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I was watching the news and there seems to be a certain section of people who are against the 'random' searches that the NYPD is conducting on the passengers that use the subway.
A woman was interviewed and she stated that she felt violated by the searches.
Me? I'd feel more violated if I wake up in a hospital's intensive care unit with a missing limb, blind or brain dead..
It wouldn't bother me at all. I might even get lucky enough to get searched by a cute officer.
I wouldn't mind. I mean, as long as the officer doing the searching stays within legal bounds as far as what a search entails. I am sure I'd be annoyed if I was in a hurry or something, but, not bothered by the search itself. I think it could help, even if it's just a little. Just like when you fly sometimes they make your take off your shoes. That stuff just doesn't bother me in the slightest.
Where's the box for "I don't feel violated but think it is a stupid waste of time and that the police could be far better used elsewhere?"
I wouldn't feel violated at all! Afterall, they're just doing they're jobs to make this world a better place for us to live in.
Like Val said, I wouldn't mind at all being searched by a cute officer. :p ;)
I'd also rather be searched than find myself in a hospital with a missing limb or brain dead.
If you've got nothing to hide, then what's the problem???
I would think that would be the first one. ;)Quote:
Originally posted by Edwina's Secretary
Where's the box for "I don't feel violated but think it is a stupid waste of time and that the police could be far better used elsewhere?"
Isn't there a pesky constitutional amendment that says they can't do that? :eek: :eek:
For how many years have we been randomly searched every time we get on an airplane....has it made us safer?
Since it is far and away more likely I will be a mugging victim or a victim of drunk driving....put the police to better use that a false sense of security....
Perhaps rather than random searches, they would be better off investing the money in some kind of "metal/bomb detector device to install at the subway entrances?
I have lived in NYC and took the subway every single day to work and back. You would not BELIEVE the things people bring/have on the train with them....there were many times that I thought to myself that I was the only sane person in the car.....
Twice, in the six months I lived there, innocent people were thrown in front of the train and died...I used to hold onto the pole while I was waiting like my life depended on it...and if just might have....
We have been much too complacent in this country, thinking, it will never happen to us...and then it did....and how quickly we have forgotten.............
If you have nothing to hide, what is the problem? Big deal if they see your tampons or your birth control or your self-help book....or whatever it is that is private to you? If you are not trying to kill innocent people, they don't care and you shouldn't either!!!
Boy are you right on that one!!! But I do feel that I am not going to live my life in total fear either. That would be allowing the enemy to win, and I not going to let that happen.Quote:
We have been much too complacent in this country, thinking, it will never happen to us...and then it did....and how quickly we have forgotten
So if you have nothing to hide....is it okay for ther government to conduct random searches of your house? I assume, of course, it is okay, if you have nothing to hide, to have road blocks and conduct random searches of your car as well.
And...if you have nothing to hide....you won't mind random phone taps, right?
I rode the subway in Chicago every day for five years. I always take public transport when I can. Yes...there are lots of crazies. I once bought a seven foot long bamboo window shade and took it home on the train.
I do not see how this further assault on our liberties will do a thing for security.
I believe Catland & Sara have the bigger picture in mind than an OK about "temporarily" ignoring the Constitution. There is such a thing in our Constitution preventing "illegal search and seizure" and if it's now OK in the subway then where and when does it stop? Metal detectors are one thing... these searches are illegal and should be stopped (IMO).
I'm on the fence on this one. On the one hand, why does my freedom have to be compromised because extremists are intent on ruining the way we live. On the other hand, I personally have nothing to hide, but I don't feel that searching me personally will get anyone anywere. Authorities know who and what to look for.
My husband jokes that his name should be Random Search because everytime we fly, he gets the whole treatment. Is it because he's dark complected? Perhaps.
I'd rather be searched than dead.
I think they really need to search everyone though for it to be any good.
Unfortunately, we have a choice: give up some freedoms or put up with terrorists. :(
There isn't a box that says "While I admit that the intent of random searching is good, it doesn't do anyone any bit of good to have the police harass a drug addict (I'm not condoning illgal drug use btw) while a terrorist walks right on by and blows up the subway"
:p
I'm wondering how random is random. Are they choosing people who look like thugs, a certain age group, foreign, etc... or are they just litterally randomly checking? I have a feeling "random" is the guy wearing too baggy p[ants, lotsof gold chains, a few tottoos, "ooo, he looks like the type of guy who'd be packing" meanwhile the guy in the Brooks Brother suit and briefcase has a knife up his sleeve.
No not at all. They have checked me before ....and I certainly don't look like a thug....I've seen them check some pretty average looking people.Quote:
Originally posted by catnapper
Are they choosing people who look like thugs, a certain age group, foreign, etc....
I personally think that there is not much point in doing it.
Good point. I have this black co-worker. Remember- black is very rare here. He is born here, speaks the local dialect perfectly and has a good job. But he has much more experience with "random" searching than anyone else.Quote:
Originally posted by catnapper
I'm wondering how random is random. Are they choosing people who look like thugs, a certain age group, foreign, etc... or are they just litterally randomly checking? I have a feeling "random" is the guy wearing too baggy p[ants, lotsof gold chains, a few tottoos, "ooo, he looks like the type of guy who'd be packing" meanwhile the guy in the Brooks Brother suit and briefcase has a knife up his sleeve.
Sara, I so wish I was as articulate as you. You just have a great way with words!Quote:
Originally posted by Edwina's Secretary
...I do not see how this further assault on our liberties will do a thing for security.
Thank You!
Allow me to share one of my favorite quotes:
They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. - B.F.
Nice snag LoudLou.. who could possibly question the patriotism of B.F. Or doubt his sincerity and wisdom.
Over 3 million people ride the NYC subway each day. More than 1.3 billion a year. An estimated 32 million ride public transport worldwide each day.
That's ALOT of random searching.....
Interesting comments,
But here's the 64,000 dollar question.
SHOULD a terorist blow himself up on a train, subway etc. and the government was hampered by the first amendment from spying on this idiot...
Are you willing to sacrifice a few hundred people to keep YOUR civil rights intact?
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Let's do the math....
There are about 280 million people in the US today.
Of that total, let's say one percent HATE their lives and the country
2.8 million.
Of THAT total about one percent
28,000
Are thinking about doing something stupid - workplace shooting, taking hostages to get their point across, killing a neighbor, ex wife, lover ex husband, friend
Of that total one percent
2,800
Have the ability to really put the hurt to us.
2,800 nut jobs.......
Read up on the Tokyo Sarin attacks, a few years ago...
One guy starts a cult and gets a few of his friends to pop the top on some poison gas inside the subway.
The thought of suffocating to death - my respiratory tract seared shut because of the gas- because one emm effer thinks the world is gonna end isn't exactly my idea of FUN...
But Richie (say the naysayers..)
That is only a few guys and that happened in Tokyo!!!
19 morons, of a projected 2,800, stopped an entire country for almost a week.
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What it comes down to is what will be said about the government
when it happens here.
The saddest part about that thought is that someplace in America there is a few knotheads planning something like this.
And because some joker with Civil Rights, First Amendment or privacy issues will protect them from being looked at.
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Let's take out our pipes, load them with a few facts and smoke this..................
Profiling????
With the exception of Timmy McVeigh, and he was a fricking wuss because he didn't stay with the truck, the profile of a suicide bomber-or airplane crasher-take your pick- is of a young man 20-25 of Middle Eastern descent. Student, on a visa, seriously religious and you can go on and on.......
I have yet to see a Nepali albino midget toss off an "act of terrorism" so they may fall off the radar screen, for now...
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As for the government peeking into your bedroom....
Don't give yourself too much credit.....
If you invented something that AIN'T in the Kama Sutra you may want to patent, trademark or put it on tape...
Look at the cash Pam Anderson, Tommy Lee and Paris Hilton made....
:confused: :rolleyes: :eek: :D
Why doesn't the government just go ahead with the ultimate plan of putting microchips on babies when they are born to keep track of everybody and what they are doing through life? I'm sorry but I feel that I am living in Cuba or some other communist country where our liberties are being taken away daily almost to a point where it is unconscious to us.
Guess I am the Joker....
I think it is a sad day that we have to have random searches to feel safe. But I'm all for it. If it means that my loves and myself are safe. P.S. I like the cute officer idea to.
Richard....I'm not sure where bedroom peeking came into the discussion....but...in Texas the cops can enter your home if your neighbor calls and says you are engaging in sexual acitivites that are "illegal" (homosexual activity.) You can then be arrested. But we should be safe from all those folks doing things in their bedroom. So, just for the record, I don't want the government in my kitchen, my bathroom, my bedroom, my library, my garage or anyplace else they shouldn't ought to be.
Now that you have explained to me that the Unibomber, for example, was a wuss for not blowing himself up and is therefore, not a threat to the safety of the country I feel so much better. I guess that goes for the guy who planted the bomb at the Atlanta Olympics as well?
If we require all a young man 20-25 of Middle Eastern descent. Student, on a visa, seriously religious to wear a green cresent on their outer garments it would make identification easier.
The idea was tried once before....and quite effective too!
How about this as an idea...instead of random searches, we better secure our borders and the "student" on a visa that is expired goes home....or would that be politically incorrect?Quote:
Originally posted by Edwina's Secretary
If we require all a young man 20-25 of Middle Eastern descent. Student, on a visa, seriously religious to wear a green cresent on their outer garments it would make identification easier.
Oh yeah! I forgot....I abhor political correctness, so my opinion is safe.
A local newsite is running a poll with the question,
Should police officers use racial profiling to target Middle Easterners when searching bags of those who use subways,
buses, etc.? Using a yes or no vote. So far, about 5000 people
have voted and it's 79% yes & 21% no. I was pretty surprised,
but with the way things are going all over the world, maybe I
shouldn't be.
I am uncomfortable with it, but, Mike and I discussed it last night and he is all for it. As he pointed out, how many 80 year old black women would be out there blowing themselves up on a bus. I still don't like it a lot, which is why I think that student visas should be severely limited and those that are here on one should be limited to how long they are here and when it expires, they should be on the next plane out of here. I guess I want to feel safe, but, I don't want to give up my liberties. Now, that being said, I do NOT, by ANY means think that everyone who walks the streets of the U.S. should have the same rights as a U.S. citizen.
That is so mean and unfair. There are TONS of people.......TONS in the US that are US citizens, perfectly good, law abiding citizens that are of Middle Eastern background. They don't deserve 'special' treatment. I don't deserve special treatment. I was born in this country, lived here my ENTIRE life and still do, am as much an American and US citizen as everyone else. For people like me who have never and will NEVER commit such a crime, and that goes for the MAJORITY of the Muslims here in the US, giving them any 'special' treatment is completely unfair and wrong. Why should MY rights be violated, just because someone who happened to have the same skin color as me did something wrong? :(Quote:
Originally posted by lizbud
A local newsite is running a poll with the question,
Should police officers use racial profiling to target Middle Easterners when searching bags of those who use subways,
buses, etc.? Using a yes or no vote. So far, about 5000 people
have voted and it's 79% yes & 21% no. I was pretty surprised,
but with the way things are going all over the world, maybe I
shouldn't be.
We don't need to pick on innocent people. I'm all for keeping our country safe, but check EVERYONE. Picking on someone because of the color God gave them is completely wrong and unjust. Its just like this. If a Caucasian high school student shoots fellow students, go pick on every other white student in the country. Fair? I think not!
PCB are you aware in London they are now able to do random checking of anyone who looks Asian, so how do you feel about that? I can well understand how you would feel, however I am all for it, but not just Asian people , everyone, if it helps to stop terriorism in any way so be it, If it were a NZ who did the bombing and every NZ er was stopped from now on, I would not at all be offended, however I can understand how some people would be.,Personally if it helps to save lives I would not give a damn.
You don't need to give a damn as you aren't one who would be picked on. For those of us who have that 'eastern look', it is worrisome. You can't save lives by killing other innocent lives. Two wrongs do not make a right. Did you hear about that Brazillian the police in London KILLED? They KILLED him. They could have shot him in the leg if they had doubts, yet they chose to shoot him numerous times, and took his life. And he had NOTHING to do with the attacks. How do you feel about that? To kill someone's innocent son, brother, grandson, nephew. How would you feel if it was YOUR relative? I am not pointing that question out at you, Carol......just giving everyone something to think about. If it was your child who was killed for committing no crime whatsoever, you would know how it feels. Just because YOU are not really at risk of being picked on is not a reason 'not' to give a damn. I personally am just about sick of everything going on in the world, in the East and the West. Unfortunately, it is almost always the innocent who are killed, no matter where they are, while the evil criminals keep getting away with things. Why should the innocents be punished??? Even in Iraq, it is mostly the innocent civilians that have been killed. Accidental or not, loss of innocent life is never right and always something to grieve over. They have feelings, lives, and love their children and families just as much as we all do.Quote:
Originally posted by carole
Personally if it helps to save lives I would not give a damn.
I WANT the world to be safe, but I want the CRIMINALS to be punished. Not those who have nothing to do with anything going on! :( They need to check EVERYONE. EVERYONE. Not pick on certain ethnicities! What if they are busy 'randomly' checking an innocent person, while someone with bad intentions goes unnoticed? Randomly checking is stupid because they're not checking everyone. They could easily be checking the wrong person, and missing someone they were supposed to check.
PCB I was just as appalled at the shooting of the innocent Brazilian man as you, terrible indeed, I guess you have a real point, the fact is I really am not in your shoes, I can only say how I think I would react, if they were picking on my race, I might feel differently, however they interviewed some Muslims who agreed with the decision of the london police, so not everyone shares your view.
I did state that EVERYONE should be checked not just Asian people, I guess that is what is called discrimination.
I certainly did not mean any disrespect or offence to you personally, so sorry if it came across that way, I just think we have to take every precaution possible in these times, even if it means going to these lengths, that is just my view. Desperate times call for Desperate measures.
Lizbud
A local newsite is running a poll with the question,
Should police officers use racial profiling to target Middle Easterners when searching bags of those who use subways,
buses, etc.? Using a yes or no vote. So far, about 5000 people
have voted and it's 79% yes & 21% no. I was pretty surprised,
but with the way things are going all over the world, maybe I
shouldn't be.
------------
I had a middle eastern come into my work place a couple weeks ago. Some how we started chatting. Then he got into the topic of being searched at the airport.
He said him & his son will be stopped up to 5 times/airport. He said he feels much safer with the police searching his race. he sad saddly its my race that is doing alot of there terrorest attacks. he said he moved to Canada to feel safe & live safe.
He said he feels VERY safe in canada & will NEVER put up a fight or question any officer who wants to search him. He said he has nothing to hide.
I have 1 question about this random search. Do the offices ask to do the search or do they say, hey u, open ur bag now, kind of deal?
Cause here in Canada, unless they have a warrent, an officer can only "ask" to search. If u say no, then they can arrest u & wait for a warrent as long as there is probable cause. No probable cause no search.
So id the officers in this topic r asking u to allow thenm to do a search, then there is nothing wrong with it. cause u can say no. if its forced on u, well, I personally could careless aslong as I catch my bus & they don't break my stuff.
We just returned last night from a weekend trip to NYC. We were there from Friday until Monday and of course, took public transportation including numerous ferries, buses and of course the subway. There were police officers stationed at every entrance to the subway as well as on all the different ferries that we took. There were 4 of us in our group. One of our friends was stopped and searched, a white male of about 27 yrs old. He was the only one of us carrying a backpack. An officer did ask to look into my purse on one of the ferries.
I saw people of all nationalities and ages being searched while we were there for the long weekend. The only common denominator was that they were carrying a bag of some sort, a backpack, a large shopping bag, a laundry bag/cart.
Joker? You?Quote:
Originally posted by Edwina's Secretary
Richard....I'm not sure where bedroom peeking came into the discussion...
Now that you have explained to me that the Unibomber, for example, was a wuss for not blowing himself up and is therefore, not a threat to the safety of the country I feel so much better. I guess that goes for the guy who planted the bomb at the Atlanta Olympics as well?
If we require all a young man 20-25 of Middle Eastern descent. Student, on a visa, seriously religious to wear a green cresent on their outer garments it would make identification easier.
The idea was tried once before....and quite effective too!
You carry yourself in a regal manner.....I'da thunk you'd be the Queen in the deck!
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I am not the most savory looking character.
I grew up in a neighborhood where if you were a young Mexican male you were hassled no matter what.
Trust me, I have been stopped, hassled, checked out about 20 times in my life. Why?
Either I was stupid, in the wrong place or of the wrong ethnic description.
It didn't hurt me one bit....
People that get hassled should not blame the police/authorities..
THEY SHOULD BLAME THE MORONS THAT PUT THEM IN THE SPOTLIGHT..
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Here in Los Angeles they have a saying that the LAPD uses....
they pull people over for DRIVING WHILE BLACK.....DWB...
The people in the car get all stupid and instead of turning their derision on the bad guys, they get all stupid with the cops, get their arses whooped on and claim racism..
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I introduced the BR peeking into the discussion..
It usually follows the, "I don't want to government looking into my computer or bedroom.."
If you aren't bright enough to pull the curtains when you fornicate, you shouldn't fornicate.
Maybe a six foot dinghy is in order???
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As far as the 'green crescent' idea goes (Hey, like the Green Lantern or the "S" on Superman's chest???) an idiot back in the 1930's tried that......He also gassed them along with a few other groups....the Hungarian gypsys, gays, people of mixed parents and people with birht defects....
Laws yes......THAT action didn't last too long, the world banded together and kicked his arse off the planet....Poor Eva Braun, she got mixed up with the wrong guy..
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Theodore "Ted" Kaczinski (sp?) was the Unabomber.
Timothy "MeatHead Wuss" was the OK City Bomber.
This Atlanta Olympics Bombing guy, Rudolph, was bombing abortion clinics too.....
I love religion..
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Need I remind everyone that Rosa Parks "blew up" on a bus in the 1950's. Her explosion led to a whole different kind of war.
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The Tokyo gas attacks and the OKC bombing show that the feds need to be looking at everyone...
But some people need some special attention....
Those damn Nepali Albino Midgets are a sneaky bunch...
:eek:
I really do feel for the innocent muslim people who have done no wrong, unfortunately it is a sign of our times, the bad always spoil it for the good in every case, it is just a fact of life,sad as it is.