Two stories about medicine that trouble me.

[Cataholic]

Marigold 2, what a moving post.

[CathyBogart]

Guys, don't act like someone has to pop out a kid in order to have intelligent opinions about how other people take care of their kids. I may disagree with Richard's opinion in this case, but I hate the argument that anyone who hasn't conformed to society's expectations to reproduce at a certain age can't have opinions on such matters.

[Cataholic]

Guys, don't act like someone has to pop out a kid in order to have intelligent opinions about how other people take care of their kids. I may disagree with Richard's opinion in this case, but I hate the argument that anyone who hasn't conformed to society's expectations to reproduce at a certain age can't have opinions on such matters.

No one is saying anything about conforming to society's expectations to reproduce....it isn't always the topic of conversation.

One can know how hot a fire burns intellectually, but, it is quite a different experience to feel the flame. Like it or not, there is a difference. No one is better or worse, because of a child, but, in this situation, with a child born of such significant limitations, a parent's "hurt" (such a weak word for this situation) is difficult to convey.

That you recognize the parents situation says much about you.

[RICHARD]

Yeah, I don't think you could have handled having kids. There is just too much of the unknown for your comfort level. These parents **could** have opted out, be it abortion, instutionalizing, or in home around the clock care. But, they didn't.

It is your insensitivity to this situation (and others) that is shocking.

I asked you politely to stop reading my posts.

I recognized very early that I wasn't the kind of person to father, parent and care for children (Or baby goats for the matter...).

You do not know me so I find your mention of my "comfort level" to very amusing. Are you trying the old "back off with humor: trick?

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Have you ever tried to clean the rear end of an 80 year old man?
Or pick him up to get him to the shower?
Have you ever watched anyone waste away froms AIDS?
have you lost your father and six months later lost your fiance?


MG,

I worked in healthcare for 30 years. Altho I didn't have close patient contact I saw more pain just walking the halls of the buildings.

CB,

Thank you for recognizing my right to speak my twisted mind.


Liz,
Perverted...You forgot selfish.

Isn't my proposal tantamount to what those parents are asking for their loved one?

You see that what I wrote is extreme - I think the child's parents requests are in the same vein.

The annoyance that you feel towards my scenario could be the same that I feel towards the topic.

And altho my feelings lean towards the paternal, I never felt the desire to sire offspring and I have no kids (NOT EVEN GONNA USE THAT STUPID JOKE, "That I know of.....") I find that having an opinion disqualified because I never have had fill-in-the-blank to be the highest form of intolerance.

[Cataholic]

I asked you politely to stop reading my posts.

I recognized very early that I wasn't the kind of person to father, parent and care for children (Or baby goats for the matter...).

You do not know me so I find your mention of my "comfort level" to very amusing. Are you trying the old "back off with humor: trick?

-

Wait a minute, back up, and stop the presses. We now have to KNOW someone to have an opinion? LOL. What is good for the goose is good for the gander. I know you at least as well as you know the parents of this child.

You haven't a clue what these parents are going through. Your posts indicate that clearly. Nothing about this situation is funny. I am not using humor, I was quite serious with what I posted concerning your posts. When I am wrong, I admit it, retract the statement, and let it go. I don't dig in deeper.

[Edwina's Secretary]

Guys, don't act like someone has to pop out a kid in order to have intelligent opinions about how other people take care of their kids. I may disagree with Richard's opinion in this case, but I hate the argument that anyone who hasn't conformed to society's expectations to reproduce at a certain age can't have opinions on such matters.

I have no children and expressed an opinion. Perhaps I cannot know the anguish of these parents, but I imagine and sympathize nonetheless.

[Edwina's Secretary]

Guys, don't act like someone has to pop out a kid in order to have intelligent opinions about how other people take care of their kids. I may disagree with Richard's opinion in this case, but I hate the argument that anyone who hasn't conformed to society's expectations to reproduce at a certain age can't have opinions on such matters.

I have no children and expressed an opinion. Perhaps I cannot know the anguish of these parents, but I imagine and sympathize nonetheless.

I don't think anyone is suggesting you must be a parent to understand...rather I think they are suggesting a mental stroll in the parents' shoes.....

[RICHARD]

I don't think anyone is suggesting you must be a parent to understand...rather I think they are suggesting a mental stroll in the parents' shoes.....

Well that certainly does me no good.

I don't get the pinch of new leather,
The blisters or cramped toes.

I think it's pretty brash to tell me that I cannot make an judgement because I have no children or baby goats.

Smashing you thumb with a hammer is one kind of pain.
Letting a loved one go is another kind of pain.
Customizing your child to escape pain is pretty effing selfish.

I am truly surprised that they didn't ask American Tourister for a
carrying bag for the kid...the kind on wheels so they dodn't hurt their backs.

[Pam]

WOW! I had not heard of this story until now. I am very conflicted about the whole thing and truly can see both sides. Of course being a mother maybe clouds my judgment a little. On the one hand I can see wanting to alleviate any pain for my child (what mother wouldn't), but it is quite another thing to subject a child to major surgery. Just having my daughter *go under* at the oral surgeon's office for wisdom teeth extraction was enough anxiety for me to go through.

My mother has been in a care facility now for about five years. In that time I have seen sights that are heartbreaking. One woman stands out. She is probably in her mid-30's and obviously with some serious neurological problems. She spends her days in a wheelchair amongst a mostly elderly population. I wonder what her parents would think of this story. I cannot even begin to judge the actions of these parents because, thank God, I am not in their situation. Though my mom is in an excellent facility, I have heard the horror stories that we all read about concerning nursing home abuse. I just don't know the answer. It would take the wisdom of Solomon to rule on this and none of us are qualified.

[Edwina's Secretary]

Customizing your child to escape pain is pretty effing selfish.

When my parents had my tonsils removed so I would be sick less and have less pain....all this time I thought they did it for me....Now you say, RICHARD, it was a selfish act (effing selfish in fact) on their part...so they could go square dancing without worrying about me getting sick I guess?

[RICHARD]

When my parents had my tonsils removed so I would be sick less and have less pain....all this time I thought they did it for me....Now you say, RICHARD, it was a selfish act (effing selfish in fact) on their part...so they could go square dancing without worrying about me getting sick I guess?

Those pesky tonsils that bleed monthy?

How was the ice cream?
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There is a huge difference between a tonsillectomy appendectomy or putting
PE tubes into an ear of a kid that will continue to grow and carving out the repro organs and giving the kid hormones to stunt her growth.

Why not go for the Deluxe package?


Catheterization, a colostomy bag and the tonsillectomy for the pill0w angel?

No more sore throat and soiled diapers?

Make it real easy.

[Edwina's Secretary]

There is a huge difference between a tonsillectomy

And what is the difference? Organ that will never be used? That will only cause pain?

There are far more "selfish" (your word NOT mine) decisions they could have made.

And you talk like menstruation is some great privilege....only a man...