I need help

[Samantha Puppy]

Next, it does sound behavioral. Not medical, assuming the ruling out of anything medical was fairly recent. How many boxes, how are they situated, what kind of litter, ect. While maybe 1 year ago your cats didn't care what/when/why/how, maybe they do now.

Who knows, maybe he will be like Jonah, and not crawl, just walk?

I thought of that (that they didn't care then but do now). But changing litter/boxes/etc. makes me nervous because what if it upsets the cats that AREN'T doing this and causes them to start? Or what if it wasn't the problem at all and then I have four upset kitties?

As for Aidan (everyone does that! ) not crawling, I actually have a feeling that he'll be doing that for longer than the average baby. He might have some ankle issues, plus his eye issues may make him feel unstable on his feet. Not sure and he's nowhere near crawling as he still gets super-pissed when you put him on his stomach, but still... cat poop just outside the litter boxes in the basement was one thing. Cat pee on the main floor is another. *sigh* I'm not putting deadlines on myself, but I don't want to fool myself either.

Maybe the girls don't like me. May it's me they're acting out against. Maybe they'd be happier somewhere else. I don't know. I'm open to anything now, after a year of dealing with this. I just don't know.

[AbbyMom]

I'm so sorry you have to go through this.

Have you ever read the "Unabridged Guide to Litterbox Problems" from Cats International? I keep copies at the shelter and hand them out to people just like you who love their cats but still need to take action.

If you have not, read it before you go to bed tonight for ideas

http://www.catsinternational.org/art...ing/index.html

I agree with Cataholic that it sounds behavioral.

Since I don't remember your posts from July, can you repeat/share some info with us so we can help?

How many litter boxes do you have?

What type of litter? Do they all use the same litter? Do you use scented litter? I've met quite a few people that tell me their cat will only use XXX type of litter (fill in the blank..."Yesterday's News" or "Pine" "Sweatscoop" or clay...)

What depth of litter? Are all litter boxes the same? (One of my fosters hated it more than 1" deep because she couldn't stand the sinking feeling beneath her feet. My two girls now prefer to build sand castles )

Have you tried separating the litter boxes so someone could have a little privacy?

Is it possible one of your cats is harassing the others while using the litter box?

Are they located near anything noisy or scary?

I apologize if you've already been through this, but it sounds like you need to make sure you've covered everything.

Finally, are you willing to consider "drastic" litter box actions? My little RB Quasar, after some stress in her life, would only urinate on carpeting. The vet said some cats just prefer the way it feels. Anyway, we gave her cut up carpet squares in the litterbox to solve the problem. Of course, I had to constantly launder the carpet squares, but the rest of the house was safe.

We just need to figure out what's going on inside your cats' heads!

[Samantha Puppy]

How many litter boxes do you have?
We have two. I know the rule of thumb is one box per cat plus one extra but we started out with just two cats and the two boxes worked fine for them. Then we got the additional two cats to bring the total to four and didn't put out additional litter boxes until they'd been with us for about two weeks. We put out two more boxes but none of them used them. At all. So we figured they were fine with the two original ones.

Quick recap. We've had our two boys since October 2004. We got the girls (on a whim) April 2005. I was four weeks pregnant when we got the girls (didn't know it yet). From April '05 to July '05, things were fine. Then Josh and I took the boxes outside to clean and disinfect and Josh decided to put them in another location (just inside a doorframe from where they had been, so it's not like they were far away. We showed all the cats the new location. And then the pooping outside the litter box began, where the litter boxes had been. Nothing we did stopped it, so we moved the boxes back to that location thinking that's where they liked it. The pooping outside the litter box continued. We took them to the vet. They all got clean bills of health. We tried Feliway, different litter, cleaning it out often, not cleaning it very often, different depths of litter. The pooping outside continued until around February '06 and stopped, amazingly enough, for about 6-7 weeks. Then I shampooed the area of the rug in preparation for my son's baptism and within hours, there were several different poops on the carpet.

What type of litter? Do they all use the same litter? Do you use scented litter?
We use FreshStep. It's in both litter boxes. I'm not sure if it's scented or not. We just use the FreshStep with the blue crystals in it. Always have.

What depth of litter? Are all litter boxes the same?
The litter boxes are both the same - the domed "booda" ones with the "steps" going up into it. We've also tried taking the tops off in case they didn't like it. Didn't stop anything.

Have you tried separating the litter boxes so someone could have a little privacy?
They're domed, so they have privacy. And moving them is what originally began this mess so no, we haven't moved them since putting them back where they were.

Is it possible one of your cats is harassing the others while using the litter box?
I suppose it's possible, but not that I've noticed. As I said above, the boxes are domed and there is only room in there for one cat at a time, so there is limited means of harrassment.

Are they located near anything noisy or scary?
Nope, they're in a quiet alcove in our basement.

I apologize if you've already been through this, but it sounds like you need to make sure you've covered everything.
No worries at all. I appreciate the help.

Finally, are you willing to consider "drastic" litter box actions?
I guess we will if we need to, but you'll have to forgive me if I sound skeptical of anything that may be suggested. I just feel like we've tried it all and nothing is working.

That said, the pooping (and peeing) immediately outside of the litter box area is annoying. What has me extremely concerned is that Kimi (at least - she is the only one I've caught in the act) has begun to pee in the kitchen, which on an entirely different level of the house. It's spreading. What if it spreads to the living room so that carpet gets ruined? Or our bedroom, so that carpet gets ruined? I hate that the bit of carpet in the basement is ruined but that's not in a heavily trafficked area and out of view to guests completely. The living room isn't. Our bedroom isn't. Aidan's room isn't.

I'm just very, very frustrated. Kimi didn't pee there this morning but that's because I sprayed Chlorox bleach there and some orange-scented cleaner and left it there so it was wet. But I can't do that all the time - the floor in the kitchen is pergo and leaving it constantly wet makes it buckle and bubble (we learned that from a leaky fridge).

[emily_the_spoiled]

I know that Jen has been through this a couple of time and has "re-trained" her culprits. Maybe do a search for one of her threads or send her a PM asking her advice...

Can you have Kimi re-checked for a UTI (just in case)?

[Pawsitive Thinking]

Could it be their way of reacting to Aidan coming in and monopolising Meowmie?

[Samantha Puppy]

Could it be their way of reacting to Aidan coming in and monopolising Meowmie?

I thought that too. But it started last July, when I was only 3 months pregnant. And then it stopped earlier this year for almost two months - after he was born. So I don't know!

[AbbyMom]

When a cat pees someplace like a kitchen, they're trying to tell you something. It could be that they don't like Aidan, and I hope not. Let's hope it's something else.

What you need to do is make the litter box a preference over anyplace else in the house, regardless of their issues. I don't mean to make this sound simple, because it isn't.

Here are my suggestions:

First, some cats DESPISE the smell of disinfectants and perfumes. I learned this the hard way. One cleaning with a disinfectant and I had pee all over. I noticed in your recap below that the troubles first started when you cleaned and disinfected the litter boxes. The trouble started up again when you shampooed the carpeting.

So, buy a new litter box without a dome, and move it apart from the others, where the scent of the other litter boxes cannot be detected nor the smell of the carpet shampoo.

In the new litter box, start trying different litter types.

Try UNSCENTED clay litter. Some cats really hate Fresh Step with crystals. One of my foster cats would not go near it. I know your cats used Fresh Step successfully before, but cats can be just like people and change with age. (I didn't used to eat cooked carrots. )

If the clay litter doesn't do it, try the Pine. If that doesn't do it, try the Sweatscoop. Try the generic unscented scoopable from your grocery store. (This last one was the only one that my princess foster would use and you might want to try it first as it's probably less expensive.)

You mentioned that you tried different litter types before, but try again with a focus on the unscented.

I hope this helps. These are options I know from personal experience and also shared stories from volunteering that they sometimes work.

Thank you for working with your kitties and giving them a chance.

Good luck.