Horrible experience @ pet store...

[Bronx'sBower]

Hey red (sorry forgot the spelling by the time I got here )....to answer your questions:
What breed is this puppy? When we adopted him they said he was a boxer-mix but as he has grown we feel he has a lot of german shepard in him (I also know both boxers and german shepards are vocal dogs...I think)

How old?
7 almost 8 months old and 60 plus pounds...

At what age was he removed from his littermates?
I can't really say because we rescued him when he was 3 months but the picture from the boxer rescue was from when he was 10 weeks...I think his previous owner got him a couple weeks prior to giving him up.

What sort of training class have you attended with the puppy?
I have done basic training between with my boss who is a vet and knows a bit about training but I know I did a bad thing by not getting him to an actual obedience class soon after getting him...He listened real well from the beginning and wasn't ever very vocal but now he is in his "teen" years and he is extremely vocal and can be aggressive towards me when we play...I do have his beginning obedience classes registered and he will start in early September...I know I know, shame on me for not doing it sooner right?

Where does this puppy live when you are at home?
When I am at home he has most free roam in and out (doggy door) but if he misbehaves or gets too excited he goes in his crate, 9 times out of 10 if he's gotten into something he shouldn't have he puts himself in the crate. He is a very good dog...when HE wants to be.

When you are not at home?
In his kennel-or his "bedroom"...when he gets excited we tell him to go to his room and he goes in the crate and rests until he's better.
How is he confined when he is outdoors?

How much exercise does he get in a day?
He gets a morning walk every morning around 8am, we have a super large yard he plays in with me during the day and then I walk him in the evening after dinner when possible. I understand that pups and dogs pent up energy when not exercised and because I know this he gets A LOT of exercise, it's the only way he won't act obnoxious. He does really well if we have to leave for a few hours and really well when we come home, he doesn't jump or bark. But when company comes over its a totally different story-I dread company. I don't know if he's consciously fighting for my attention or if he's really excited to see people-he only gets crazy when males come over? Coincidence maybe?

I have been trying to do as much training as I can before his classes start but I don't think it's sinking in because I don't think he thinks I am Alpha, ya know? Now when daddy is home he is on his best behavior and only "talks back" to dad occassionally-usually when he wants to dance or shake a paw. How can I gain my control back? It is really frustrating not being the Alpha or more importantly when your dog thinks he's Alpha-I think thats the main problem but would love to hear what you think. Am I a bad pet owner?

[Bronx'sBower]

I wanted to report her but the manager was agreeing with her. The manager said she will only use a shock collar and her dogs "are just fine"...

I said the same thing Aurie (sp? sorry i forget spellings easily)...why are they selling products they don't stand by? Not just the muzzle but the flea powder too. I think I will write the company rather than deal with the manager or employee again...

[i_rescue]

I've never heard of that kind of muzzle, but if your veteranarian says it's better than a shock collar, then you should have got it and just ignored the girl at the register. It pissed me off just reading about it. I can feel your madness!

[Ginger's Mom]

I've never heard of that kind of muzzle, but if your veteranarian says it's better than a shock collar, then you should have got it and just ignored the girl at the register. It pissed me off just reading about it. I can feel your madness!

I understand what you mean by she should have bought it anyway, but I would just disagree a little by saying I can understand her not buying it there. That store would not have gotten one penny of my money, and I probably would have been very pointed about leaving all of the items I had on their counter and walking away without taking my wallet out.

[Alysser]

Definatley report this nut case! First off, she was telling owners to let their dogs get infested with fleas?? What a idiot! How stupid is this women?!

You're NOT a bad pet owner! Do not listen to a word she says and I would not be the least bit embarrased by her. Shock collars, IMO, are very cruel! What's the point of shocking a dog until it stops? I highly doubt humans would liked to be shocked when the make mistakes. Muzzles are way more humane, and if your vetrinarian suggests this over the stupid shock collar then I say go for it, and do NOT listen to a word this idiot says! Report her immediatly and good luck.

[Bronx'sBower]

Thanks for all the wonderful advice and understanding...I am glad to know I am not as bad as the girl (who by the way didn't even look like she was out of high school) suggested. Someone pointed out maybe I could read some books...I have read quite a few mostly by Barbara Woodhouse but a more recent book is called "The Latchkey Dog". The Woodhouse books are a little out dated and I don't even know if some of the methods she talked about are used any longer. As for the last book I mentioned, it was a great book. It was like a guide, the most important part I remembered was that dogs bark for a reason not just to bark-usually (common sense really) but after we have exhausted all remedies he continues to bark. It isn't all the time but mostly when he gets riled up. It taught me and DH how to be the Alphas but it's almost like Bower chose who he thought Alpha should be, daddy. I am going to look at the links posted above and see if they can help me any. It makes no sense to me that when I worked and he went with me to work, he knew I was in charge but ever since I stopped working and staying home with him, he acts like this. Again it isn't all the time....Thanks again for all your support....and in regards to the reporting-I am definately contacting the company itself, it isn't like it's not a well known store (I know its michigan wide, not sure about nationwide), it just happens to be the only pet store in our city.

Also I agree that everyone is entitled to their opinion on the best ways to gain control, some don't like shock collars and some do....to each his own I think but for someone to tell me I am "an inhumane person" is absurd. Maybe a shock collar is the best idea, for some, I just don't know if it would help my situation or make it worse.

[RedyreRotties]

You want to be very careful with any muzzle that restricts the opening of the mouth. The danger of heatstroke is very real.

And yes, you are paying now for not going to puppy class early. Better late than never.

Personally, if I had a dog with whom barking was such an issue, I would have the dog surgically debarked and forget about it. Then the dog can bark all it wants without really bothering anyone. It certainly does not bother the DOG. They whisper bark away without a care in the world. They just dn't annoy people any more.

this is one of my all time favorite links about how to be the pack leader for your dog.

http://www.sonic.net/~cdlcruz/GPCC/library/alpha.htm

Dogs do not think like people, and you cannot raise a dog as you would a child. You are likely sending this dog a lot of mixed messages he can't figure out.

[bckrazy]

Personally, if I had a dog with whom barking was such an issue, I would have the dog surgically debarked and forget about it.

D: ugh. I hope I read that wrong! I know you've given great advice, Redyre, but that is seriously a drastic measure, no? A painful and invasive surgery should be the last resort, as should muzzles, IMO.

Fozzie started developing barkiness, as is the tendancy of his breeds, and it just takes time & consistency to stop the behavior. He doesn't get any sort of reward for barking, and he completely stops with a stern "shhh", and he's only 5 months old. Puppy classes are great for socializing and practicing basic Obedience with distractions, but to be honest a l l of that info is available on the internet (http://4pawsu.com/articles.htmp has a lot of good pointers) and in books, so that shouldn't be to blame for behavioral issues. It sounds like the biggest factor in this is that the puppy does not respect the OP, and he's most likely using barking and jumping as means to demand attention from her. So, start at the root of the problem and work on that using NILIF & frequent training sessions at home. If it is difficult for you, find a good behaviorist, as you can get an appointment much sooner than September for a pretty affordable price, just to get one-on-one advice.

[critter crazy]

Personally, if I had a dog with whom barking was such an issue, I would have the dog surgically debarked and forget about it. Then the dog can bark all it wants without really bothering anyone. It certainly does not bother the DOG. They whisper bark away without a care in the world. They just dn't annoy people any more.

You are not serious!!!! Surgically debarking a dog, is well....Just wrong!!! How could you do that, and feel like a responsible dog owner???? that just seems like a lazy way out!! Dogs can be trained! There is absolutely no just reason for this to be done!!!!!

[lizbud]

Personally, if I had a dog with whom barking was such an issue, I would have the dog surgically debarked and forget about it. Then the dog can bark all it wants without really bothering anyone. It certainly does not bother the DOG. They whisper bark away without a care in the world. They just dn't annoy people any more.

I view debarking the same way I do removal of dew claws, spay/neuter, tail docking, ear cropping, etc etc etc. To me, it gives the dog the freedom to bark joyfully whenever he wishes, without annoyance to the humans around him.

I can't believe you are being serious about this. Someone just
comes from out of the blue & says they are a dog trainer & what they say
is true. Who the heck are you anyway?

I don't know any legitimate Dog Trainer who has the time to fritter away
their hours posting on a Pet site.

[Aurie]

Here is a great place to start letting Bower remember he is the dog and you are the person: http://www.mysmartpuppy.com/ask-us/a...-grounded.html

After you have remaster the above, you can move on to here: http://www.mysmartpuppy.com/ask-us/a...-problems.html

Sarah and Brian are fantastic trainers with a great series of books. I highly recommend them. Good luck!

[sabies]

You are not a bad dog mom! You have recognized an issue with your dog and have taken steps to deal with it by discussing the situation with a vet and enrolling in classes.

Is there another pet store near you? I would not ever go there again if it's possible to avoid it. How rude of them. Why sell a product they disapprove of? The employee and the manager should be reported but if that's how they want to run their business then they will lose business.

I think you already know the problem - you need to learn how to be alpha. The obedience classes should help. Maybe you can find some good books? Sorry I do not have specific advice on this issue - my dog is the most pathetically submissive creature. I still had to learn to be a little bit of an alpha to get her to eat - submissive dogs expect someone to be alpha. I got good advice in the dog behavior section - feed her after I eat, do not look at her, leave the food for a set time period. Dogs interpret things very different from humans so your behavior without you knowing it says a lot. An expert can help you send the right message.