Canine Dental Care?

[cyber-sibes]

I called for a quote from our vet about having a broken/tarter-covered molar extracted from Star. Since she is 10, we want anything she needs done at once so she wouldn't have to be sedated more than necessary. My jaw about hit the floor - his receptionist said he wants to extract up to 6 teeth that are fractured/broken. She'll get the rest cleaned.

SIX teeth? I'm stunned - that seems like a lot of teeth to extract. Will the poor girl be able to eat? I'm sure he knows what he's doing, I just wasn't prepared to hear SIX teeth.

Anybody ever had any experience with multiple teeth extracted?

[CathyBogart]

My neighbor's dog recently had to have about nine teeth extracted. My poor neighbor was so worried. But Frannie still eats well and her breath is very nice now and she's just...happier. My neighbor said she didn't realize how much the teeth must have been bothering her until after they were removed and Fran cheered up dramatically.

It's not that unusual to have to do a lot of extractions on an older dog, even one that has had excellent dental upkeep throughout their life. They can chip their teeth on toys, sticks, bones, anything they put their mouth around...they can plane their teeth down with tennis balls (those make for some WIERD looking X-rays!), and it's amazing how many other strange ways dogs can damage their teeth.

I'd like to have MY Star's broken teeth extracted, unfortunately she has broken her canines, which can be very traumatic to remove, so for now we're just watching her and them carefully.

Good luck to your Star with her surgery!

[cyber-sibes]

Thank you for your reply- I feel a little better. Star's always had such nice white teeth, and has never been a chewer, but we think she must have damaged her teeth years ago when our neighbors had a walnut tree and she seemed to love eating the walnuts. She doesn't seem to be having any big problems, he's just concerned at the amount of tarter built up on the broken one, that it could really make her sick if it gets infected. If we're going to put her under, we may as well do it all.

[borzoimom]

Its better to remove the tooth that has a problem than to leave it in. If the infection hits the root of the tooth, the dog will also have diareah as well as the above- .. they will figure it out. You will have to soak the food or as directed by the vet at first until the gums heal but really- healthy teeth are better..
It is strange a vet would suggest anethesia at age 10 though.. hmmm.

[Catlady711]

It is strange a vet would suggest anethesia at age 10 though.. hmmm.

What's so strange about it?

Dusty had her teeth cleaned at age 11 and 14 with no complications. We did lab work first to make sure there weren't any problems we needed to know about first, used a mild tranq. and mostly isoflorane to keep her lightly sedated so we could work.

Jack had his teeth cleaned at age 6, and Pooky & Bear (age 5) go in tomorrow for cleaning.

The head vet at our hospital has been in practice for over 30 years, and in that time done a vast number of dentistries and extractions, with anesthetic, on pets up to 19 years old!! In all that time had only lost ONE patient.

Star SHOULD have anesthetic especially if they're going to extract teeth! However I'd want pre-op blood work done first if the hospital doesn't already require it.

Here are excerpts from the AVDC (American Veterinary Dental College) and their policies as well as law on dental cleaning...


"Companion Animal Dental Scaling Without Anesthesia


In the United States and Canada, only licensed veterinarians can practice veterinary medicine. Veterinary medicine includes veterinary surgery, medicine and dentistry. Anyone providing dental services other than a licensed veterinarian, or a supervised and trained veterinary technician, is practicing veterinary medicine without a license and shall be subject to criminal charges.

This position statement addresses dental scaling procedures performed on pets without anesthesia, often by individuals untrained in veterinary dental techniques. Although the term “Anesthesia-Free Dentistry” has been used in this context, AVDC prefers to use the more accurate term Non-Professional Dental Scaling (NPDS) to describe this combination.

Safe use of an anesthetic or sedative in a dog or cat requires evaluation of the general health and size of the patient to determine the appropriate drug and dose, and continual monitoring of the patient. Veterinarians are trained in all of these procedures. Prescribing or administering anesthetic or sedative drugs by a non-veterinarian can be very dangerous, and is illegal.
Although anesthesia will never be 100% risk-free, modern anesthetic and patient evaluation techniques used in veterinary hospitals minimize the risks, and millions of dental scaling procedures are safely performed each year in veterinary hospitals."

[Glacier]

I agree with Catlady711; I don't see anything strange about the suggestion. If Star needs dental work, she needs to be knocked out for it! I would get the pre-surgical blood panel. I get it done on all my critters, regardless of age if they need surgery. Not only gives me some reassurance for that procedure, but gives the vet a baseline to start from in case something else goes wrong in the future. It's come in handy a couple times!

We've had a few dentals around here. Muskwa has broken two canines. We removed the one on his upper jaw. The other one is on his lower jaw and is an extremely complicated removal(the tooth roots are wrapped around his jawbone). My vet doesn't want to touch that one until it bugs Muskwa. He has no trouble eating or chewing up a treat at this point.

Kayleigh has had two molars removed. She came to us with a stick wedged between them. The pressure damaged her teeth, along with eating who knows what while her first owner starved her! They were removed a couple years apart as they started to bug her and cause chewing problems. She was eating her normal food and chewing on tennis balls within a few days!

[cyber-sibes]

I remember when Kayleigh had that toothache, doesn't seem like it was all that long ago. After he showed me Star's tooth last year, I've thought about Kayleigh often. The quote included pre-op bloodwork and after care antibiotics & oral rinses, I asked.

I discussed my concerns about anasthesia for her with the vet several months ago. She's very healthy and active, I think she can handle it ok. If she was sick or weak, I might just skip having it done, but I think I'm more worried about her becoming ill from bad teeth. She hesitates taking food often enough that I wonder if her teeth might already be painful.

Thanks for posting about other older dogs going through this. It sounds like they do ok, even with a some teeth missing, huh?

I've never had dental work done on any of my animals, but it's being emphasized more these days. I want my girl healthy and with me as long as possible. They can't schedule it for a month or so, but I want it done before we move so she can recover comfortably in her familiar space.

[CathyBogart]

Yep, older dogs do fine, and as long as the vet clears her for anesthesia I don't see anything wierd about it either. My Star is almost 11, and we're looking at probably having to remove her canines in the next few years.

[Cincy'sMom]

Aa far as dogs doing okay with missing teeth, has my mom ever shown you Jack's mouth? He had been chained at some point before they rescued him 4 years ago, and evidently gnawed quite a bit at the chain. All of his from lower teeth are worn down to almost nothing, and his lower canines are not much either. He does fine with hard kibble and other food and treats.

[cloverfdx]

Our Penny (9 yer old JRT x) is in today having a tooth out and a general checkup. As long as the dog is healthy there should be no problems.. and it is not weird for a 10 year old to go under GA .

Goodluck for when the time comes.

[cyber-sibes]

We'll keep our paws crossed Jenny does just fine!
Star's scheduled to go in at the end of March.

[wolfsoul]

Visa had one tooth extracted last month. It went well, was a strange surgery to watch though.

We have some ladies that come into the shop and do teeth for us without putting dogs under -- they often extract teeth without anasthetic. If it's the right tooth, it's easy and causes only minimal discomfort. Most vets will charge alot for a tooth extraction when the tooth can be pulled out in one small tug. Visa's tooth was not at all hanging, took them half an hour of yanking and sawing with a power tool -- I can't imagine paying the same amount for a quick tug.

[Catlady711]

We have some ladies that come into the shop and do teeth for us without putting dogs under -- they often extract teeth without anasthetic. If it's the right tooth, it's easy and causes only minimal discomfort. Most vets will charge alot for a tooth extraction when the tooth can be pulled out in one small tug. Visa's tooth was not at all hanging, took them half an hour of yanking and sawing with a power tool -- I can't imagine paying the same amount for a quick tug.

I'm not positive on Canadian veterinary law other than what this site says, but I know for the US it is accurate. So what you described would be illegal here in the US at least.

American Veterinary Dental College

Companion Animal Dental Scaling Without Anesthesia


In the United States and Canada, only licensed veterinarians can practice veterinary medicine. Veterinary medicine includes veterinary surgery, medicine and dentistry. Anyone providing dental services other than a licensed veterinarian, or a supervised and trained veterinary technician, is practicing veterinary medicine without a license and shall be subject to criminal charges.


This position statement addresses dental scaling procedures performed on pets without anesthesia, often by individuals untrained in veterinary dental techniques. Although the term “Anesthesia-Free Dentistry” has been used in this context, AVDC prefers to use the more accurate term Non-Professional Dental Scaling (NPDS) to describe this combination.


Owners of pets naturally are concerned when anesthesia is required for their pet. However, performing NPDS on an unanesthetized pet is inappropriate for the following reasons:


1. Dental tartar is firmly adhered to the surface of the teeth. Scaling to remove tartar is accomplished using ultrasonic and sonic power scalers, plus hand instruments that must have a sharp working edge to be used effectively. Even slight head movement by the patient could result in injury to the oral tissues of the patient, and the operator may be bitten when the patient reacts.


2. Professional dental scaling includes scaling the surfaces of the teeth both above and below the gingival margin (gum line), followed by dental polishing. The most critical part of a dental scaling procedure is scaling the tooth surfaces that are within the gingival pocket (the subgingival space between the gum and the root), where periodontal disease is active. Because the patient cooperates, dental scaling of human teeth performed by a professional trained in the procedures can be completed successfully without anesthesia. However, access to the subgingival area of every tooth is impossible in an unanesthetized canine or feline patient. Removal of dental tartar on the visible surfaces of the teeth has little effect on a pet’s health, and provides a false sense of accomplishment. The effect is purely cosmetic.


3. Inhalation anesthesia using a cuffed endotracheal tube provides three important advantages – the cooperation of the patient with a procedure it does not understand, elimination of pain resulting from examination and treatment of affected dental tissues during the procedure, and protection of the airway and lungs from accidental aspiration.


4. A complete oral examination, which is an important part of a professional dental scaling procedure, is not possible in an unanesthetized patient. The surfaces of the teeth facing the tongue cannot be examined, and areas of disease and discomfort are likely to be missed.


Safe use of an anesthetic or sedative in a dog or cat requires evaluation of the general health and size of the patient to determine the appropriate drug and dose, and continual monitoring of the patient. Veterinarians are trained in all of these procedures. Prescribing or administering anesthetic or sedative drugs by a non-veterinarian can be very dangerous, and is illegal.
Although anesthesia will never be 100% risk-free, modern anesthetic and patient evaluation techniques used in veterinary hospitals minimize the risks, and millions of dental scaling procedures are safely performed each year in veterinary hospitals.


To minimize the need for professional dental scaling procedures and to maintain optimal oral health, the AVDC recommends daily dental home care from an early age. This should include brushing or use of other effective techniques to retard accumulation of dental plaque, such as dental diets and chew materials. This, combined with periodic examination of the patient by a veterinarian and with dental scaling under anesthesia when indicated, will optimize life-long oral health for dogs and cats.


For general information on performance of dental procedures on veterinary patients, please read the AVDC Position Statement on Veterinary Dental Healthcare Providers, which is available on the AVDC web site (www.AVDC.org). For information on effective oral hygiene products for dogs and cats, visit the Veterinary Oral Health Council web site (www.VOHC.org).

[cyber-sibes]

Thanks, Catlady711, that was very informative.
Wolfsoul, the tooth that is half cracked off is one of Star's large molars, no way no how is a tug going to get it out! This is a job for powertools. I'm glad I won't be there to see it, I'd probably freak out when they start in with the saws.
I feel bad for her that so many have to come out. I'm wondering why none of her previous vets ever brought this up? Oh well, it's time to take care of it.