Ligers

[junescrater716]

I see nothing wrong with it. Ligers are beautiful creatures. They're more intelligent, more aggressive (which isn't very good but at least they can survive better), and like I said before beautiful!!!

[TFTpwnsYou]

A Liger is pretty much my favorite animal...with preferred skills in majic.

[Argranade]

Of course there beautiful animals but it's not normal,

It's weird how some looders think it's NOT ok to cross dogs then it's actualy ok to cross lion's & tigers, I think if it was a mistake that would be ok but if there doing it on purpose then that's just plain wrong.

So if someone put a dalmation and pug in the same cage and they breed & the person forgot there was a male and female, I geuss that would be a mistake too huh ...

[Pembroke_Corgi]

My issue with the link you provided isn't necessarily that the animal is a liger, but because the poor thing has a chain on it's neck. I don't think wild animals belong in any kind of circus act. It's upsetting for the animal and dangerous for the handler.

[Argranade]

My issue with the link you provided isn't necessarily that the animal is a liger, but because the poor thing has a chain on it's neck. I don't think wild animals belong in any kind of circus act. It's upsetting for the animal and dangerous for the handler.

Yeah that's also what pissed me off, now they have the poor thing in the circus.

[Husky15]

I don't know what to say about the crossing of Lions and Tigers -- it just sorta creeps me out. Lions weren't meant to mate with Tigers, but there really is nothing we can do.

I saw a picture of a Liger on Google one time and I really was surprised because I heard of them on Napoleon Dynamite, so I was like, "Holy crap! They do exist!" They are beautiful, though.

[Miss Z]

Creating ligers is all very well and they certainly are beautiful animals, but sometimes I think it would be far better to just try to preserve the ever diminshing number of tigers (and also, Asiatic lions, although I doubt that they use those to make ligers) before it's too late.

[sirrahved]

A Liger is pretty much my favorite animal...with preferred skills in majic.

You beat me to it

[TamanduaGirl]

It's not like tigers and lions are over populated breeds like dogs. They are also two different species, not breeds. They are better compaired to mules. Should no one ever breed mules then just because crosses shouldn't happen? Also tigers and lions do have cross bred in the wild in the nature reserves because their territories over lap there. It's not exactly full on wild but they are living wild in Africa. So it's not hurting anything. It's really nothing along the lines of cross bred domestics. Again it's cross species like mules or hybrid cats.

It DOES also help conservation. Most people just don't pay attention unless it's big and flashy. You'd be surprised how many people don't even know the difference between a tiger and a lion much less truly care if they survive in the wild. You see tigers and lions frequently in the media but they don't really pay attention or care. But they see something new and different and they get interested, ask questions, and learn about both species and their plight.

Second issue circuses. They are not mean and inherently cruel. You're pet is not abused by being taught tricks or doing them in front of people, agility shows, dog shows. I've even seen llama agility! In fact if you don't train your dog and interact with it it's considered neglect. Really it's the same for exotics. They get enrichment by learning and doing tricks. Even zoo animals are usually taught to do some simple things like target. You may not call it a trick but there's no real difference. The animal is being taught to do something on command.

So what is the problem? They have to travel? Lots of domestic animals have to travel too, again dogs shows, agility, just a family pet of a truck driver, petting zoo animals. Ours LOVED being in the zoo and raised traveling so they didn't mind it. They did better with it than we did. In fact the exotics were least phased by the traveling.

There's nothing wrong with a chain any more than there is with a leash ir a halter on a horse. None of those should be kept on all the time but there's nothing wrong with using them properly. Most of you in fact have exotics your cute little fish and birdies included. It's no worse for a tiger or lion born and raised in captivity than it is your fish stuck in a tank or bird in a cage. The animals get their exercise when they preform they are not working all year and have a home base that is usually very nice.

The elephants I worked around had a huge ranch they lived on and got to roam. They got their own big fancy airconditioned trailers while traveling and a special area set up at each location for them. They got breaks for food and water play time were even brought special things like up rooted stumps to play with. They weren't walking around in poop because someone was right there to catch it as it came out, HA. They were trained by giving sugar cubes. Anytime one did something they liked which included making noise they ran and gave a sugar cube. Weather on a command or not. Basicaly all they had to do was ask(trumpet) and they got a treat.

Are some performing animals abused. Sure it happens. Just like some pets are abused too. That does not mean all pets are abused or that it's abusive to own or train a pet. They enjoy the stimulation and interaction. They even enjoy the crowds. The elephants loved showing off for the crowds. After having lived around them awhile you could just tell they loved it. They were spunky and had personality. They weren't scared of their trainers.

Ligertown - yes it happened just like there are puppy mills but it not on so wide spread a scale. Really that was more like a horder case they weren't really even selling them they just collected/bred and kept and didn't know where to stop. There are still fewer big exotc incidents than there are domestic dog incidents and that is proportionately speaking too.

Road side zoo is ALL zoos as well. USDA deffinition does not make any exceptions. All zoos are by the side of a road.

As for the handler well sure it's dangerous but so is horse riding in fact pretty much all states have a law aknowlaging equestrian activities as inherintly dangerouse and so you can't sue if you get hurt. A person chooses to have or work with a large animal domestic or not and they do so knowing the risks. Like skydiving and driving. You know there are risks. People going to the shows know or should know there is some risk as well. And really you know that's why a lot of them go.

To say none one should have or bred ligers because someone abused theirs is faulty logic and to follow that no one should have dog because some abuse theirs.

If you don't want to see big cats abused or neglected then you should be against abuse not animal acts.

[borzoimom]

These road side shows, or traveling zoos seldom provide a healthy environment. More the road side places, or worse- the people that buy a wild animal as a pet. Not enough knowledge of proper diet or care. I have seen so many shows with this same message. And I fail to see how mixed two different species has anything to do with conservation. This is a man made situation- ... The only other cross species that I know can occur is a bobcat and a domestic cat. I have seen the kittens as this hit our local news and they had them pictures in the paper.

[BitsyNaceyDog]

The only other cross species that I know can occur is a bobcat and a domestic cat.

Horses and zebras can crossbreed too. There are also mules (cross between a donkey and a horse), which someone already mentioned. I'm sure there are others, but those are all I know of (or at least can remember at the moment).

[TamanduaGirl]

or worse- the people that buy a wild animal as a pet.

Well that happens to be me, and my Tamandua is very healthy and happy, thank you very much. It's also tons of my friends who have all manner of critters big and small who are also happy and healthy beings.

It's also impossible to have a "wild" animal as a pet. A wild animal is just that living in the wild. they are non-domesticated, exotic, and or tame but not wild. Most exotics are born and bred in captivity for many generations. Hamsters for example are exotic and have been bred as pets in the US not nearly as long as say fennec foxes have been.

As far as most owners and "roadside zoos" taking poor care of their animals, where do you get that? Where are the statistics and the study that generated them? Bad cases make the news good cases don't and it skews the public image. USDA regulates all mammal exhibition to the public. By Usda definition San Diego wild animal park is a roadside zoo. any stationary animal exhibit is. It's not like "puppy mill" where it automatically means something bad.

Most have standard conditions or better since they have to keep usda standards. I fail to see how a private owner or a smaller business than a zoo is automatically a bad owner. How are they worse? They tend to be more hands on and interactive with their animals. AZA Zoo's mostly have hands off policies now and the animals actually suffer for that. Having to be sedated for simple procedures because they try to keep them "wild" where as one kept more hands on is used to being handled and is less likely to need sedation for simple things and so avoid the risks and extra stress.

The only difference between an AZA zoo and any other is a slip of paid for paper. AZA is not a government agency. It's best classed as a guild like the screen actors guild. Big AZA zoos have special problems of their own. You have the zoo vet, nutritionist, keeper, and the money guy all arguing over what is best. Improvements are hard to make because you need all to agree. The keepers who work closest with the animals rarely get listened to. I know this from talking with keepers.

For the record a bobcat and domestic cat cross is impossible! There has never been a proven case. Not a single proven case with DNA. That would be easy if it were true. There's actually tons of hybrid cats but a bobcat/domestic is not one of them. A Pixiebob is just a nice looking bobtailed domestic.

[Argranade]

Cross breeding is wrong end of story, I don't hate the crossed animals but it's not right what humans are trying to do in this freaking earth, it's dumb & people still are not smart enough to stop this madness.

It's not like tigers and lions are over populated breeds like dogs.

No there not over populated there CROSS breed, that's the point.

Second issue circuses. They are not mean and inherently cruel. You're pet is not abused by being taught tricks or doing them in front of people, agility shows, dog shows. I've even seen llama agility! In fact if you don't train your dog and interact with it it's considered neglect. Really it's the same for exotics. They get enrichment by learning and doing tricks. Even zoo animals are usually taught to do some simple things like target. You may not call it a trick but there's no real difference. The animal is being taught to do something on command.

Most circuses use chains and electric shocks to control animals,

I went to a circuse in Toronto & the stupid man was using an electric poll at the poor elephants just so he could get them to do what he wanted, no matter how tame a lion is in a circuse it's still not right because these animals feel stress with all the flashing lights & screaming of kids .. I mean people should leave them in the wild .. I don't even like Zoo's anymore because I feel the animals should be free and not breed in captivaty.

These animals are dangerouse and if they show there natural anger to a human they will be killed for doing what only comes natural & I know its NOT fair, you have a exotic pet but it's not in stress & your not having flashing lights or strange people looking at it all day like in zoo's or circuses so there is a difference.

[#1Wolflover]

what alot of people don't know is that ligers tend to have more problems, hints the breeding of the lion and tiger, I wish I could find that article that says what complications ligers have. They are unhealthy animals I love all animals so don't get me wrong, ligers are cool but there breeders should be ashamed!

[Suki Wingy]

It's not like tigers and lions are over populated breeds like dogs.

I agree with your whole post except the first sentance. Tigers in captivity are incredibly overpopulated. There are nore legally owned tigers in Texas than in all of India.