He-larry-ass

[RICHARD]

And to begin with, how in the world could I answer a question in behalf or the wrong-doings of other people?

A great start would be to ask questions and seek answers.

When I ask a question I look for the answers.

I check many sources and come up with what is sometimes a half-truth.

But I try to find out.

I saw a picture in Fridays L.A. times.
It was from an overseas protest-someone held up a sign that said-

Europe's the cancer-Islam is the answer.

Like, what was the question??

It's all a matter of holding up the mirror to one's face.

We all don't like what we see, but there are times when we have to admit we aren't the most attractive beings on the planet.

[lbaker]

Oh pish posh aren't there enough interpretations of "the written word" to keep us all busy? Whose writing? In which language? Whose interpretation? What about interpreting the scrawles on the walls? Oh, I digress.. that would bring up cave men and "intellegent design" hey, right Written word? How about what we hear and follow in our hearts ~ this is plum silly

[Lady's Human]

PCB, why do Christians sometimes take the Bible with a grain of salt?

The books were originally written in a smattering of ancient hebrew, aramaic, ancient greek, and a few other languages. They were translated into Latin, then translated into various other languages from the latin translations. Then they were translated into English from the "original" sources, and translated yet again into other languages. All this leads to some bitter arguments over what was said by whom when, and what the context was. There are sects of Christianity that are fully determined that THEY and only THEY have the true translation, and they have the copyright on how to worship. I don't think the Russian Orthodox or Greek orthodox churches have spoken to the Vactican peacefully in a few centuries, and we won't even get into the Coptic church.

One of my favorite faux pas from bible translations comes from a mid 20th century attempt to translate the bible into Arabic. When the translation was proofed, they found that they had published several thousand Bibles with a "minor" error due to the translation. The error? On the fifth day, God created armored tanks. Oopsie!

[lizbud]

I'm not sure what made you ask that question, but I'm confused. Where on earth do you get that from???

I have never once met a Muslim who treats dark-skinned Muslims (or ANYONE!!!) badly, or any differently, nor have I heard of anything like this. Really, I don't know where you get this from. If there are Muslims who treat Muslims of darker skin badly, then they are behaving terribly...not only against the people, but against their own faith.

This is EXACTLY why it is so important to study other religions. Partial knowledge is dangerous and causes confusion and wrong impressions. That applies to me too.

This is an example of what I'm talking about......

http://www.refugeesinternational.org...2779c166324e1d

It has been an ongoing problem for years.I don't know many muslims that
might be able to answer my question.

Don't want to hijack this thread, but saw an opportunity to ask a muslim
I know from PT. Thanks.

[Cataholic]

Liz- I couldn't believe that awful article.

I just don't get religion. Not at all.

And, as to 'hijacking' this thread, don't worry. I don't own the thread, just my posts in it. AND if the thread takes a turn away from what I originally posted? That just means there is more to talk about besides what I posted, and I would be the last person to indicate that was improprer.

[popcornbird]

Liz, that article brought me to tears. I had no idea of the situation in Sudan, but from what I read in that article, it is awful, and something I cannot comprehend.

The problem with the West...BIGGEST problem, in my opinion, is that they don't know ANYTHING about Islam...not one bit, don't know Islamic history, don't know what the Quran says, don't know fundamental Islamic beliefs, and from what I can see...don't even TRY to know or understand. When someone doesn't KNOW about something, and they hear something from the media like this, they automatically assume it is Islam. Assuming while not knowing is a terrible thing. ANYONE that KNOWS the rulings of Islam, anyone that has read the Quran, anyone that knows the biography of Prophet Muhammad, and about the lives his companions and followers lived would have a COMPLETELY different picture. The people this article tells about are committing a MAJOR sin in the eyes of Islam. When I know Islam, its rulings, and how much the religion is against such terrible crimes, how can I answer you when you ask me WHY some Muslims do these things? The WHY goes through my mind too. I think, "Islam says this...you say you're Muslim. WHY are you doing these things???" When one goes against their religious teachings, it makes me feel they don't truly believe in it, and are only a part of that faith because of birth, and not out of true understanding of the religion. Christians commit crimes, yet Christianity is never blamed. Jews commit crimes, yet Judhism is hardly blamed. Yet when a Muslim commits a crime, somehow, the whole world points their fingers at Islam. I know that some of you will say Christianity IS blamed at times, and that is true, but these days, on the media, all you hear is Islam being blamed. Everyone overlooks the actions of others. For that, I too want to ask WHY??? I am honestly getting quite sick of it.

[Lady's Human]

Islam winds up with the blame mainly because Imams are speaking out in favor of the crimes.(Not saying the Imams doing the talking are true muslims, but they say they are)

I'd put these Imams in the same boat as Torquemada (The Inquisition) and the various Popes who started the crusades.

[lizbud]

Christians commit crimes, yet Christianity is never blamed. Jews commit crimes, yet Judhism is hardly blamed. Yet when a Muslim commits a crime, somehow, the whole world points their fingers at Islam. I know that some of you will say Christianity IS blamed at times, and that is true, but these days, on the media, all you hear is Islam being blamed. Everyone overlooks the actions of others. For that, I too want to ask WHY??? I am honestly getting quite sick of it.

I think the fact that this is a horrible crime being done by muslims
against other muslims. That's what I don't understand.

[popcornbird]

I think the fact that this is a horrible crime being done by muslims
against other muslims. That's what I don't understand.

You don't understand this...but do you think I do? How can I possibly answer a question in behalf of people I have never seen, never met, didn't even know exist? Originally when you asked the question, I was wondering what/where Darfu is. I didn't even know that. I find it quite funny that anyone would think I'd have the answer to why these completely foreign people to me commit crimes. How would I know? And especially to ask me about people of African origin. I am not aquainted with a SINGLE person from that region. They are completely foreign to me. How could I know of people that are in another continent, where I've never been and never seen? Its a little ridiculous to ask me. They might claim to be Muslim, but there are over 1.5 billion Muslims in the world. I'm not accountable for what all of those people do. I'm a single little human being who is only accountable for MY deeads and actions, not anyone else's. I don't understand these terrible actions myself!

As to Imams not condemning them? Who are these imams anyway? I find it funny that the Imams that have always been famous to the Islamic world have always stood up against these things, yet the Imams that none of us Muslims know of until the media introduces them to us are the ones who support it. Who are these imams anyway? There are MANY hypocrites out there...MANY. Who is to say they are imams? Themselves? Generally speaking, an imam is NOT a religious leader. An imam is someone who leads the congregation in prayer. Just because someone's an imam, doesn't mean he's a scholar. Just because someone CLAIMS to be an imam doesn't mean he is. AND, I will stress on the fact that people in the West don't have a clue about Islam. If they did, they would be able to distinguish which imams represent Islam and which ones don't. If they did, they would know who's a hypocrite, and who is real. But of course, when people don't want to learn, they end up assuming, which leads me back to what my husband always jokingly says when people assume and end up being WRONG.

"Never assume...it makes an ASS out of U and ME."
*laughs*

I have come to the realization that THAT is the main problem and the main reason people blame Islam. Cause they're clueless and like to assume. When I am clueless about something and don't 'understand', I try to learn about it so I can have a deeper understanding. If people don't do that, they will continue to assume, which will lead to trouble. Lack of understanding, knowlege, and the 'who-cares attitude' and unwillingness to learn. Having partial knowledge is dangerous. Again, I stress on the fact that people need to either seek complete, proper knowledge of religions, cultures, and other people, or stay quiet. Speaking about stuff you do not know of is just wrong. It is like an engineer questioning and arguing with a knowledgable surgeon about what he's doing. Obviously, he wouldn't have a clue about the surgeon's years of education and training as he never studied medicine, so he would never understand, and would never be giving right 'arguments' either.

That being said...why are we hijacking this thread? Enough. I'm not posting here anymore. I'm not in the mood to argue or be questioned about things I am so strongly against myself. It just makes no sense to me.

[lizbud]

Calm yourself please. I did not ask to embarress or upset you. It's just
that you seemed to be welcoming to questions about Islam before and
went to great pains to answer questions for non-muslims.I apologize if
I offended you, that was not my intent.

[CagneyDog]

You know PCB, it's one thing to say this stuff and another to act on it.

Having partial knowledge is dangerous. Again, I stress on the fact that people need to either seek complete, proper knowledge of religions, cultures, and other people, or stay quiet.

Just from reading some of your posts around Pet talk I can honestly say that this is a fairly hypocritcal statement coming from you.

[K9soul]

Not trying to contribute to the 'hijacking' here, but I think PCB is always very willing to answer questions she can ABOUT her faith, but asking why certain people who supposedly are the same faith do certain things or act certain ways is something she can't answer, just as I can't answer why people of my faith or beliefs are able to do horrible things when it is against the faith's teachings. If someone said 'how come these Christians did this and this and this?' I really couldn't answer that either. And if I were asked that constantly I might get frustrated too. Didn't Hitler and his followers call themselves and believe themselves to be Christian? There is no way I could answer about how they could call themselves Christian and believe in the faith, and yet do the things they did. Just trying to see things from Pops' perspective.

[Cincy'sMom]

Since the hijacking seems to be the theme now, I'll jump in too...

I don't mean to speak for Liz, but I don't think she was trying to ask PCB specifically why "those people thought that way"., but more , is there a known history within the faith where these two groups do not get along.

In a less violent Christian example, Baptists and Catholic have very different even thought they are both Chrisitian faiths, espically when it comes to salvation. Although I am not Bastist, I have basic understanding of what these differences are and could do a basic overview. That isn't to say I could explain the thoughts of every person in either religion, but I think that is more onthe level of understanding Liz was looking for.

[K9soul]

That's a perspective I hadn't thought of it in (probably cause I was trying to see things from PCB's perspective), but that makes sense too. It could just be a matter of miscommunication/misunderstanding. Easy to do through writing, especially on emotional topics.

[Kfamr]

This whole thread made me giggle, too, Joh, thank you again!