My Overweight Cat needs help

[Catlady711]

Sorry to hear Cocoa is a diabetic.

On a more positive note sometimes if the glucose gets stabalized they can go off insulin after a year or two, but not all cats can do this.

You'd said on your previous visit the glucose was elevated, did you vet happen to mention what the result was that time? If it wasn't elevated much then the vet probably saw no other red flags to assume that Cocoa was going to become diabetic, only that the weight could cause him to get that way.

Where I work they tend to go with OM when the weight is the greater problem, and DM when the glucose is the bigger problem. Sometimes neither helps and the wheels of diabetes have already been set in motion before that.

Sad to say there are some vets out there that don't go to seminars, and keep up with the latest research on pet health/nutrition. I hope your vet isn't one of them and simply chose the best choice based on lab results and his experience at the last visit. If you really do feel your vet is the former then maybe look into finding another vet you can have more confidence in?

Either way I really hope the insulin gets Cocoa's glucose stabalized and eventually he could be one of those cats that doesn't have to stay on it permenantly.

Keep us updated, and thank you for posting the updates so far.

[Moesha]

I have a diabetic kitty, Morgan. He started at 8 units of insulin once a day and then went to 5 units twice a day. His food was changed to Purina DM (diabetic management). It took about 7 or 8 months, but gradually he was weaned off of the insulin. He's been off of it for over a year and a half now. I strictly regulate the amount of food he gets. In addition to the dry DM, he also gets a pinch of canned food in the morning and the evening. He always had his morning treat, but the evening was added when he started to get the insulin shots. He didn't mind the shots since he knew he was getting his canned food as well. In fact, he'd come and remind me when it was time. He still does. LOL I know that each cat is different, and Morgan's case isn't the norm, but I just wanted to let you know that diabetes can be managed. In fact, it's easier to do in cats than humans, because we can make sure they don't "cheat". Also, in case you haven't found it yet, here is a link with lots of helpful information about protein vs carbs in all different kinds of cat foods. Keep us posted!

[emily_the_spoiled]

I don't know where you are in IL, but maybe there is a vet college nearby that can provide you with some guidance about weight loss and diet?

[snowshoe2]

Our vet is at a clinic and at the last few visits I made with Cocoa we didn't see our "regular" vet because she was on sick leave. It was one of the other vets on staff that was seeing us. The first time Cocoa's glucose was 280. He said it was on the high side, but not concerned. I stated at that time I would start feeding more canned and a dry with less carbs, but he insisted I feed the OM almost saying that if I didn't Cocoa would be in for numerous health problems which scared me. After all he was the vet and I thought he would know best. So I said I also wanted some OM canned, but even that has a higher carb content than some dry foods.
It wasn't until after this that I started researching feline obesity and how certain foods can contribute to it and diabetes.
On the follow up visit, luckily our original vet was back in and she has a diabetic cat herself. She pretty much confirmed what I have read about feeding a low carb food and said herself that OM was a bad choice for Cocoa. She also didn't push DM when I told her I was going to be feeding him a quality canned food and very limited dry.
Moesha, yes I have read the info at that site and also have been using Janet & Binky's Food Charts to compare different foods.
Cocoa seems to be doing ok, but he surely doesn't like the insulin shots. I'll be taking him back later this week for a re-check on his glucose. I hope it's stabilized.

[Jessika]

Ahha I might be able to help since I just had a test over carbs, protein and fats today.

Carbs and protein both equal the same amount of energy. Fat equals 2.25 more energy than carbs or protein do. Excess fat in the diet gets stored in the muscle and liver and excess carbs gets stored in muscle whereas excess protein just gets flushed out of the system. I would obviously stick to the diet your vet prescribed, but typically you'd want a diet higher in fiber to help weight loss. At least, I hope I got all that right, otherwise I probably didn't do so hot on my test

But not all fat is bad. It is actually an essential nutrient for the body so don't always assume since theres more fat that it means it's unhealthier. Obviously there are exceptions to everything but typically it's more beneficial than not

Good luck getting him back down to a healthy weight!!!

[Sonia59]

I did not have time to read in details all the PTers' comments to your thread, so forgive me if I say something that has been said already.

One thing that could help your kitty not jumping on the food is to have him hunt for it: put some dry food in a ball that has a little hole and kitty will have to play and make the ball roll to get the food. The kibbles will go out one by one so kitty will eat slowly and will be busy "hunting" so he will eat less.
If I understood well you give him both wet and dry food. Cats have a satiety for dry food and a satiety for wet food. So, if you feed your cat with one type he will ask for the other type even if he is not hungry. If you want your kitty to efficiently lose weight you should give him dry food only.

[snowshoe2]

Sonia59 thanks for your suggestion, but I have to disagree on your theory that dry food will help with weight loss. Canned food is much more like a felines natural diet and also provides much needed liquid. It also has fewer carbs. Funny how most people (including me) used to think that can food should only be given as a treat, when in reality it's dry food that should be limited and given only occasionally as a treat, if at all.
Here's an article that will help you understand feline nutrition.
FEEDING YOUR CAT

Cocoa goes to the vet today for his glucose check.

[Jessika]

Sonia59 thanks for your suggestion, but I have to disagree on your theory that dry food will help with weight loss. Canned food is much more like a felines natural diet and also provides much needed liquid. It also has fewer carbs. Funny how most people (including me) used to think that can food should only be given as a treat, when in reality it's dry food that should be limited and given only occasionally as a treat, if at all.
Here's an article that will help you understand feline nutrition.
FEEDING YOUR CAT

Cocoa goes to the vet today for his glucose check.

But with wet food you have to be very careful to pay special attention to their dental care. I will always recommend dry food over wet food for many reasons, the main being dental care. But if your cat is REFUSING to eat dry food, you may want to look into reasons why -- are they in pain? Are their gums tender? Do they have a loose tooth? A broken tooth? Cavities? Those are reasons to feed wet food... also obviously it has more water, but even with dry or wet food kitties don't generally drink a lot of water so I would always recommend feeding dry food over wet food unless there is a medical reason for it, or you are very good at caring for their teeth.

[CultureJunky]

I've just read this post, and I'm sorry Cocoa is having a tough time and has been diagnose with diabetes.
Excercise wise perhaps you could put 15 minutes a day (twice) aside to play with him (and the others if they join in too) things like ping pong balls, and string toys with feathers are excellent excerciser toys and stimulate natural stalking behaviour in cats.
I think if he had those active sessions it would be good for him and you and bring you closer together. Just persevere if he's not very active.

Sunny is not active at all, but we play with her every day before bed (this is when she actually wants to play and enjoys it) with a ball and also a mouse string toy, she loves the string and will jump up in the air to catch it.

Perhaps this would help with cocoa? and also I think getting a harness and seeing if he'll go out for a walk is a great idea. Jack had a harness and would go out for walks, he really liked it. Though obviously it's not for every cat. SO you'd have to see if he took to it.

Good luck and please keep us posted about him. He sure is a handsome fella.

[Emeraldgreen]

Hi Snowshoe2, I'm so sorry to hear about Cocoa's diabetes and continued weight problem. I hate to say it but my Paddy is also still very overweight and I'm concerned about the possibility of diabetes if I don't get this under control. I'm REALLY interested in how Cocoa does on the wet food as it is something I might try with Paddy too. He LOVES his crumbles just a little too much. And, I've picked up a new food (yesterday) by Eagle Brand Holistic duck and oatmeal and it costs quite a bit so free feeding for everyone is done and scheduled bowls of kibble will be given in the a.m. and p.m. and I'll do my best to make sure Paddy just gets wet food.
My main goal right now is to get him to lose just a few pounds so I can at least get him into his harness so I can take him out for exercise. I was stunned when I went to put on his harness, that fit him in January, and found that it was now too small.
I'm praying that your beautiful Cocoa will lose weight and that his insulin will stabilze. Please keep us updated, we're all routing for him!!

[Freedom]

Just catching up on all this. I am sorry about Cocoa being dignosed with diabetes, it is a lot to cope with and to learn all at once.

Just wondering if you are testing blood glucose at home with a glucometer?

There IS an on line pet diabetes forum, I've seen it mentioned here on Pet Talk as well as on other forums. You may find some good info from folks there? Here is the link, in case you are interested:

http://www.petdiabetes.net/


Here is the chat room on the above site: http://www.petdiabetes.net/chatroom/chatroom.html


From your posts, it sounds like the OM made things worse and by taking Cocoa off that, you may see a rapid improvement. I pray that happens!

I laughed when I read Sonia's post about 'hunting.' I bought one of those balls for my Sparkle when she was overweight. It took her less than half an hour to figure out that she could hold the ball poised with one paw, be LYING DOWN, and just rotate that paw to get the kibble to drop out in front of her! They really CAN be amazingly smart; when you don't WANT them to be!!!

I have a cat on a prescription diet, cats on managed intake, and cats who can eat what they want. I use 3 bedrooms, a bathroom and a hallway at cat feeding times. Doors get closed. After a few days, the cats learned where their feeding station was and made a point of going to it. (Alright, have to admit one pudgy kitty kept insisting on entering with the free feeders then I had to pick him up and carry him to HIS room.)

I feed 3 times per day: when I get up in the morning about 7 AM, at 4 PM and just before I go to bed, usually about 10 PM. The cats on restricted diets have a set amount they can eat in a 24 hour period, and that just put out in small installments.

I hope you can find a method which works for you, Cocoa and the other household members!

[snowshoe2]

But with wet food you have to be very careful to pay special attention to their dental care. I will always recommend dry food over wet food for many reasons, the main being dental care. But if your cat is REFUSING to eat dry food, you may want to look into reasons why -- are they in pain? Are their gums tender? Do they have a loose tooth? A broken tooth? Cavities? Those are reasons to feed wet food... also obviously it has more water, but even with dry or wet food kitties don't generally drink a lot of water so I would always recommend feeding dry food over wet food unless there is a medical reason for it, or you are very good at caring for their teeth.

Claims that cats have less dental disease when they are fed dry food versus canned food are grossly overrated, inaccurate, and are not supported by recent studies. Many veterinarians are coming to the realization that this is a myth that needs to be dispelled. First, dry food is hard, but brittle, and merely shatters with little to no abrasive effect on the teeth. Second, a cat's jaws and teeth are designed for shearing and tearing meat, and cats that eat dry food grind it in a way that it ends up between their teeth. There it ferments into sugar and acid, thereby causing dental problems. Third, many cats swallow the majority of their dry food whole and thus receive minimal benefit from chewing motion. There are many factors that contribute to dental disease in the cat such as genetics, viruses, and diet. There remain many unanswered questions concerning the impact of diet on dental health, but feeding a high carbohydrate, species-inappropriate dry kibble diet is a negative factor, not a positive one.

I can attest to this fact, because Cocoa was fed a dry only diet for his first 9 years and last year he had to have 4 teeth pulled due to severe dental disease. So the myth of dry food keeping teeth healthy is just that, a myth.

I have not started home testing Cocoa yet. I am just getting used to the fact of having to give him insulin injections twice a day, but perhaps in the future that will be something I will do.

I have been trying to get him to be more active, he has lost all interest in toys as it was becoming very hard for him to move much. He and his brother Bandit both never did go for the laser type toys. They figured that one out from the start. Why chase something when there's nothing there to catch, lol.
But he always did enjoy going out for walks on his leash. Hopefully the weather will start getting better and I can once again start taking him outside for a little each day.

Emeraldgreen I hope you are able to help your Paddy with his weight. Do you feed him canned food? If not, I highly recommend you give it a try. Eagle Pack Holistic makes a good canned food too. If you would like some help choosing some let me know and I'll help. Giving Cocoa canned food has greatly reduced his desire for his kibble and he was an kibble junkie before. In fact I am now feeding some canned to all my cats everyday and I can see positive results in them all.
Freedom, thanks for the links, I will read through them as I am on a mission to find all the help I can for Cocoa.

Thank you to everyone for your concern and support for me and Cocoa. I'll keep you posted on his progress.