Breeder Impressions

[applesmom]

Quote from new Junescrater in puppy thread. "The breeder we went to lived on a farm and had at least 30 pugs. They were sooo cute!!! She had geese, peacocks, cows, cats, roosters, hens, chickens, and a REALLY big dog. She has a horse too. The pugs were all well taken care of and happy looking. She had two bins which held at least 10, three-week-old pugs. There were two bins and they both had baby pugs in them. They were the cutest things I had ever seen!!! "

Quote from borzoimom in new puppy thread: "Breeders can have many dogs- and 3 litters- come on now- these are pugs- they would not have max 3 pups per litter- and usually that its 2 or even one."

This individual had at least one litter of eight week old pups for sale and at least 10 more 3 week old puppies in a batch waiting on the sidelines. Do the math! If litter size for pugs is only 2 or three--how many litters does this "breeder" actually have on the ground? How many have already been sold and how many more litters are already in the oven?

As stated in an earlier post on the new puppy thread; filth and neglect isn't the only criteria that should be used to designate a breeder as a puppy mill!

There has been no mention of health guarantees, replacement policies, spay/neuter agreements, take back policies, etc. What makes this "breeder" any different than a puppy mill breeder other than the fact that at the time of the visit, the dogs "appeared" to be well cared for?

The concerns aren't about one family purchasing one puppy from a for-profit breeder. As long as these types of mass production "breeders" are encouraged, there will never be an end to the pet overpopulation problem!

[junescrater716]

Sorry but CORRECTION!!!
Ollie came with a one year health guarantee. If he gets sick from any genetic health diseases then we will get a full refund and we will give the puppy back. If we want to give the puppy back within the first year we can because of the one year guarentee.

[borzoimom]

Junes- I do not think this is directed at you, but a thread to educate people that may not know what to look for. Having alot of dogs doesnt indicate the dedication to a breed- you just have more in your heart for a breed. Truth be told- I would have more than 4 borzois- without even thinking about it- without a blink...

[applesmom]

Sorry but CORRECTION!!!
Ollie came with a one year health guarantee. If he gets sick from any genetic health diseases then we will get a full refund and we will give the puppy back. If we want to give the puppy back within the first year we can because of the one year guarentee.

That's great! But let's try to keep this from being a personal discussion about any one particular dog and stick to the topic of breeder ethics.

What owner who's had a puppy for even one day would even consider sending it back for any health related reason, knowing that it would be put down if they did?

More and more breeders today are offering a replacement puppy for a dog with a genetic illness while allowing the owners to keep the first dog. That way the owners are still in control of its fate and not the breeder.

[wolfsoul]

I really disagree with genetic health guarantees that are so minimal. I offer a five year health guarantee against genetic diseases and a lifetime health guarantee against epilepsy. Most people do not health certify until the dog is over two years of age, as this is when most registries will accept testing -- you are basically being screwed over if the guarantee is two years or under because you can't even do the health testing UNTIL the dog is two.

[wolfsoul]

More and more breeders today are offering a replacement puppy for a dog with a genetic illness while allowing the owners to keep the first dog. That way the owners are still in control of its fate and not the breeder.

That is what I will do if I am ever in the situation where a puppy of mine has a genetic condition. They can opt to keep the dog or not, but it must come back to me if they don't.

[borzoimom]

I offered "guarenteed against genetic defects" with no age limit and " in the event the dog_____ is found to have a genetic defect of the hips, spinal, elbows, or genetic heart,or eye conditions, the buyer has the right to keep the dog, and on presentation of a two veternains report stating the genetic disorder, the buyer is entitled to a replacement puppy. "
"In the event a replacement puppy is not available from the seller,The buyer has the following options- can either accept a puppy from an approved breeder by the seller, or agree to wait until said puppy is available, or receive the purchase price of __________" .
" IN the event the dog purchased _________ dies in adult life, it is the understanding of the buyer to contact the seller as to the date of death, and cause of death. If the dog purchased is suspected of having the listed genetic disorders, a written statement by a practicing licensed veternarian may be requested by the seller. "