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Thread: Politics and religion.

  1. #1231
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    Interesting article from the N.Y. Times -

    July 21, 2009
    Op-Ed Columnist

    Liberal Suicide March
    By DAVID BROOKS

    It was interesting to watch the Republican Party lose touch with America. You had a party led by conservative Southerners who neither understood nor sympathized with moderates or representatives from swing districts.

    They brought in pollsters to their party conferences to persuade their members that the country was fervently behind them. They were supported by their interest groups and cheered on by their activists and the partisan press. They spent federal money in an effort to buy support but ended up disgusting the country instead.

    It’s not that interesting to watch the Democrats lose touch with America. That’s because the plotline is exactly the same. The party is led by insular liberals from big cities and the coasts, who neither understand nor sympathize with moderates. They have their own cherry-picking pollsters, their own media and activist cocoon, their own plans to lavishly spend borrowed money to buy votes.

    This ideological overreach won’t be any more successful than the last one. A Washington Post-ABC News poll released Monday confirms what other polls have found. Most Americans love Barack Obama personally, but support for Democratic policies is already sliding fast.

    Approval of Obama’s handling of health care, for example, has slid from 57 percent to 49 percent since April. Disapproval has risen from 29 percent to 44 percent. As recently as June, voters earning more than $50,000 preferred Obama to the Republicans on health care by a 21-point margin. Now those voters are evenly split.

    Most independents now disapprove of Obama’s health care strategy. In March, only 32 percent of Americans thought Obama was an old-style, tax-and-spend liberal. Now 43 percent do.

    We’re only in the early stages of the liberal suicide march, but there already have been three phases. First, there was the stimulus package. You would have thought that a stimulus package would be designed to fight unemployment and stimulate the economy during a recession. But Congressional Democrats used it as a pretext to pay for $787 billion worth of pet programs with borrowed money. Only 11 percent of the money will be spent by the end of the fiscal year — a triumph of ideology over pragmatism.

    Then there is the budget. Instead of allaying moderate anxieties about the deficits, the budget is expected to increase the government debt by $11 trillion between 2009 and 2019.

    Finally, there is health care. Every cliché Ann Coulter throws at the Democrats is gloriously fulfilled by the Democratic health care bills. The bills do almost nothing to control health care inflation. They are modeled on the Massachusetts health reform law that is currently coming apart at the seams precisely because it doesn’t control costs. They do little to reward efficient providers and reform inefficient ones.

    The House bill adds $239 billion to the federal deficit during the first 10 years, according to the Congressional Budget Office. It would pummel small businesses with an 8 percent payroll penalty. It would jack America’s top tax rate above those in Italy and France. Top earners in New York and California would be giving more than 55 percent of earnings to one government entity or another.

    Nancy Pelosi has lower approval ratings than Dick Cheney and far lower approval ratings than Sarah Palin. And yet Democrats have allowed her policy values to carry the day — this in an era in which independents dominate the electoral landscape.

    Who’s going to stop this leftward surge? Months ago, it seemed as if Obama would lead a center-left coalition. Instead, he has deferred to the Old Bulls on Capitol Hill on issue after issue.

    Machiavelli said a leader should be feared as well as loved. Obama is loved by the Democratic chairmen, but he is not feared. On health care, Obama has emphasized cost control. The chairmen flouted his priorities because they don’t fear him. On cap and trade, Obama campaigned against giving away pollution offsets. The chairmen wrote their bill to do precisely that because they don’t fear him. On taxes, Obama promised that top tax rates would not go above Clinton-era levels. The chairmen flouted that promise because they don’t fear him.

    Last week, the administration announced a proposal to take Medicare spending decisions away from Congress and lodge the power with technocrats in the executive branch. It’s a good idea, and it might lead to real cost savings. But there’s no reason to think that it will be incorporated into the final law. The chairmen will never surrender power to an administration they can override.

    That leaves matters in the hands of the Blue Dog Democrats. These brave moderates are trying to restrain the fiscal explosion. But moderates inherently lack seniority (they are from swing districts). They are usually bought off by leadership at the end of the day.

    And so here we are again. Every new majority overinterprets its mandate. We’ve been here before. We’ll be here again.
    David Brooks

  2. #1232
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    Interesting article indeed Grace. Hopefully commentary like that will help more people to realize that blind loyalty to the parties does WAY more harm than good. Neither party has any idea who "mainstream" America is anymore. The result of career politicians, living a life not even close to what we do?


    On another note...

    http://www.upi.com/Top_News/2009/07/...8611248259706/

    My favorite part...

    "White House Chief of Staff Rahm Emanuel told The New York Times Obama intends to use the news conference as a "six-month report card," to talk about "how we rescued the economy from the worst recession" and the legislative agenda moving forward, including health care and energy legislation."


    Do they REALLY believe that? Do they really think we are that stupid? In my eyes, it can be only one of two things... Either they really are that stupid, (not very likely at least not for ALL of them to be so) or things are going exactly as they planned. Either way, not good.... eh?


    Things need changed... The healthcare system in the US needs fixed, we need to change our energy policy, wars need to be ended... But everybody OUTside the beltway is starting to realize that what they are and HOW they are doing things simply cannot work.

    But now BOTH sides of the aisle have been duped. Time for people to put the parties by the wayside... Time for the people to get rid of these worthless, career politicans who know not and CARE not for our way of life.
    "Unlike most of you, I am not a nut."

    - Homer Simpson


    "If the enemy opens the door, you must race in."

    - Sun Tzu - Art of War

  3. #1233
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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cNFWR...eature=related


    Again, I apologize for Baba Boxer and her ilk.

    What a piece of work and as someone posted on that site, Yes, us Cah lee fuh nee ahs are effed with this witch in charge.

    Notice, at the beginning of the exchange that Alford calls her 'ma'am' and this DB doesn't bother to correct him, like she corrected the General a while back.

    This is the kind a-holery that we have to put up with in the Great State of ours.

    Between her and Feinstein-who just got a bill prohibiting the transport of firearms across state lines- are a disgrace to many, if not all women who represent the people in their states.

    Feinstein has a permit to carry a CW, yet she won't allow people in her own state to arm themselves?

    What a golden crock of crap. I can hardly wait for the next elections.

    I hope the people take up brooms, shovels, pitchforks and pointy sticks and get rid of both these abominations.


    Morons.


    -----------

    I have to make an apology here.

    BO was talking about a red pill/blue pill analogy, I thought he was going to bring out the woman from the first Matrix movie. I yelled at the TV before he changed tact and started to talk about the 1/2 price pill being better.


    Gosh, he may have a point with his HCR talk!
    Last edited by RICHARD; 07-22-2009 at 07:34 PM.

  4. #1234
    Quote Originally Posted by RICHARD View Post
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cNFWR...eature=related


    Again, I apologize for Baba Boxer and her ilk.

    What a piece of work and as someone posted on that site, Yes, us Cah lee fuh nee ahs are effed with this witch in charge.

    Notice, at the beginning of the exchange that Alford calls her 'ma'am' and this DB doesn't bother to correct him, like she corrected the General a while back.

    This is the kind a-holery that we have to put up with in the Great State of ours.

    Between her and Feinstein-who just got a bill prohibiting the transport of firearms across state lines- are a disgrace to many, if not all women who represent the people in their states.

    Feinstein has a permit to carry a CW, yet she won't allow people in her own state to arm themselves?

    What a golden crock of crap. I can hardly wait for the next elections.

    I hope the people take up brooms, shovels, pitchforks and pointy sticks and get rid of both these abominations.


    Morons.
    A hypocritical politician? Nah!
    Blessings,
    Mary



    "Time and unforeseen occurrence befall us all." Ecclesiastes 9:11

  5. #1235
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    Quote Originally Posted by Medusa View Post
    A hypocritical politician? Nah!
    My dad had a wonderful weather vane.

    When the the Santa Ana winds blow-When I was in Catholic school that was my favorite time of the year, those plaid skirts were really aerodynamic!- the the top would do a boogie that made me afraid that Mr. Rooster would fly off and fall to the ground.....

    THAT is the way I look at most of the politicians today-with the exception of Thad McCotter-that guy is funny, smart and a pleasure to listen to.

    They go with the wind, spin around when it shifts and the only truth they represent are the compass points below them.

    If we have to stumble to regain a little direction for the future, I am for it.
    I just cannot stand the spinning action-it makes me dizzy.

  6. #1236
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    Quote Originally Posted by RICHARD View Post
    Again, I apologize for Baba Boxer and her ilk.

    What a piece of work and as someone posted on that site, Yes, us Cah lee fuh nee ahs are effed with this witch in charge.
    Dont go riling up the misandrists again RICHARD.

    Notice, at the beginning of the exchange that Alford calls her 'ma'am' and this DB doesn't bother to correct him, like she corrected the General a while back.
    She decided to berate and degrade him instead.

    This is the kind a-holery that we have to put up with in the Great State of ours.
    You mean "Once Great State", I think.

    I would have done the traditional Pirate...

    Quote Originally Posted by blue
    Quote Originally Posted by RICHARD
    This is the kind a-holery that we have to put up with in the Once Great State of ours.
    Fixed it for you
    But too many folks are easily confused/offended

    Between her and Feinstein-who just got a bill prohibiting the transport of firearms across state lines- are a disgrace to many, if not all women who represent the people in their states.

    Feinstein has a permit to carry a CW, yet she won't allow people in her own state to arm themselves?
    Only the ultra rich and elitest politicians beleive they have the right to defend themselves. The 2nd Amendment dosent aply to the masses, just read Sotomayor's decisions on the subject.

    What a golden crock of crap. I can hardly wait for the next elections.

    I hope the people take up brooms, shovels, pitchforks and pointy sticks and get rid of both these abominations.


    Morons.
    Keep waiting and hoping. Put your hopes in one hand and **** in the other and see which hand fills up first.

    We have arrived at the time of Bread and Circuses. Has Change been shoved down our throats so much that all we have left is Hope? I Hope that States that can afford to start seceding.

    I have to make an apology here.

    BO was talking about a red pill/blue pill analogy, I thought he was going to bring out the woman from the first Matrix movie. I yelled at the TV before he changed tact and started to talk about the 1/2 price pill being better.


    Gosh, he may have a point with his HCR talk!
    The .GOV is gonna start buying all of our meds from Canada?


    --------------------

    For all of you Cheerleaders out there, That is how you preach to the choir! None of this wimpy "Here Here", or "Amens". None of the weak kneed Sheeple response, "I couldnt agree with the OP more" BS.
    Last edited by blue; 07-22-2009 at 08:14 PM. Reason: Forgot an O and a R but Im sure thats not all I missed.
    I have a HUGE SIG!!!!



    My Dogs. Erp the Cat.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas Jefferson
    Tyranny is defined as that which is legal for the government but illegal for the citizenry.

  7. #1237
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    Quote Originally Posted by RICHARD View Post

    Feinstein-who just got a bill prohibiting the transport of firearms across state lines-
    Feinstein has a permit to carry a CW, yet she won't allow people in her own state to arm themselves?
    Richard, that Thune Amendment was not a good one. It would have, basically, put the control of gun laws in the hands of the Federal Government. Most gun owners I know, prefer to have Washington keep hands off. Leave it up to the states.

    Under the proposed amendment, all states would be required to recognize concealed carry permits from all other states, including states that grant permits without regard to criminal records. In Virginia, this would allow convicted criminals to carry weapons onto parks and playgrounds.

    You can read the article HERE.

  8. #1238
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    Rather then muss up Medusa's thread in Cat General Ill post this here reguarding spaying humans.

    President Obama's "science czar," John Holdren, once floated the idea of forced abortions, "compulsory sterilization," and the creation of a "Planetary Regime" that would oversee human population levels and control all natural resources as a means of protecting the planet -- controversial ideas his critics say should have been brought up in his Senate confirmation hearings.
    Source.
    I have a HUGE SIG!!!!



    My Dogs. Erp the Cat.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas Jefferson
    Tyranny is defined as that which is legal for the government but illegal for the citizenry.

  9. #1239
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grace View Post
    Richard, that Thune Amendment was not a good one. It would have, basically, put the control of gun laws in the hands of the Federal Government. Most gun owners I know, prefer to have Washington keep hands off. Leave it up to the states.

    Under the proposed amendment, all states would be required to recognize concealed carry permits from all other states, including states that grant permits without regard to criminal records. In Virginia, this would allow convicted criminals to carry weapons onto parks and playgrounds.

    You can read the article HERE.
    Absolute garbage, and fearmongering.
    I have a HUGE SIG!!!!



    My Dogs. Erp the Cat.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas Jefferson
    Tyranny is defined as that which is legal for the government but illegal for the citizenry.

  10. #1240
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    Quote Originally Posted by blue View Post
    Absolute garbage, and fearmongering.
    You are entitled to your opinion, as is Mr. Davis entitled to his.

  11. #1241
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grace View Post
    You are entitled to your opinion, as is Mr. Davis entitled to his.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Davis
    But if the Thune amendment passes, that criminal will have absolutely no problem acquiring a concealed carry permit that would allow him to avoid arrest and continue selling guns illegally on the streets
    How would a CCW lisence allow a criminal to continue to sell firearms illegaly?

    What states allow a violent criminal to obtain a CCW? None that I know of.

    A friend of mine has a misdemeaner in AK and is forbiden from owning a firearm. So maybe Mr. Davis can explain to me how a man who cant own a firearm can have a CCW?

    I wont go into the fact that an Amendment has to be ratified by the States to become law.
    I have a HUGE SIG!!!!



    My Dogs. Erp the Cat.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas Jefferson
    Tyranny is defined as that which is legal for the government but illegal for the citizenry.

  12. #1242
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    Quote Originally Posted by blue View Post

    I wont go into the fact that an Amendment has to be ratified by the States to become law.
    This was to be an amendment to the Defense Spending Bill - NOT an amendment to the Constitution.

    source

    July 20th, 2009 - Washington, D.C. - Senator John Thune has offered a bipartisan amendment to the Defense Authorization bill (S. 1390) that would help in reducing crime by providing reciprocity for the carrying of concealed firearms. The Thune amendment (#1618) would allow individuals to carry lawfully concealed firearms across state lines, while at the same time respecting the laws of the host state.
    etc., etc., etc. . . . . . .

  13. #1243
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    When I go to buy a gun and give info, etc. who OK's the purchase?

    And who approves the sale of weapons between private citizens?

    I probably could go around and get a gun, origin kinda sketchy, that I could theoretically carry all around the U.S. in my car, and unless I do something stupid or illegal, no one would be the wiser.

    It happens all the time and to tweak a law like that is a little like the barn door closing after someone shot my cow in the pasture.

    Soemthing good, like a steak, may come of it, but what protected my cow before that?

    And yes, I should have fixed that door!

  14. #1244
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grace View Post
    This was to be an amendment to the Defense Spending Bill - NOT an amendment to the Constitution.

    source

    July 20th, 2009 - Washington, D.C. - Senator John Thune has offered a bipartisan amendment to the Defense Authorization bill (S. 1390) that would help in reducing crime by providing reciprocity for the carrying of concealed firearms. The Thune amendment (#1618) would allow individuals to carry lawfully concealed firearms across state lines, while at the same time respecting the laws of the host state.
    etc., etc., etc. . . . . . .
    I wasnt paying that close attention to the amendement in question, you are absolutely correct.

    It doesnt change the realities of CCW laws.

    There are only two states with unrestricted CCW laws, and in AK if you are convicted of certain misdemeaners you cannot own a firearm so you cannot have a CCW. If you are a convicted [EDIT]of a [/EDIT]felony most Federal laws prohibit firearm ownership, so no CCW permits for felons even in unrestricted states.

    Garbage arguement by Mr. Davis.

    [EDIT]Maybe Karen can move this CCW discussion to the Firearms thread?[/EDIT]
    Last edited by blue; 07-23-2009 at 02:37 AM.
    I have a HUGE SIG!!!!



    My Dogs. Erp the Cat.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas Jefferson
    Tyranny is defined as that which is legal for the government but illegal for the citizenry.

  15. #1245
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    I cannot move individual posts from one thread to another.
    I've Been Frosted

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