Separation Anxiety....help!

Hello.

My wife and I have a 9.5 month old beagle (Westley). We've had him since he was about 9 weeks old. He definitely suffers from separation anxiety, and since he is a beagle, he expresses his unhappiness by spending the day howling. This has created numerous problems for us, since we live in an apartment complex, and thus have neighbors close by. We have tried just about everything for him. We have tried practicing leaving (going through our normal routine) and leaving him alone inside, but he wimpers almost immediately, followed quickly by howling. We have used 2 types of bark collars (the shock collar and the citronella collar). Both were effective at first, but Westley is a very tough dog, and quickly gets used to the stimulant, so he just howls through the pain (so to speak). We've been working with our vet to try and solve this as well. We tried putting him on a tranq, hoping that would calm him down, but he just acted like a drunk dog, still howling away. We used to leave him out and locked in our bedroom, but he has developed some destructive tendencies, so we now have to leave him in a crate during the day. We're currently trying a new drug (clomacalm) to try to relax him, but we're both uncomfortable drugging the dog. We love the dog but we feel we're getting to the end of our rope. We're coming down to a choice of de-barking the dog (something we have decided we will NOT do), or giving the dog to a new home. Obviously, this upsets us tremendously. Does anyone have any advice or has anyone else been through something like this? We've read just about everything we can find on this subject, and we feel we've made little headway.

Thanks for reading this far,

I have no scientific input for your problem, but it is obvious that you do have a big problem. It may be that you have exhausted every option you have, other than perhaps finding a "doggie day care" so that the dog won't be left alone during the day. We have such options in our area. Perhaps you can find one for yourself. Call your local kennel and see if there is a possibility of a low cost option for you that way. Then your dog won't be left alone during the day.
Good luck. http://PetoftheDay.com/talk/smile.gif

Ahhh, Beagles! Great dogs if you have the right type for the right job. That is the heart of your problem, genetics. (You can take the dog out of the hunt but you will never take the hunt out of the dog!) Please do not drug your dog, there is nothing wrong with him, do not de-bark him, there is no reason (ever!) and do not have him put down. I am sad to say you will be unable to keep this dog as no matter what you do you can't provide him with the work and companionship his genetic makeup is craving. You have a dog that has been bred from, or is a throwback to, working stock. There is nothing you can do to make this dog's life bearable for him but give him to kennels or a trainer that can give him the pack and the work that he needs. (I am not talking rescue kennels) This is not your fault at all, so don't feel bad and you don't even have to give up on Beagles. Just get one from a breeder who has not bred for working animals and be sure to meet the parents of your dog. I would also suggest that any puppy is going to find being left on it's own all day in a crate very hard to deal with. Think about an adult dog from a rescue kennel. Please release your Beagle from what is, effectivly , a prison for him.

Norm:
My heart breaks for you in such a terrible situation. Since you live in an apartment, I guess a buddy for your dog is probably out of the question? I know it would be rough, but it sounds like the only humane thing to do would be to try and find the dog a good home where he can have a friend or human close by all the time. I have a hard time with bark collars, and TOTALLY disagree with de-barking.

Normpaperman,

I am so sorry, I have to agree with Carrie on this, she really knows her stuff! Even tho it's a heart breaking option. Your dog is not happy. What an aweful decesion that is, my heart breaks for you. Just keep in mind that although you love your dog and he loves you, it does sound like you have exhausted all your options and he's still miserable without you around.

No words of advise, just wanted to say how sorry I am that you have to think about re-homing your friend. It's a crummy thing to have to do, but in the long run, he would be happier with someone around more often, and somewhere where he could run off energy. De-barking him would be a horrible option, he would still feel all the anxiety, just not be able to tell anyone about it.

Best of luck to you and your wife. I had a dalmation that I had to re-home for problematic behaviors too. It does hurt, but he's happy on the farm where he's living now. It's just one of those necessary evil's.

Let me stress again, this is not your fault. You could stay at home all day, walk him all day, free run him all day and his genetic structure will not change. You will miss the dog but it should make you very proud and happy to know in your hearts that you did the very best for him.

Is there any possible way you could bring himto work with you or have a friend watch him during the day

We've thought of both bringing him to work or trying out doggie day care. Doggie day care is somewhat of a viable option, except that it is cost prohibitive. Around here, it costs something like $20/day, which doesn't sound like much, but I'd be required to pick him up by 5:30, which is hours before I'm done working. So, $400/month to have someone watch my dog for the majority of the day doesn't really work for us.

As for bringing him to the office, I've done that a few times, but professionally I'm uncomfortable with that. He is extremely cute and therefore a great distraction on me and my coworkers. I work in a start-up environment where if what we're trying doesn't work, the company will fail, and so I feel the added distraction of him wouldn't be good on a long term basis.

Again, I thank everyone for the suggestions. I know I must seem like I want my cake and to eat it too (to not take advantage of doggie day care, since it is available), but at some point, I feel that that is only a temporary solution and if we were to have a day that we wouldn't be able to bring the dog to his playmates, his reactions at home would be exponentially worse....

thanks for reading so far,

You sound like a man trying to avoid the obvious! You know the dog is not a happy puppy, you know you can't solve it by anything that you do, you know that medication for the dog is wrong, you know that debarking is wrong and you really do know that just spending time with the pup isn't enough. C'mon, matey, you've done more than most people would consider doing! Now consider the health and mental well being of the dog. It is your responsibility that a puppy feels that it's only outlet for the frustration of it's natural behaviour is to howl all day. In short you have a working dog, not a pet.
Again, I really think a puppy is not the way to go for you - try a shelter and they will let you know the history of each dog so you can find a dog to suit your lifestyle.

Bruce Fogle D.V.M has written a excellent/usefull
paperback book called
"The Dog's mind" put out by Howell Book House.
There is a section in his book that
deals with the causes and several
treatments for separation anxiety.
Deparking or a barking collar is
not mentioned.
If you have not given up yet, and you
still have the time and patience to give
it another try.
Might be worth the $15.00 to read the book and see if there our any ideas you have not
tried. (I also would not rule out
the help of a private trainer.)

I'm so sorry. I dont think any dog, especially a pup, would be very happy if you work past 5:30 PM a lot, does this mean the dog is alone from morning till night? It doesnt sound like you lead a lifestyle compatible with dog ownership. Perhaps a cat or two would be a better match. I hope you will seriously consider re-homing the little dog to someone who has more time for him, maybe a nice family with children.

Nope, sorry to mislead you. I work close to home, so I typically break up his day (around lunch time) by coming home and taking him out to run/play for 30-45 minutes or so....

This may be a "wishful thinking" category, but could there be any older person in your apartment complex with whom you could leave your dog during the day and they would like to earn a little extra money but wouldn't cost as much as doggie daycare?

I also have a dog with extreme separation anxiety, but he is just fine under two conditions. 1. He is with our other dog and 2. He has the run of the house.

Being that Westley is still in the destructive puppy stage, I don't know giving him the run of the apartment would work, and whether another dog could fit into your life. Is there another dog owner in the apartment complex that could bring their dog over to leave with Westley during the day? Could you give Westley lots of exercise in the morning before you go to work? Have you tried giving him a Kong with some peanut butter stuffed inside right when you leave? Have you tried keeping a radio on tuned to a talk station? I don't know if any of these ideas will help, but I have not been able to get you and Westley out of my mind. I do hope you can find a solution to your problem.

[This message has been edited by RachelJ (edited November 10, 2000).]

Quote:

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Originally posted by normpaperman:
Hello.

My wife and I have a 9.5 month old beagle (Westley). We've had him since he was about 9 weeks old. He definitely suffers from separation anxiety, and since he is a beagle, he expresses his unhappiness by spending the day howling. This has created numerous problems for us, since we live in an apartment complex, and thus have neighbors close by. We have tried just about everything for him. We have tried practicing leaving (going through our normal routine) and leaving him alone inside, but he wimpers almost immediately, followed quickly by howling. We have used 2 types of bark collars (the shock collar and the citronella collar). Both were effective at first, but Westley is a very tough dog, and quickly gets used to the stimulant, so he just howls through the pain (so to speak). We've been working with our vet to try and solve this as well. We tried putting him on a tranq, hoping that would calm him down, but he just acted like a drunk dog, still howling away. We used to leave him out and locked in our bedroom, but he has developed some destructive tendencies, so we now have to leave him in a crate during the day. We're currently trying a new drug (clomacalm) to try to relax him, but we're both uncomfortable drugging the dog. We love the dog but we feel we're getting to the end of our rope. We're coming down to a choice of de-barking the dog (something we have decided we will NOT do), or giving the dog to a new home. Obviously, this upsets us tremendously. Does anyone have any advice or has anyone else been through something like this? We've read just about everything we can find on this subject, and we feel we've made little headway.

Thanks for reading this far,

---

wow...not sure how i reposted the original message, but that is NOT what i wanted to do!!!

anyway, here is the post i originally meant to send :

i understand your reluctance to give your dog drugs, but the anti-anxiety drugs aren't like tranqs. my dog also has severe sep. anxiety, and if he weren't taking elavil, i don't think we could have kept him.

the program my dog is on, which was prescribed by the univ. of penn. vet. medicine behavior clinic consists of medication, behavior training and deference training.

During the behavior training (2x a day, fifteen minutes a session) the dog must sit and stay while you move progressively further away, make weird noises and movements, and finally move out of sight. when he obeys, he gets a treat.

Deference training means taht if your dog wants something, he must sit for it. Petting walks, combing, dinner....everything.

They also suggested music, television, and lots and lots of exercise. A tired dog is a happy dog! :-)

Hope this helps a little. Good luck to you!

We live in a throw away society.
Most people do not pick out a dog to
fit their current life style.
That does not mean the match will not work. Having a breed with a high working drive is not the best suited for apartment living.
They are happier when doing a job and have excess energy to burn off.
From reading your posts you are allowing your beagle to burn off this excess energy
through out the day.
It is more that the dog is suffering from a behavior problem. (dogs are social pack animals and some adjust much better than others when left alone).
Going to a vet which you have done determins whether or not your dog could be suffering from a medical condition that is causing a behavior problem. If your dog is healthy, than I would seek a good trainer to evaluate the dog in it's living conditions to start you out on good program.
If medication is found warrented and perscribed by a Vet that you trust,
you still need the help of
a good behavior trainer.
A program such as kayward used,
by the Univ. of Penn. Vet medicine, which not only includes medication, but training and behavior modication program with it.
Only a vet should perscribe medication if deemed warranted after a dog has been evaluted.
There are many trainers out their,
finding a good Program/trainer might mean
being able for you and your dog to live happy together.
IF you decide to re-home this dog
with-out help it will suffer the same problems unless you can find a place where the dog has constant companionship where it will not get itself into trouble.

I agree, in principle, with what you are saying but the Beagle is a special case. Genetics in some breeds make it impossible to have a breed temperament outline as different lines have been bred for different uses. Most trainers of protection dogs, for instance, will not even consider American bloodline GSD's as they do not have the drives necessary to make the grade. Protection work is impossible for them as it has been bred out of them. This does not make a bad dog or a less valuable animal, just one unsuited to protection work.
In dogs from a working line Beagles have a pack instinct that goes way beyond the usual dog. A pack to a working line dog is other dogs and lots of them. Drugs and behaviour modification may have some effect but they will never change the genetics of the animal. People will never take the place of the pack for a Beagle with the genetics of the true working type.
Before everyone tells me of their obedient, social and happy Beagles at home they are of a different type. Just as the GSD's mentioned before are of a different type to the dogs suitable for protection work.

I dont think that a beagle puppy is getting adequate chance to burn off the excess energy during the day if it is played with once at lunchtime and the owner doesnt return home until "hours past" 5:30 PM. It sounds to me like a lifestyle issue that is turning into a behaviour one. I would be just as despondant as that pup if I lived that life, imagine being a social pack animal forced to spend the majority of your time alone. Perhaps hiring a pet sitter to come a couple times a day to walk the dog might help. I really feel for the pup and hope the owner finds a resolution soon.

I can understand your dilema, my greyhound suffered from seperation anxiety also tho it only lasted until I could crate her and unforunately I still don't trust her to be out of the crate while I am @ work.
My dog groomer actually dogsits a dog for a client every day while the lady goes and teaches @ school. She charges like $8-10 a day, but I also live in a small rural town area.
I have heard of using the interactive dog toys or sterile bones stuffed with peanut butter to give them something to do.
GOOD LUCK!

Norm: You don't mention what your wife does for a living. Nor do you mention if you have tried obedience training with Westley, have you? I would suggest that as a possibility, but be prepared for it to take a while because Beagles are notoriously hard-headed. However, if you use treats with the training, it should expedite the work. There are many activities you could do with Westley that will help. Obedience training not only teaches the dog to obey, but also allows him to know what his place in the "pack" is (which of necessity, must be lower than you and your wife). Whichever of you takes him to obedience will find him bonded more closely to that one, so you should plan for both of you to work on the training.
I can't entirely agree with Carrie. The Beagle IS a working dog, but with work can be a great companion dog. If you can work with him on weekends there are many things you could work with him on that would utilize his natural abilities such as agility, tracking, flyball, etc.
Would a cat companion for him be a possibility? Living in an apartment with an active dog is tough -- been there -- but with some work, it can work out. I also liked the suggestion of an older resident "doggie sitting". Have you looked into that?
I feel your pain -- we were evicted from a trailer park unjustly because the neighbor complained about our dogs barking and it was the dogs on the next street over. Oh, well, we survived that -- dogs intact (so to speak) and I had three dogs and a cat at the time. Give the obedience a try and see if that doesn't help. Good Luck.

Thank you all for your comments.

To answer ktreva52's questions, my wife works as well, and gets home about the same time as me. As for the things we've tried/are trying....

every day, when we leave him, we stuff a few kongs with peanut butter and various other goodies. We've also been leaving him new compressed raw hide bones. In a day's time, he manages to completely devour a 1 foot long bone, so now we're leaving nylabones in the crate with him.
We have also taken him through basic obedience school. For 9 sundays in a row, we both took him to class where we learned sit/stay/down/leave it/heal. Mind you, he is a beagle, so he is still only obeying when he really wants to....
There is a new dog park near us, so we try at least twice a day to go there for 10-60 minutes and just let him run and play with his fellow hound. This seems to poop him out for a little while, but definitely not a complete cure (at least not as of yet, anyway).
We have also just moved. We were in a 1 bedroom apartment, so there was little place inside for him to roam. We're now in a much larger place. There are 2 levels, so he spends a lot of time running up and down the stairs. However, when we left this morning, we could hear him screaming from inside.

Thanks again to everyone. We'll keep trying all of the suggestions people list. You are all very helpful.

Thanks for reading so far,

I have a suggestion: when you and your wife leave in the moring is it together? Or do you leave one at a time? If you leave one at a time, try this:

Say your wife leaves first, tell her to make little or no "scene" when she leaves....a simple goodbye to you and she's off...ignore Westley completely. And when the last person leaves, again make no big deal out of it, just do what you gotta do and go...don't say, "ok I'm leaving, you be a good puppy, now...I'll be home soon" to Westley. I am not sure if you do that already, but if so, it's just prepping him up for his day of anxiety.

When you come in for lunch or after work, try this:
When you walk in the door again ignore him. Don't say, "oh my Westley, my Baby, how's my little cuteness? Were you a good boy? Come here and give me kisses...I missed you", simply walk in the door, if he's crated then open his crate. Do it calm, don't make ANY big deal of it, just open it, let him outside and tell him to go potty. After you let him back in the house then you can play with him. The key is to not make any scene when you either leave the house or come back into the house.

I fostered a dog before that had seperation anxiety...she'd belt out the most miserable sounds when someone left. I knew that if I could not curb this problem of hers she would never find a home...I tried to make no scene whatsoever when leaving and then getting back, and it seemed to work. Of course, she was not as extreme of a case as Westley is.

I hope you can work this out with Westley...I wish you luck.

Leslie

A trainer's POV: Teach your dog the "Long Stay." Start outdoors. Start at 15 feet and 30 seconds. Gradually increase time and distance. Above one minue, be sure your dog is in the "down stay" position and in the shade. Over a month or two, work up to thirty feet and ten minutes. The "Long Stay" is the most significant method to overcome separation/abandonment fear. You always call him/her to come back to you when time's up. Transfer the training to indoors. Here it's important NOT to let your dog follow you around the house. You're watching TV and go to the kitchen to get a Coke. You're gone 30 seconds. Your dog must stay where he/she was. This kind of training is not simply behavioral -- it's emotional and attitudinal. Eliminating the "neurotic" behavior with the dicipline of "Stay" gives the dog time to realize and emotionally adjust to the fact that you always come back. The "Long Stay" is a tremendous confidence builder with virtually all dogs.

You are certainly getting a lot of "good" advice. I certainly hope you can figure out a way to work things out with this dog. I had been thinking if you could rent a house with a fenced yard, you might be better off, but I know beagles have a tendency to bark often and loud, so the neighbors might be a problem in that case too. I realized after suggesting doggie day care that it could add up. Our local kennel, which I think is expensive for overnight stays ($24.50/night), charges $6/day for dogsitting. That is much more reasonable than what you found.
You still might have to consider finding someone with the time and space for this dog. My heart is with you. Good luck.

Old Timer (love the handle), the long stay is an excellent excersise for all dogs.

I feel your pain. I took in a beagle pup who was abandoned by a family who had moved. I experienced almost the exact same thing; constant howling and barking. At that time I lived in an apartment. Thank goodness my neighbor was a dog lover and very understanding. I knew nothing about beagles when I took this dog in and I admit I was getting frustrated by her behavior. Luckily, my father knew a man who was recently widowed. He lives out in the country and has acres of fenced in property. This kind man was more than happy to take Daisy. I visited recently and Daisy and her new owner are very happy. She has plenty of space to roam and lots of birds, rabbits, and squirrels to chase. A lesson for all: Research the breed before taking on the responsibility of owning! When I told my father I had a beagle his first words were: "You can't keep a beagle in an apartment". Boy, was he right.

Is there anyway you can confine him to the kitchen where there is not much trouble he could get into instead of putting him in the crate? All the other things you are doing are so beneficial, but he may just be claustrophobic in the crate.

I just got a beagle puppy and she cries ALL NIGHT LONG and anytime anyone walks away from her. She could be with three of us, and if one walks away, she cries even if there are still two people with her! She won't stop crying!! This is either in the kitchen or in the crate... I'm going crazy. Please help me!

My dog had severe separation anxiety and after several methods, I ended up putting her on Clomicalm. We had to increase the dosage but eventually it worked. That, along with Xanax and behavior modification. I have the behavior modification papers if you are interested, I will mail them to you. However, my dog needed the Clomicalm and Xanax.

Debarking and shock collars are definitely out. It will cause pain and it does nothing for the anxiety. It just masks it. The problem will still be there. You need to look into the methods I used above. Please talk to your vet about that.

If you need the behavior modification papers, let me know and I'll send them to you.

Separation anxiety is a horrible thing for them. I had to take one dog to work with me b/c of it. As someone else on this thread said, maybe an older couple can watch him while you're gone.

I know what you're going through. I went through it for years.