Breeder Impressions

[Shelteez2]

I agree- but you know as well as I do, alot of agility shelties are over sized.. ( no I am not talking about anyones shelties.. just making a point...) And the people should not have bred them that size...

You are right there are many over sized shelties out there. Under sized ones too. Shelties are still a relatively new breed (in the grande scheme of things.... compared to say a labrador retriever) so they don't always breed true to type. Size is something many many good sheltie breeders struggle with.

I have two shelties. My female is from what I consider a byb. I didn't know better at the time. The breeder told us she wanted to get into breeding shelties. She had her female and used an outside stud. The dogs and pups were registered and the pups were sold on a spay/neuter contract.
I consider her a byb because the dogs weren't health tested and they were pet quality. The dam was in size, I don't know about the stud dog. My girl is 17" tall.

My male sheltie is from a very good breeder. She tests her breeding dogs and shows them in conformation. Pets are sold on spay/neuter contracts. My boys parents were both in size. The dam was 15" and the sire about 15.5". My boy is over sized. He is 18" tall. That's why I have him actually. The breeder was keeping him to show, but he went over size so he was sold as a pet. This leads to your other scenario

IF there is a person, with two shelties, both too big out of standard, but checked the hips, hearts, thyroids, - and breeds them- does this still fall under as a "backyard " breeder, or now 'upgraded' to a hobby breeder?

I would clasify them as a byb. They are not trying to improve the breed as size is such an issue in the breed to begin with.