Daisy attacked Baby!.... When will the fighting END!!!

[tikeyas_mom]

I cannot believe that we are running into this problem AGAIN! We have already had to muzzle baby for being female dog agressive, and now we have to muzzle Daisy too!!! GR

Lately I have noticed a few small changes in Daisys personality, she has been challenging the other dogs for there food/treats/toys, (she goes very close to the others dogs and stares into their eyes, lowering her head, untill they give up the object she wants).. I assumed she was just starting to be more dominant, because she is getting older now. I always made sure to give her trouble when I seen she was challenging the other dogs for their food/toys/treats.

This is what happend.

From what I understand Baby was asleep on the couch, my mom called her and she got up and stepped on Tikeya *Who was laying on the floor*. Tikeya Growled at Baby, and then Daisy sprung up and started attacking Baby from underneith!!. My mom said that Daisy was biting repeatedly at Babys legs from under her.

My mom yelled at Daisy but she wouldn't let up. Baby was trying to bite Daisy back, but she had her muzzle on (thank god for that).
My brother ran into the living room right when he heard the ruckus and threw his shoe towards the dogs to break up the fight. Daisy ran outside and hid in the bushes, and Baby cowered.

Baby has three puncture wounds, and one cut. Noithing really serious, but as we all know Babys last small wound turned into that horrible Ganegreen infection wich almost killed her.. so we are watching these wounds VERY closely.

I never thought Daisy would do this sort of a thing, but now I am affraid she may not stop because now she knows Baby cant defend herself because shes in a muzzle. So I am affraid Daisy may take advantage of Baby.

I never thought that Daisy would be aggrassvie like this either, she is VERY fearfull of everything, I never would have though she would instigate a fight.


I am so fed up with these dogs fighting all the time.. I really dont know what eles to do now.. I have Daisy in one of Babys old muzzles, but she gets it off very easily.. I am thinking of consulting a beahviourist, but we dont have alot of money to spend on a private trainer..

[shais_mom]

I'm honestly sorry to hear this - you don't need this right now in your stage of pregnancy. Your going to be having a lot on your plate in the next few months- please don't "yell" @ me for saying this but have you thought of rehoming one of them? Or separating them?
This is what happens (so I've heard) when you have 3 females in a household. Which one is dominant? And does the other one want to be 'queen'?
I know you don't believe in disposable pets and neither do I. I'm absolutely against it. BUT your first priority in the next few months is your new son. And if something would happen to him if the dogs get into it - you would never forgive yourself or the dogs. I'm not implying that the dogs or the baby are 'more important' but BOTH are 'helpless' and both of them need YOU to do what's right for them.
I wish you LUCK from the bottom of my heart.

[Hellow]

Hmmmmmm, perhaps adding a male dog will stop the fighting?

[tikeyas_mom]

shais_mom, our living situation is a bit complicated right now.. My boyfriend (Ebony, Daisy, and Tikeya) and I are living with my parents, and their Two dogs (Baby, and Oscar). I have honestly thought that we may have to rehome one of our dogs.. But we cannot bring our selves to do it. I could never give up Tikeya, and my boyfriend would never give up Daisy or Ebony.. Its just really hard. I do think that Daisy may pose a problem with a new baby in the future because she is so fearful, but there has to be another option rather then to rehome her. She is so young *3 years*. And I figure she would be to fearful to rehome anyways, she would never trust anyone. We dont know anyone who wants her, because everyone we know is affraid of her.

Having four large breed female dogs in one house, is really hard to deal with. The only one female that doesnt want to be alpha is Ebony. Tikeya, Daisy, and Baby all want to be Dominant. Baby and Tikeya have had some really bad, bloody battles in the past over being alpha.. And niether of them want to give up. Now Daisy is deciding she wants to be alpha too.. so now we have three females who are going at it... I'm so frusterated.

Reggie: There is one male dog in the house already, his name is Oscar hes my moms little Shih-Tzu.

[luvofallhorses]

How old is Daisy? pit bulls usually don't mature until they are 2 years of age dog aggressive wise. sometimes when they mature they don't get along with other dogs and your mom yelling probably added fuel to the fire and your brother throwing the shoe probably didn't help either. do you have a crate to put Daisy in while you're not able to watch her? I am sorry this happened.. but are any of the dogs on NILIF and YOU need to show them that you are the alpha and not any of them. you have to be top dog in your house and I would start NILIF.

[shais_mom]

shais_mom, our living situation is a bit complicated right now.. My boyfriend (Ebony, Daisy, and Tikeya) and I are living with my parents, and their Two dogs (Baby, and Oscar). I have honestly thought that we may have to rehome one of our dogs.. But we cannot bring our selves to do it. I could never give up Tikeya, and my boyfriend would never give up Daisy or Ebony.. Its just really hard. I do think that Daisy may pose a problem with a new baby in the future because she is so fearful, but there has to be another option rather then to rehome her. She is so young *3 years*. And I figure she would be to fearful to rehome anyways, she would never trust anyone. We dont know anyone who wants her, because everyone we know is affraid of her.

Having four large breed female dogs in one house, is really hard to deal with. The only one female that doesnt want to be alpha is Ebony. Tikeya, Daisy, and Baby all want to be Dominant. Baby and Tikeya have had some really bad, bloody battles in the past over being alpha.. And niether of them want to give up. Now Daisy is deciding she wants to be alpha too.. so now we have three females who are going at it... I'm so frusterated.

Reggie: There is one male dog in the house already, his name is Oscar hes my moms little Shih-Tzu.

thank you for replying to me and not thinking that I'm just trying to be a bad guy altho in my email instant notification I did see the symbol which upset me b/c I didn't intend to make you mad at all. Rehoming one of my animals would be like cutting an arm or leg off - I couldn't imagine - so I did not suggest it lightly...
you DO have a lot on your plate right now -
I didn't realize there were so many dogs in the mix - adding a male to the mix would just make things worse.
There's a person in market place I think that is a animal psychologist.
http://petoftheday.com/talk/showthread.php?t=130834 send them a PM -
it can't hurt.
and again I say GOOD LUCK.

[Catty1]

tikeyas mom - less expensive than a trainer. Nancy Efrusy - she is a pet psychic that has a lot of credibility on PT. efrusy (the At symbol) yahoo(dot)com

She should be back from holidays any time now. Her rates per animal are goo, and she is flexible. She will read first and take payment later.

Just email her a pic of the animal; she is great at getting a sense as to what is going on in their minds, and sometimes the pet even has a suggestion as to what would make things better for them.

Maybe crate someone for now?

[tikeyas_mom]

thank you for replying to me and not thinking that I'm just trying to be a bad guy altho in my email instant notification I did see the symbol which upset me b/c I didn't intend to make you mad at all. Rehoming one of my animals would be like cutting an arm or leg off - I couldn't imagine - so I did not suggest it lightly...
you DO have a lot on your plate right now -
I didn't realize there were so many dogs in the mix - adding a male to the mix would just make things worse.
There's a person in market place I think that is a animal psychologist.
http://petoftheday.com/talk/showthread.php?t=130834 send them a PM -
it can't hurt.
and again I say GOOD LUCK.

No, you did not make me mad at all, we have honestly been thinking of all of our options. Your right adding another dog to the mix would most definatley make things alot worse, I would imagine. We dont need 6 dogs in the house anyways, as much as I would love to have a puppy . Thansk for the URL link, I'll check it out.

Catty1, I mean no disrespect, but I honestly dont really believe in the powers of pet psychics.

luvofallhorses, Daisy is three years old, so she is starting to mature.. I can really see it in her behavior, she isnt acting as much like a pup as she once was.. she is alot calmer lately, less mischievous.

[Seravieve]

I know its so hard when one dog attacks another. We've had multiple instances where Zeke (we assume he gets jealous..) attacks Bunny out of the blue.. like she's walking across the living room and he's laying down. The next minute he has her pinned against the wall and there are little tufts of B hair on the carpet.. And He's also attacked Eli a couple times. Probably within a month or so that we got Eli.

He never does any major damage.. Eli now has three puncture scars on his right cheek but other than that.. not a big deal. Im not too sure what Zeke's problem is.. or your dog(s) for that matter. I'd just watch them more closely.. We watch Zeke like a hawk.. he does tend to give of a low warning growl before anything else.. so we usually catch it then.

One observation though.. Daisy could have attacked Baby because she saw Baby as weaker than her because she is confined by a muzzle. So Daisy thought that she could gain dominance, etc while Baby was 'weaker'.

Maybe 5 dogs is just too many with your living situation and the certain dogs you have.. I vaguely remember in the last Attack post that you had mentioned you'd be moving out sometime.. And that will definitely help end all of this stress. Maybe you could separate the dogs by baby gates or something.. Not sure what kind of house you are in.. but maybe one group upstairs, and one group downstairs.. Something like that so they wouldn't all be together, at least until they can get along.

I too agree that adding another dog would only worsen the situation.. why add a new dog to a group of unstable dogs.. that'd just create more chaos and problems. And I'll never resort to telling you to get rid of one of them.. It's like giving up a child.

Might just have to invest in multiple muzzles for a while.. =) I see an order for 4 muzzles in your future..
Im sorry that youre in this situation.. and I feel your frustration!

[Varga]

Have you read the books by Jan Fennell? She has a great understanding of dogs and it might help you to follow the advice she has in her books. Mostly it's about how you make small changes in your daily routine which make it obvious to your dogs that you are the alpha and not one of them.

It might be worth a try.. But obviously.. I still think a consulting a behaviorist is even better.

[tikeyas_mom]

Maybe 5 dogs is just too many with your living situation and the certain dogs you have.. I vaguely remember in the last Attack post that you had mentioned you'd be moving out sometime.. And that will definitely help end all of this stress. Maybe you could separate the dogs by baby gates or something.. Not sure what kind of house you are in.. but maybe one group upstairs, and one group downstairs.. Something like that so they wouldn't all be together, at least until they can get along.

Yes, we are definatley looking to move out ASAP. But, as of now we haven't found one place for rent that will allow our three dogs. Alot of home owners have turned us down as soon as they hear we own a Pitbull. I have already tried to seperate the dogs with a baby gate but, since we spend most of our time upstairs the dogs HATE it when they are confined to the basement. They just enmd up jumping the gate, or knocking it over to get upstairs. They are part of the family, and crating, or locking them away from everyone just doesnt really seem fair to us..

[Seravieve]

I totally understand having troubles finding a place that will allow dogs.. muchless three of them. And I know.. they do tend to jump the baby gate.. just a thought. We use one at night to keep the dogs upstairs.. but otherwise, if we are downstairs and we lock them up there, Zeke will jump it.. A behaviorist might help.. just seems that all dogs are different. Jealousy might have played into it.. and Daisy seeing her as the weak one in the group..

Sounds like you're between a rock and a hard place.. shoot. I have my fingers crossed for no more dog fights in your household!

[Catty1]

In Calgary, the Humane Society has a list of pet-friendly rentals; try your local ones. Having some letters of reference from your vet and/or a past landlord can't hurt either.


Also, how about placing an "Accomodation Wanted" ad? You can spell out your situation, offer references on the dogs (if you can get them, or offer to pay a small extra deposit or something). That way, if and when someone calls, they'll already know what the deal is with pets. (If the pittie has been with you since puppyhood, that's good to mention).

HUGS

[Canis-Lupess]

Splitting dogs up in the same home where there are unresolved issues is not a wise idea because this prevents the dogs from ever resolving the isssue and, if they come into contact again, they'll carry on where they left off. It's not really a viable option and any pet behaviourist would probably advise against it.

The problem seems to be that the pecking order is not stable between the female dogs and this is what they are trying to sort out.
Sometimes, the way the human owners treat the dogs can create more confusion and, in turn, more aggression in order to try and create a stable heirachy.

There is one female who is obviously not interested in climbing the ladder or is too submissive to want to try. It's the others really that things need to change more with.
You need to decide who is naturally the most doominant and has the advantage over the others and then who comes second, then third. You might need to watch the dogs for a few days to see how they act around each other generally. The signs are often very subtle so look carefully.

Once you've found out the order they presently seem to be in even though it sounds like things are a little too evenly matched and are probably made more unstable by the inconsistent way in which they are treated by the humans of the house, you need to emphasize this by treating them as such. no. 1 gets fed first, fussed first, groomed first, even let off and put on lead first when walked and generally treated as higher thanking than no. 2 by yourselves. This must involve every person in the house. Obviously, they need to know you are boss although this dominance thing between owners and dogs is being abandoned by behaviourists as rubbish, the dogs still need to know you aren't the push over type so they are more likely to respect your decision on who is higher ranking amongst them.
No. 2 will be fed, fussed, put on lead, taken off lead, groomed, everything you do with them before no. 3 and if you fuss one and a lower one tries to push in for attention, the lower one should be ignored because this is a more subtle way of trying to climb the ladder, it is not about jealousy. The more attention you can command, the more dominant you are in other words. If one dog can steal the attention of an individual away from another, that dog has won the test of who deserves that individuals attention the most.

You must stick rigidly to these new rules because the dogs won't forget and will notice if you slip up.
I had to do this when my two bitches went through a bad patch years ago and they stopped fighting and I never had a problem since and I could leave them alone together fine without issues.

[tikeyas_mom]

In Calgary, the Humane Society has a list of pet-friendly rentals; try your local ones. Having some letters of reference from your vet and/or a past landlord can't hurt either.


Also, how about placing an "Accomodation Wanted" ad? You can spell out your situation, offer references on the dogs (if you can get them, or offer to pay a small extra deposit or something). That way, if and when someone calls, they'll already know what the deal is with pets. (If the pittie has been with you since puppyhood, that's good to mention).

HUGS

Actually I already have three ads placed in papers already for "accomodation for mature couple wanted" lol. I mentioned that pet/dog must be allowed. we own three very well behaved pooches, and baby boy on the way as well. Noone has yet replied, We have had the three ads placed for about two weeks now.. I hope that somone who is a dog lover, or who just doesnt care either way will call soon.

I have been checking rent finders, homefinders for my area and even areas a couple hours away for ANYTHING that might allow pets and we just havent had any luck.. Everyone seems to allow cats, some allow a small dog, just not large breeds, or more then one..