What do you think about horse racing???
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What do you think about horse racing???
I don't see anything wrong with horse racing at all. In fact it has been a well known sport since the beginning of time! It is great excercise for horses and keeps them in shape. And also the human must be kept in shape to too ride the horse, so really its a good healthy thing for both horse and rider.
I don't think horse racing is good if the horse is not well kept, well watered, well fed, and has too much excercise. There is such thing as putting the horse through way too much. I think for a good horse racer, you should have lots of knowledge as to how you should ride the horse during the race, how you have to take care of the horse and prepare the horse before the race, and how to make sure the horse is well looked after, after the race.
Horse racing is known as the sport of Kings and it certainly is, horses are beautiful and they are meant to get out there and run when they want to.:)
I agree with it, then again I don't. I'll state why I do and why I don't.
Why I do :
only IF the horse is in good shape and treated well, I agree with it and not beaten to death if they lose.
Why I don't :
because people gamble over which horse is going to win and some race horses out there are mistreated or beaten if they lose. :(
I agree with the Racing itself, what I dont agree with, is the age the horses start training and Racing. Their bones arent fused properly, nor have they finished growing, that is why most ex-race horses are lame, and need constant medical help the rest of their lives. Nothing like being retired at the age of 4!:rolleyes:
Ditto! I hate the way they are treated but if they are treated fine then I enjoy watching it and stuff. I actually wanted to be a jockey before my job offer.Quote:
Originally Posted by critter crazy
I agree with the sport itself-but do not agree with the certain methods of training, etc. as seen in racing and any other horse sports. I do feel bad for the ones that get cast aside-you can get them a dime a dozen practically.
I didn't vote because I have mixed feelings about horse racing.
I think horse racing is a great horse sport. It brings the jocky and horse together and they become one. But horse racing cause deaths all over-horse or human. Look at Barbaro. He died because he broke his leg in a race. But he died doing what he loved :(
This is exactly how I feel. I think if the horse is being treated the proper way, then...okay. But I despise when I hear about mistreated race horses and race dogs.Quote:
Originally Posted by luvofallhorses
:) I think it is ok along as it is all Humane & handled correctly..
I've only been to horse races once and honestly, I was mostly watching the horses go and what they did for them after they were done racing. So, I don't know if I agree with it or not.
Arlington Park is having their dirt track removed and putting in this new one because it will be safer for the horses and I think that is very good. The article refers to them as athletes which I like, because that is what they are.
Arlington Park to Install State-of-the-Art Racing Surface for 2007 Season
CHICAGO (December 7, 2006) -- Arlington Park announced today that it will begin construction immediately to replace its conventional dirt track with a new state-of-the-art, synthetic racing surface to enhance athlete safety in advance of the 2007 race meet, which begins on Friday, May 4, 2007.
“Arlington Park has always and will continue to provide the very best that horseracing has to offer,” said Arlington Park President Roy Arnold in making the announcement at the ESPN Zone in Chicago. “While we are confident the track’s current dirt surface is one of the best, the fact is we lost horses last summer and that’s not acceptable. If we lose one horse, it’s one too many. We have been diligently monitoring other synthetic track installations and racing results, and now possess the knowledge necessary to move forward with a synthetic surface to ensure that Arlington Park remains one of the finest racing surfaces.”
Track officials say the new, synthetic track will substantially raise the level of consistency and safety.
Synthetic horseracing surfaces are comprised of natural and man-made materials that combine to produce a turf-like track that is more forgiving than traditional dirt surfaces, resulting in reduced risk of injury when hooves are planting and sliding on the soil.
“The quality of the track surface has a direct effect on the safety and performance of the horses,” said Dr. Michael Peterson, one of the experts hired by the Illinois Racing Board to review Arlington’s dirt track this summer.
yes, I do. It's in the family. My grandma has followed racing for a very long time, she even saved up to live her dream of owning a little grey filly for a while. Every instance I have seen the horses are treated like kings. (Thats not to say there could be some cases of bad treatment) Ex-racer make great pets/competition horses. (my Player boy :D ;) )
I dont like horse racing because some horses get hurt badly and would have to be put down like that one race horse that hurt his leg very badly. :(
For some horses it maybe good, but I never want my horses in a horse race no matter how much money they make.
My horses safety is more important to me than money!
I don't know much about it, but by some of the replys I see it seems to have much in common with grey racing. There for I am against it.
I don't like horse racing for many reasons:
1. The horses are put on the track too young and suffer too much damage.
2. To most owners, the horses mean money when they win and they will push the horse too hard.
3. I've witnesses too many horses being discarded if they don't win, not caring where they went.
4. I've also witnessed some horses racing while they should have been laid up for injuries.
5. Some of the horses are badly abused for the sake of money.
6. The horses suffer injuries and are retired with life injuries that never get proper treatment because of the cost involved.
These are only a few of the reasons and I should add that some owners truly do care about their horses' welfare. :)
not all, a few get a second chance.Quote:
Originally Posted by mike001
http://canterusa.org/
http://longfellow.zoto.com/img/45/f1...9c7483943-.jpg
http://longfellow.zoto.com/img/45/69...6f002efcd-.jpg
This is "I'm A Player" 1999 seal brown gelding who I shareboarded in 2004. He was sold. :(
For those who mentioned Barbaro, there is speculation that Barbaro had an underlying genetic problem that contributed to the weakness in his bones. The horse people I've talked to were concerned about the preservation of his semen exactly for this reason. They worry that Barbaro's weakness could very likely be genetic. I know it's just speculation, but Barbaro received state-of-the-art care. That's not abuse at all. Athletes get injured and race horses are athletes. I guess I agree with horse racing. I just like to keep an open mind as I understand it's not fair when a few bad sheep cast a dark shadow over the entire sport.
I agree with you 110%.Quote:
Originally Posted by Giselle
Same thing goes for dog racing. If there is ANY kind of abuse, even the smallest hit for correction, I'm against it. Otherwise, I agree with horse racing.
Like greyhound racing and like anything involving animals and people, there are good and bad elements to it. There are good and bad owners.
That sheer speculation by a few people and none of it that I've seen on actual racing threads, there is no basis for it whatsoever. There are breakdowns, unfortunately quite frequently, however the Preakness was in the public eye more which led to such speculation. Barbaro's pedigree was flawless, his father and mother are solid horses, his siblings and half siblings have been solid. If you said that of every horse that has broken or cracked a bone on the track there'd be hundreds with genetically flawed bones. Fleet Indian, the horse who won an Eclipse award, had a leg injury from her last race. Pine Island stumbled and broke her leg badly in the Breeder's Cup and had to be euthanized. St. Liam (retired horse of the year winner) was playing and cavorting and fell this summer, smashing his leg and had to be euthanized. All of this is THE driving force behind making track surfaces safer with PolyTrack.Quote:
For those who mentioned Barbaro, there is speculation that Barbaro had an underlying genetic problem that contributed to the weakness in his bones. The horse people I've talked to were concerned about the preservation of his semen exactly for this reason. They worry that Barbaro's weakness could very likely be genetic.
Anyone can take a misstep, I'm sure most people have stumbled before? However when you combine speed and power and the weight of a horse, stumbling is much more catastrophic. There was absolutely no evidence that his bones were "weak." Something like that can easily be determined by a bone density test.
As far as preserving his semen, they are again wrong. That was never even a consideration since AI is not allowed in the TB racing industry, period. There was never even a question of the possibility of it.
So here's another, more realistic conjecture going on about the accident. Another horse, Brother Derek, may have slightly nicked Barbaro's back leg, causing the stumble. Read through this. It is MUCH more likely than the weak bone theory. A tiny nick of contact wouldn't necessarily even be felt by the jockey.Quote:
One issue Jackson cleared up is that no sperm was taken from Barbaro before he was euthanized. Precise rules have been established that thoroughbreds must breed with mares naturally.
Did Brother Derek Cause Barbaro Injury?
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...o/accident.jpgQuote:
Barbaro trainer Michael Matz said Pimlico officials said that their frame-by-frame study of the race shows that Barbaro was struck by Brother Derek just before the accident, Bloodhorse.com said.
The reviewers were 80% certain some contact was made.
No I don't,
No animal should be made to run on purpose even if there not tired,
I dout any of you would like to be forced to run around a feild over & over.
They go too fast and I don't like hearing about all these poor horses that are getting injured .. maybe it's not commen but there is infact a chance of a horse getting injured no matter what!
It's one of the most stupid things humans came up with! :mad:
Racing animals pffttt .....
Our Jeffrey at school was a racehorse. He was on the cover of Equus magazine as a five year old. Unfortunately, so much racing so young damaged his front feet badly. They both developed laminitis and are now deformed.
He's a pampered boy living out in our field with no obligations and hundreds of people to love on him, but he requires constant attention and frequent pain management as his feet still hurt him at times.
I'm not against horse racing as a rule, I've seen how much those horses LOVE TO RUN, but I do wish it were managed in a way that put the horses well being first.
Horses that are bred for racing have those genetics and most of them LOVE to run. If they didn't want to I'm pretty sure the thousand pound horse could stop and not do it. If done cntrollably and a horse isn't put in race after race it's fine. My old horse used to love to run with the race horses.Quote:
No animal should be made to run on purpose even if there not tired,
I agree 100% with K9Soul's post, from beginning to end.
There is good and bad in horse racing, but there is good and bad in ANY sport, including those with humans as the atheletes, and there is good and bad in owning any animal period. There are humans in all aspects of animal ownership who don't take proper care of their animals. I owned an off the track thoroughbred, she had no physical problems at all, and was always sound from the day I got her. Some of these replies indicate a complete lack of knowledge of horse racing in general, and make a lot of assumptions. Many of these horses live better than many humans, in fact a good majority of them do. I am disgusted by owners and trainers who don't do right by their animals, but that is an exception rather than a rule in racing.
What, how come I didn't hear that! :(Quote:
Originally Posted by K9soul
My Player did. He stopped, turned around, and jumped over the railing. That's why he was sold so cheap as a colt with his pedigree. By Fast Play out of Leading Ballerina (by Moscow Ballet)Quote:
Originally Posted by buttercup
Suki----yes, I agree some are very lucky. I guess being a horse lover it just hurts to see what happens with these horses when their luck runs out. And yes, some go on to be super hunter jumpers. :)
I've never been too keen on the concept of horse-racing myself. Horse racing wasn't invented for the love of horses, but for gambling, profit, and fancy dress.
Yes, the lucky few racehorses are well treated and lead wonderful lives, but not all horses are Red Rum and Desert Orchid. These horses are broken is as COLTS and FILLIES, with their bones not nearly developed for carrying a person on its back no matter how light it is. They are raced at ages of 2 and can be retired at the age of 4, as someone here mentioned. At four years old a horse has just stopped growing! This is why so many have underdeveloped or wonky joints, as their soft bones were damaged during strenuous exercise.
I don't believe that thoroughbred horses weren't born to run. Horses naturally run together in herds and they have enough stamina to run the races. I see no cruelty in that.
Of course, once the racehorse is of no use anymore that's when problems begin. Most end up in cans of dog and cat food. There isn't a great market for ex-racehorses as they can be hot-headed and it takes a patient and experienced person to retrain them, so they're simply gobbled up by the slaughterhouse.
I've also found it a curious fact that, generally, the racehorses that do lead good lives due to their extensive wins never seem to live over much over 20.
So, I think racing horses as a sport is fine, but, as always, you always get those who overly-exploit in the profits involved in it.
K9soul, I read something that said you could preserve TB semen according to foreign rules. It was some odd loophole/finer print thing that I never really paid attention to. Of course, I'm not a horse racing person so I was just posting what the consensus was by the majority of the people I talked to. Now, greyhound racing is an issue I am well versed in, but I digress. ;)
Hehe, his hot-headed, stubborn, crabby temperament is what makes Jeffrey such a valuble teaching horse for us at school! Once we've successfully worked with Jeffrey for awhile, we are far better prepared to work with crabby horses our clients might need looked at.
More colleges should take on ex-racers! *laughs*
I don't mind when pet horses go on trails with there fellow humans or run around in a feild a few times for fun, because then there's no other horses around to smash into each other that are going at full speed, it's even dangerous for the humans .. I mean what if they fall off the horse because it's going too fast and get trampled on?Quote:
Originally Posted by buttercup132
Some horses are indeed happy when racing, they love running as fast as they can but I have seen some races with small whips .. they hit the horses neck or side so it keeps going, a whipe is another stupid invention for horses .. some people just care about winning and not the animal there hurting.
Some racing is okay .. as long as there's no record of injury or abuse.
It's quite possible for a horse to get injured plodding down a trail or running around a field. ANYONE can take a misstep.
exactly, not to mention just being in a pasture, they can get seriously injured! happens all the time. I think the only thing that needs to change about racing, is the age they start traing, and racing. Other than that, i think it is just fine.Quote:
Originally Posted by CathyBogart
Exactly. I used to race other horses with mine. When went out riding with people we'd always go running. And using a crop on a horse's shoulder or butt isn't a bad thing. They have tons of muscle is both those areas a hit from a crop is usually just to tell them to smarten up or to speed up it's not intended to hurt them. And crops aren't very strong they would break before being hit hard enough to hurt the horse. I went through so many when I had Trigger. Any sport is dangerous. People and horses die fom competative jumping too.Quote:
Originally Posted by CathyBogart
That's true but you see the thing is ..Quote:
Originally Posted by CathyBogart
There is a BETTER chance of a horse getting injured while racing.
My friends boy friend got a horse for chariot racing, he said if it ever broke it's leg he would shoot the thing, now he was joking but there are people out there who don't want to deal with a injured horse while they can get a new healthy horse, I also hope my friends boy friend gets rid of that poor horse because I don't want it to pull some stupid wagon around a feild with a whip.
I voted no, but honestly I'm more of an undecided. I know that I can't watch horse racing. I burst into tears whenever a horse falls down. I can't even watch western movies for the same reason. :( :o
I do NOT agree with it at all they are trained to early they get mistreated, have to race on hot days (what about heatwave's) :( and are constantly getting whipped :(
NOT true actualy i was watching tv the other day and they were taking a lokk at all the crop and everything and they said that the kind of crop's that pro jockey's use do hit really hard whethter the horse has muscle or not its not fair how would you like it ????Quote:
Originally Posted by buttercup132
Ha, I bought a new crop this fall and the first tme I used it it broke. Solo was being stupid and he knew it so he got what was coming to him!Quote:
Originally Posted by buttercup132
I agree with racing...I am pretty sure horses are much more likley to be hurt in Eventing or Cross Country or Jumping - they jump so high and hit so hard on the way down that their fetlocks strain the tendons and ligaments that are meant to cup it and keep it up.
Horses are also very likely to be hurt doing things as mundane has carriage rides. Hitting the solid ground can seriously damage the horses feet, to the point where they need special boots.
Quite frankly though - you see many more horses being injured today in racing than thirty years ago - that's mostly a breeding problem - when they bred for faster they bred for lighter...thats why they get injured.
Barbaro kept on running for a tiny bit even after he was injured - not because his rider wanted him to (I dont think such a tiny guy could keep such a big boy movin' )...but because he wanted to keep running....that should tell you something about these horses - they love to run, they love speed, they love showing and moving...horses are seriously hams - they know when they are being adored or when they are doing something important.
I see it in the program that my school runs - we breed warmbloods and sell them in a big benefit sale in october. With some of the show oriented horses (The hunters, jumpers, eventers, and dressage types) you can just tell - they almost light up when we work with them in the ring (never long enough to injure bones mind you, and never backed). We had one big boy (17hh 1yr old :eek: ) named Primo who was a bred jumper - he had top have surgery on his tendons to lengthen them because he was just so dang big, and he was always so grumpy when he had the bandages on...and whenever he got let out to do some exercise he would prance and be happy and bounce (dangerous for the handler...but very funny to watch.)
As far as the crop - I have been smacked by them before...it hurts, but we also have alot more nerves on our skin and alot more hair and thickness to it...when we use whips in training we really just trail them behind the horses to get them moving - rarely do they get touched...if they do its lightly (or when you're inept with the whip and lunge line like me...you whip yourself and the horse starts at the crack and moves faster).
Just some insight from someone who majors in horses.
this video is of a horse that wants nothing more to do than race and put himself in a lot of danger because of his desire to run and be first, :eek:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-xR1HErmH8
I know many have discussed injuries as a reason they do not agree, tracks whether at dog tracks or horse tracks are engineered the turns are pitched. special sands are used and groomed to provide the safest possible surface to run on, owners invest thousands of dollars into their animals, the last thing they want to see is them getting hurt so design of a track is critical
My dogs have a far greater risk of injury running in my yard(I have clay based soil which becomes rock hard in summer so have no shock absorbing properties , in the rainy period can become very slick and slippery which had resulted in falls, with repetitive running grass get ripped out and ruts and uneveness occurs which then adds to the hazard of misteps, objects in the yard like trees, patios sets, sheds can become collision hazards especially if the dog is running a slips losing it balance when testing themselves and having fun running tight figures 8 around these objects which can result in skin tears since they have thin skin to start with, or slipping and falling on stairs rushing in and out of the house. So a home has far more hazards than the track has, and greyhounds have dies and have had serious injuries just running around in family yards or at dog parks, we just do not hear of it as often as there is no media to capture the accident on film or large audience watching
Everybody seems to think racing equals lots of money and profit, only a few horses ever make money, the majority are lucky if they earn enough to pay off what money was invested into them and a few dollars extra, that is the same with dog racing, people that get it too that realize that, they mostly are involved to the the love of working with the animals, I know horse require quite a bit care so probably just like dog racing owner they also invest long days into caring raising and training, on greyhound farms and kennels the days start at 5 am getting yourself ready before starting first turnouts and not over until 10 or 11 at night with last turnout, but can turn into a 24 hour day if animal are sick or about to give birth, and it is a 365 day a year job, with no holidays. Greyhounds and horses are very sensitive, hard handedness will likely destroy any handling or racing ability because trust is breached and they lose self confidence, if one invested all this time, energy and money, why would anyone purposely abuse a ruin a potential racing career, it just makes no logical sense.
For that reason abuse is far from common as people claim, having a money earning winner is rare enough without ruining your chances by abusing the animal by hurting it and losing it's trust.
Here is my greyhound Maya data page
http://greyhound-data.com/d?z=uz4m7D&d=leonor+chick
For here your can look at her entire litter and see how many made money consider that each pup out of the litter costed approx $4,000 to get to racing age(stud fees, vet care, feeding, registering, tatooing, training, licencing, transportation, track adoption fee{mandatory fee to race at most tracks nowadays} etc) they were all owned by the same racing owner, the owner breeds his own dogs, cost would have been much higher if he had to buy a pup
Maya(aka Leonor Chick) had zero races, she was too shy to race
So owner is in the hole $4000 with her
Abby (aka Abacu Racey) had 14 races all were training races no money earned the best he did was a 5th place win. Add in Abby and owner is now out $8,000
Gracie (aka Chola Chick) had 7 training races best was a 4th place finish again zero earning. Owner now has a $12,000 loss
Doroteo Racey had 27 races he had 15 training races had placed first, second and third but they were in training so no money but in actual money earning races bombed out. so 4 dogs zero wins now in the hole $16,000
Lola (aka Lolita Chick) had 40 races she had 2 first place finishes, a second and 4 third place finishes. She basically paid for herself
Perico Racey had 14 races never made it out of training races so zero earnings so at this point the racing owner is out $20K
Lucas Racey had 80 races, if it was not for Lucas the owner would have lost a lot of money on the litter. His first year was just a so-so racer, and the later part of second year he proved himself moving up into higher grade races and winning a stakes race. He was not phenemonal and ended very quickly but his winning would have been just enough to offset the losses the owner accrued with the rest of the litter and made a few extra dollars but not even close enough to support oneself for the 3 years spent raising and racing this litter, it would take an exceptional litter to actually make a living on and they are very , very rare. Horse racing would be even tougher since a mare one give birth to one or two foals and the cost of raising a horse is much higher than raising a dog so odds of making money is even less, so owners are not in it for the money as many seem to think, the odds are like buying lottery tickets the chances of losing money is much higher than earning money, those that are involve do it for the love of the sport and love of the animals that participate in it. Standardbred racing is big in my area and a few people I work with have stardardbred racers and when they talk about it, they are talking about their horses amd their antics and the pride they have in them much like any other pet owner does, not about the money they will earn.
Inorder to stay racing or to move out of maiden/training races a dog must place within so many if they don't they get disqualified as a result a dog that is no good or has no heart to race will become weeded out of racing naturally, only dogs who love to race and have the capacity for will stay in racing.
Current regulations require that all adoptable dogs that go to a track to race must be adopted out in the US the exceptions is the dog returned to the farm for breeding, one that becomes too severely injured and euthansia become a kindness instead or those who have severe temperament issues(which is extremely rare in greyhound but there are the odd ones who are extremely agressive and have a biting history)
The owner is one of the top breeders in the country the family has been involved with greyhound racing for a few generations, he is a staunch supporter of greyhound adoption, when one track adoption kennel ran into severe trouble because of other track closures and was not able to place dogs as fast as they were retiring, which put them at risk of being euthanized because there was no place for the dogs to go to, he stepped in and saved the day by taking in 200 retirees and boarding them of his farm until adoptions places became available and worked closely with Greyhound Pets of America allowing representatives to come onto the farm to assess all the dogs taking photos, making behavioural and personality assessments and testing them with small dogs and cats, inorder to help get them placed into suitable homes, it took almost a year before they were all moved into homes or adoption agencies,
I am not a racing owner, but a pet owner, I have had 3 greyhounds of my own, fostered several, and did volunteer work with local adoptions groups included travelling to the US to pick up dogs, I have gotten to know a few dog trainers/owners , and have friends who race horses. I grew up with hunting dogs so understand their love of going to work, and witnessed all to often their misery and unhappiness if they left at home instead of taken on the hunt
Injuries occur all the time in homes, some injuries are fixable like broken legs but like in racing not every owner can afford a 2 to 3 thousand dollar vet bill, so owners are often faced with the painful decision of euthanizing rather than allowing the dog to suffering if they have no money for vetting.
One of my greyhounds was fortunate, the track adoption kennel at the time had no money for large vet bills and had a policy that require all dogs being placed for adoption must be walking on all 4 legs, being this is a low end track the payouts to winning dogs are low, it is a track where people starting off in the business would get there start or those who fell on hard times that could not afford to race at the bigger tracks so money was scarce to pay for orthosurgeries, Sunny was one of the more exceptional racers on the track plus a couple others in his litter was also doing well, so when he broke his leg there was money available to pay of surgeries and 4 months of recovery care till he was fit to enter the adoption kennel.
Over the last few years there has been publicity about dogs that break their legs, which in turn helped with fund raising to help raise monies to help get more broken legs treated and now the dogs that do break their legs get a chance for a couch, interestingly enough most of these dogs are very outgoing in nature and really want to please and they also tend to have outstanding track performances, their whole nature of wanting to press themselves to the ultimate limits is what results in their injuries not the racing conditions. Most common is a right rear hock fracture due to the stress of propelling themselves so hard wanting to be first. In the video above with the horse it can help you understand the drive that can push these animals to the limits, they don't need people to force them
To prove the point take a look at these dogs most are all broken legged racers , http://www.floridagreyhounds.com/spneeds.htm
copy their names to greyhound datas search box and then click on their races on the heading, you will see they are either grade A racers or that they will have greater than a hundred races to their name
example this is Jimbo Mikey results http://greyhound-data.com/d?l=715641
What makes them good racers also makes them excellent perts, Most of these dogs will make easy transitions to homes and have a sheer love of people and love getting attention. And being broken legged does not mean the end of running either Sunny still has enough power to knock me off my feet if he runs into me when he is feeling playful and silly 5 years after breaking his leg though this picture was taken about 8 months after breaking the leg, and even in a home he has had to have additional vetting due to running injuries in his desire to still be first, :rolleyes:
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y53...5d1c1597f9.jpg
Nope. I don't agree that horses naturally race like that either. Horses in nature might race each other for play, but they don't run in a line so tightly and they don't have a person on their back. Should they get tired or injured in the wild, they can stop anytime. In a race, they don't get to stop like that.
lol, most of the time they do....
Its not hard to tell if a horse gets injured from their back...their gait changes, it becomes less even and you will probably loose the groove that you've been in because something changed. Most (good) jockeys will stop the horse at this point...however it is sometimes hard because the horses dont want to stop running....you should watch it...they have an amazing amount of heart, and sometimes they just dont realize it.
I would worry...horses are more likley to break legs in a pothole ridden field than on the track.
But then again, horses can break their legs doing anything....they just have so little muscle on those lower legs...everything is operated by stored and released energy, they are like rubber bands, so there is alot of tension and therefore it is not difficult for things to break in general.