attacking a person or domestic animal, or
(ii) behaving in a manner that poses a menace to the safety of persons or domestic animals. 2005, c. 2, s. 1 (6).




And I HAVE to comment on this.....



They use the testing methods they do to simulate real life situations the dogs may encounter in a new home whether accidental or deliberate. I think it's far better they test them first rather than adopt out an animal that may attack or even kill someone without knowing what kind of temperment they have.


Not knowing which animal cops you were watching (New York, Huston, Detroit) however in all cases those places that take the animals in for treatment are ASPCA. Those places are basically funded by donations, not federal money. There is only so much money to save/treat x amount of animals. As we all know there are millions of homeless, abused, neglected, abandoned animals out there needing homes. There are only so many homes available for all these animals.

To spend the extra $$ to pay for special training for agressiveness, the additional food & medical care the dog would need in the meantime would cost alot! That money and time could be used to spend on probably saving FIVE other animals in more dire circumstances that are perfectly adoptable. The more adoptions, the more money comes in, AND opens up cage space for yet another animal to be saved. By keeping a known agressive animal, spending the money on training that may or may not work, jeopardizing the staff in the meantime with an agressive dog, and taking time, money and cage space, would put other animals that need help and are adoptable at risk of not being helped.

Sometimes you have to look at the numbers. Sometimes it's necessary to sacrifice a few to save many.

It was a puppy for god sake!It actually was New York Animal Precingt