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Thread: James is here!

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Richmond, Virginia
    Posts
    371

    James is here!

    Ok, James the dog has been dropped off at my house. He's being very submissive. Am I right to be chalking that up to him not really knowing us? He's never used a crate before, but he seems to be using that as his safety place.

    Oh, I dunno, I'm probably just being an overprotective pet owner. I'm so used to Bailey being so affectionate with us, but I suppose he's never really had that before. He seems confused and worried, but Bailey seems to be ecstatic. She wouldn't stop giving him kisses for the first 20 minutes he was here.

    Well, I am off to check on the pups again. It's been an extremely long day (we were at a wedding, the reception, the after party), I'm gonna get to bed.

    I'll give you another update tomorrow. Hope you are all having a good night!

    R.B. - Bailey (pit bull/lab mix) (08/?/2002 to 02/02/2005) and Guinness (chow/sheperd mix)

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    State College, PA
    Posts
    5,911
    Yay!!!
    Is it official, or just a trial run with James??

    I'm sure you can chalk up his submissiveness to just being a little timid of his new place. It was an adjustment for him, I'm sure!!
    Wonderful news that Bailey is giving him kisses--sounds like the will be great friends.
    Emily, Kito, Abbey, Riley, and Jada

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2000
    Location
    U.S.A.
    Posts
    8,055
    I agree with lovemyshiba,
    He has to get use to you and his surroundings.
    Can't wait to see updates.


    ----<---<--<{(@

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Richmond, Virginia
    Posts
    371

    Hmmm....

    Just a trial run....we are taking care of him for the couple this week...and deciding if we want to keep him permanently or not.

    Well, so far, he's being extremely timid. He's completely afraid of my husband. Bailey keeps barking at James trying to get him to play, but he won't move.

    I put him in the crate last night and he wouldn't come out. I tried coaxing him out with treats and he wouldn't come out. I tried for almost an hour, cause I knew he needed to go out. Finally, I had to put the leash on him and pull him out of the crate.

    After he was out, he was still timid, but he did go out and potty. When I brought him back in, he tried to go straight to the crate but the door was closed. He settled for laying down in a corner next to the crates.

    He'll barely come out of the bedroom now. He would only eat when I brought the dishes to the door of the bedroom.

    I keep trying to talk to him in a soothing voice and a happy high pitched voice. He's just so afraid. Every time we go to pet him, he acts like we are going to beat him or something.

    We might try taking Bailey and James to the dog park today to see if he'd like that. He seemed to do ok there with the lady who's been taking care of him so far.

    For anybody who's reading this, I REALLY need some more advice about dealing with a REALLY timid dog. This is a really different experience for me, because I've never dealt with a dog who wasn't at least somewhat confident

    R.B. - Bailey (pit bull/lab mix) (08/?/2002 to 02/02/2005) and Guinness (chow/sheperd mix)

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    State College, PA
    Posts
    5,911
    Do you know his background??
    Was he abused ever??
    If so, that may be the explanation for some of his actions.
    Abbey retreated to her crate a lot when she first came to live with us, but always wanted to go out and potty and EAT!!!

    I hope someone else can offer you some better advice.
    Emily, Kito, Abbey, Riley, and Jada

  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Modesto, Ca
    Posts
    6,769
    I don't have any good advice because most of my dogs have been outgoing. I have had some very timid cats, though. I would say just keep doing what you are doing. I think in time, you'll prove yourself to James.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Richmond, Virginia
    Posts
    371
    love my shiba, to answer your question, yes, the lady and her husband who have had him so far think he was abused. They think he has a definite problem with men, as he seemed to be afraid of her husband for a while. Also, he was hit by a car in front of their house, that is how they initially found him.

    R.B. - Bailey (pit bull/lab mix) (08/?/2002 to 02/02/2005) and Guinness (chow/sheperd mix)

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Buffalo, NY
    Posts
    1,093
    Sarah Wilson has a very good article on her website, I think it would definitely be worth a read.

    http://www.greatpets.com/home/dogs/b..._problems/fear

    and from Brian Killcommons.

    http://www.greatpets.com/home/dogs/b...p?articleId=63

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Buffalo, NY
    Posts
    1,093

    Patience

    Dealing with a very timid dog myself has taught me a few things. Let's take it from the dog's perspective.

    I used to get (hit/chained/left alone/abandoned) at times. I am never sure if someone is going to (hit/chain/leave alone/abandon) me. Sometimes humans are nice, sometimes they are not.

    I was hit by a car (boy did that hurt). Someone picked me up (boy did that hurt) and took me to someone else to fix me (boy did that hurt).

    Someone took me home with them (I still hurt but it's not as bad). She seems to be nice, but other people have been nice before and still hurt me. She gives me food (it is hurting less) and pets (that's kind of nice) and water. I'm starting to get the hang of this - food, water and pets (this is kind of nice).

    We went somewhere else and it's okay because the nice lady is still there. I kind of like the other dog - he's kind of nice. I'm a little nervous so I try to jump on the sofa to get away and he is still coming. I'm scared (what if he hurts me?) so I growl a little. I'm still okay because the nice lady is still here - the one that feeds and pets me.

    Oh no - where did she go? I'm in a strange house with different humans - sometimes humans are nice, sometimes their not. I'm scared. I think I will crawl into the corner where no one can hurt me. She feeds me, but other humans have fed me and then hurt me. How do I know for sure? I think I better hang out here until I figure it out.

    I know it can be frustrating, but the most important thing with a shy dog is patience. Calm, matter of fact and slow movements are the key. Let James come to you when he is ready, don't force him. Make sure he knows from day one that you are alpha but you are not going to (hit/chain/leave/abandon) him. If he wants to crawl in the crate, let him. Feed him there. Take him out without Bailey for a while. Be very matter of fact with him. It will take some time, but it is well worth it.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Miami, Florida
    Posts
    4,427
    just give james some time. im sure that he will come around.. Just be really calm when your with him no sudden movements ect.. thats so sad.. how can people be so cruel with animals? james i hope you get to know them a little better

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Kelowna, BC
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    12,069
    Good for you for taking care of this poor baby!

    Just stay really calm. Don't have company for a while. Make no sudden movements. Maybe you and him and Bailey could have a quiet time where you just sit there with them and stroke them both calmly. Let him get use to his surroundings, and then after a couple days, try walking him around out of the house. Maybe if he sees Bailey happt to go for walkies, he'll perk up a bit.

    There was a time when I had to leave my dog Leather for a while. When I got her back, she seemed to have been hit. Everytime I put my hand in the air, she would squint and look away and shiver. So I held my hand up lots, and every time she thought I would hit her, I brought it down and stroked her. After a while she understood that no one would hurt her anymore.

    Good luck!
    I've been BOO'd!

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Wylie, Texas USA
    Posts
    5,170
    Also just use a common everyday voice. This was key yo getting Millie to trust us and it never reinforced any unwanted behavior. We think a baby voice or a really soft voice will calm them down, but it reinforces behavior. Use a normal everyday talking tone, just a tad slower and calmer. Our behavior taught us this and Millie responded to it pretty quickly. We still use it in stressful situations. Also, try to let him get used to you first and when he trusts you, then you allow your husband in. All the while using the calm, but normal voice, telling James that everything's ok. Took a bit of time with Millie, but she's great now. Good luck!!

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Buffalo, NY
    Posts
    1,093

    Thought I would show you:

    Here is the difference a little time and patience can do

    Penny Lane on her first day home - hiding under the table


    Penny Lane several weeks after - look how relaxed and happy she is!!!



    Now don't get me wrong - for every 2 steps forward there is one step back. Penny still gets spooked easily and the fight with Leo definitely didn't help, but when I see her relaxed and happy, it makes it all worth it.


    And Micki76 is absolutely correct - using a calm everyday voice.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Richmond, Virginia
    Posts
    371

    Even more problems

    Well, it was a really long day yesterday. He ran away from us twice, but luckily each time, I caught him.

    I now have an even bigger problem. Bailey is peeing! I think it might be out of jealousy or something. When I go to pet him, she starts to get all up in his face, licking him. I try to give them both attention. When I do this, she just gets a look on her face, backs up and practically pees on him!

    This happened 6 times yesterday! She's never done this before. He on the other hand, has not had one accident in the house.

    My husband is soooo not liking this situation.

    R.B. - Bailey (pit bull/lab mix) (08/?/2002 to 02/02/2005) and Guinness (chow/sheperd mix)

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Richmond, Virginia
    Posts
    371

    Ok, Now I really think Bailey is sending a message...

    My husband just called me at work....So, I REALLY think Bailey is jealous....

    James is finally warming up to my husband a tiny bit this morning after I left for work. I had already taken Bailey and James out for a walk and they both did their business.

    Bailey started barking at Brian because he was petting James, then she bit my husband (nip, not enough to draw blood), then she peed in the bedroom!

    While my husband was cleaning the bedroom, BAILEY WENT IN THE KITCHEN AND PEED IN JAMES' FOOD DISH!

    My mother in law said last night that she thought Bailey was doing the "any attention, even negative attention, is attention". But the thing is....we are still giving Bailey loads of attention!

    **sigh** this is gonna be a long week.

    R.B. - Bailey (pit bull/lab mix) (08/?/2002 to 02/02/2005) and Guinness (chow/sheperd mix)

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