City's police dog killed by county man

[shais_mom]

what an idiot!
I think he needs the book thrown at him and he should pay the city back for money they invested into Flip.
Maybe I watch too much CSI or Law and Order but part of me wonders if he had something to hide and knew the dog was a police dog and didn't want him being a dog and snoop it out.
ggrrr

[Pam]

what an idiot!
I think he needs the book thrown at him and he should pay the city back for money they invested into Flip.

That was my first thought too Stacy. Since he can't be jailed for being this stupid, hit him where it hurts - in his wallet. What a jerk.

[LilacDragon]

So let me understand this.

A POLICE OFFICER lets his dog out unattended, the dog wanders a quarter of a mile from the officer's home and you people are mad at the guy with the GUN because he felt the need to defend his child from a dog he didn't recognize that was in his yard!?!

Just for fun - would you be mad if the neighbor owned a large, powerful dog that got loose and wandered into the officer's yard and the officer shot it? Or would the neighbor still be an idiot - but this time because he left his dog out unattended?

[Cinder & Smoke]

So let me understand this.

A POLICE OFFICER lets his dog out unattended, the dog wanders a quarter of a mile from the officer's home and you people are mad at the guy with the GUN because he felt the need to defend his child from a dog he didn't recognize that was in his yard!?!

Just for fun - would you be mad if the neighbor owned a large, powerful dog that got loose and wandered into the officer's yard and the officer shot it? Or would the neighbor still be an idiot - but this time because he left his dog out unattended?

1) Flip wasn't just "let out, unattended" ...
He was turned out into his FENCED YARD - standard practice for the two Police Dogs *I* know.

2) Guy with gun "defending his child" ...
The "child" was quite SAFE - since he was still IN the car - not the yard ...

"Sheriff Mike Heldman said the man indicated the dog was not acting aggressively when he shot him.

"He said the reason he shot him was because he was concerned for the safety of his son, who was still in the vehicle," Heldman said."


HARDLY a situation requiring deadly force:

3) "Large, powerful, dog ..."
A Belgian Malinois is a relatively SMALL dog as compared to a German Shepherd "Police Dog" ...
A Belgian Malinois is a rather "friendly looking" dog - and unless acting under
Direct Command of his handler - would NOT have been acting in an agressive fashion ... the local State Park's BM Police Dog acts like a frisky pup when she's off-leash and having "play time".

4) Treece said it appears Saturday's incident could have been handled differently.
"There appear to have been better options," he said.

How true ... how sadly true.



/s/ Phred

[areias]

I tend to somewhat agree with Lilac. Although it could have definately been handled differently, no one was there. True no one here (I don't think...) would shoot a stray dog on their property. But in a place with more rural houses when there's a stray dog...if you let it go, what if it sticks around and endangers your child later on?

Some people don't like dogs, especially ones on their property. Also, police officers should keep a close eye on their dogs, especially because they CAN and DO attack unprovoked.

[LilacDragon]

[QUOTE]Belgian Malinois Breed Standard
Herding Group

General Appearance
The Belgian Malinois is a well balanced, square dog, elegant in appearance with an exceedingly proud carriage of the head and neck. The dog is strong, agile, well muscled, alert, and full of life. He stands squarely on all fours and viewed from the side, the topline, forelegs, and hind legs closely approximate a square. The whole conformation gives the impression of depth and solidity without bulkiness. The male is usually somewhat more impressive and grand than his female counterpart, which has a distinctly feminine look.

Size, Proportion, Substance
Males are 24 to 26 inches in height; females are 22 to 24 inches; measurement to be taken at the withers. Males under 23 inches or over 27 inches and females under 21 inches or over 25 inches are to be disqualified. The length, measured from the point of the breastbone to the point of the rump, should equal the height, but bitches may be slightly longer. A square dog is preferred. Bone structure is moderately heavy in proportion to height so that the dog is well balanced throughout and neither spindly or leggy nor cumbersome and bulky.

Temperament
Correct temperament is essential to the working character of the Belgian Malinois. The breed is confident, exhibiting neither shyness nor aggressiveness in new situations. The dog may be reserved with strangers but is affectionate with his own people. He is naturally protective of his owner's person and property without being overly aggressive. The Belgian Malinois possesses a strong desire to work and is quick and responsive to commands from his owner. Faulty temperament is strongly penalized. [QUOTE]


[QUOTE]
German Shepherd Dog Breed Standard
Herding Group

General Appearance
The first impression of a good German Shepherd Dog is that of a strong, agile, well muscled animal, alert and full of life. It is well balanced, with harmonious development of the forequarter and hindquarter. The dog is longer than tall, deep-bodied, and presents an outline of smooth curves rather than angles. It looks substantial and not spindly, giving the impression, both at rest and in motion, of muscular fitness and nimbleness without any look of clumsiness or soft living. The ideal dog is stamped with a look of quality and nobility--difficult to define, but unmistakable when present. Secondary sex characteristics are strongly marked, and every animal gives a definite impression of masculinity or femininity, according to its sex.

Temperament
The breed has a distinct personality marked by direct and fearless, but not hostile, expression, self-confidence and a certain aloofness that does not lend itself to immediate and indiscriminate friendships. The dog must be approachable, quietly standing its ground and showing confidence and willingness to meet overtures without itself making them. It is poised, but when the occasion demands, eager and alert; both fit and willing to serve in its capacity as companion, watchdog, blind leader, herding dog, or guardian, whichever the circumstances may demand. The dog must not be timid, shrinking behind its master or handler; it should not be nervous, looking about or upward with anxious expression or showing nervous reactions, such as tucking of tail, to strange sounds or sights. Lack of confidence under any surroundings is not typical of good character. Any of the above deficiencies in character which indicate shyness must be penalized as very serious faults and any dog exhibiting pronounced indications of these must be excused from the ring. It must be possible for the judge to observe the teeth and to determine that both testicles are descended. Any dog that attempts to bite the judge must be disqualified. The ideal dog is a working animal with an incorruptible character combined with body and gait suitable for the arduous work that constitutes its primary purpose.

Size, Proportion, Substance
The desired height for males at the top of the highest point of the shoulder blade is 24 to 26 inches; and for bitches, 22 to 24 inches.

The German Shepherd Dog is longer than tall, with the most desirable proportion as 10 to 8½. The length is measured from the point of the prosternum or breastbone to the rear edge of the pelvis, the ischial tuberosity. The desirable long proportion is not derived from a long back, but from overall length with relation to height, which is achieved by length of forequarter and length of withers and hindquarter, viewed from the side.


Approved February 11, 1978
Reformatted July 11, 1994
[QUOTE]

Hmmm. According to AKC's breed standard for the German Shepherd and the Malinois - size wise is dead on. Having spent several years in Germany and having worked with military police, I can tell you that a police trained Mal is a very intimidating creature and to someone who doesn't know dogs - they look very much like a GSD.

Look. I don't think the dog should have been shot. But none of us was there or knows what that man saw. Calling him a jerk, an idiot and stupid is kind of like him over-reacting to a loose dog, don'tcha think?

As for the dog being turned out in a fenced in yard "standard practice for the two police dogs" that you know - well that is nice to know.

If I let my dog out in my fenced yard and it escapes from my yard and threatens someone or makes someone feel threatened - that is MY fault and you can damn sure bet that the local police would feel free to impound my dog and issue me a ticket.

[4 Dog Mother]

I scanned the picture from the paper as they did not have the picture on line. As you can see Flip was not a "large, powerful dog" at all. The article also says he was gentle. I did not think so much that he was trying to protect something he had on his property but wondered if he had a gripe against the police officer or police in general




Issuing you a ticket and impounding your dog is quite a leap to shooting the dog and killing it. I still don't understand why he couldn't have called the police or since the man and dog lived there for several years, why he couldn't have called the dog owner.

[LilacDragon]

Ok. I give up and you are right. The shooter was at fault because he should have known that the dog was a police dog, was gentle and was awarded the special priveledge of wandering the neighborhood at will.

What was I thinking?

[critter crazy]

Ok. I give up and you are right. The shooter was at fault because he should have known that the dog was a police dog, was gentle and was awarded the special priveledge of wandering the neighborhood at will.

What was I thinking?

NO. definitely not! police dog or not, the dog should not have been wandering! but did he deserve to be shot??

[shais_mom]

Ok. I give up and you are right. The shooter was at fault because he should have known that the dog was a police dog, was gentle and was awarded the special priveledge of wandering the neighborhood at will.

What was I thinking?

I don't think there is any reason to be quite so nasty. You have your opinion and we have ours. I strongly still think this guy is an idiot simply b/c he shot first and asked questions later. Typical for this redneck-ish area. And yes, I live in the area so I am not un-educated in this matter. Trust me this isn't the first dog that was innocently happening along and was shot by the first redneck that sees it. It just makes the papers b/c it was a police dog.
I don't care if the dog looks like a pit or not - if it looked like a bear or a mountain lion - highly unlikely in this are- that's an entirely different story.
Its simply a case of "I say poe-tate-o you say pa-tat-o."

[LilacDragon]

That was hardly nasty.

As I said in my second post - I don't think that the dog should have been shot any more then you do. But the fact of the matter is that not everyone is as dog savvy as most of the members here and for whatever reason, this man felt that he needed to defend his son. Whether he was right or wrong - it is certainly no reason to call him names or refer to him as a "redneck".

[pitc9]

Ok. I give up and you are right. The shooter was at fault because he should have known that the dog was a police dog, was gentle and was awarded the special priveledge of wandering the neighborhood at will.

What was I thinking?

Ugh.... like THAT was Necessary

It was a horrible tragedy, the dog should have never been in that situation, it's sad any way you look at it.

RIP Flip.

[shais_mom]

I guess we will have to agree to disagree b/c only growing up 25 minutes from where this area doesn't give me any kind of clue to most of the people that live around there. Yup, I'm clueless.
RIP FLIP- play hard at the bridge.

[critter crazy]

I dont care what breed of dog it is, if a stray dog comes onto my property, my first instict is NOT to shoot it!! and yes i have kids! I make sure the kids are inside, and then i try to find out who/where the dog belongs! I have had akitas, rotties, labs, acd's, shepards, saint bernards, and many others come onto my property. I sure as heck didnt shoot first and ask questions later! If they are not friendly enoough to come to me, then I call animal control and they take care of the dog, but I have only had that happen once, and that was because the dog was hurt, and scrared. I could see if the guys child was in the yard, and the dog was acting aggressive. But the kid was in the car! and the guy left the kid in the car to go and grab a shot gun! He obviously didnt think the dog could get to the child other wise he would have taken the child in the house with him! The guy overreacted!! Seriously overreacted!

[Marigold2]

This is tragic any way you look at it. My dad used to help train police dogs. I got to play with them as a child. They are very well behaved, however I must say that after looking at the photo of Flip, he does look a bit like a pit bull and from far away say maybe 30 or 40 feet, I would be a little scared. Sorry all you pit bull lovers but the bred makes me nervous. Perhaps this man looking at Flip thought he had a pit ball mix on his hands and fired away. Very Sad.