What would you do????

This is a post from another forum i belong to, and curious what your answer would be???

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We are struggling with what to do about our 9 year old chocolate lab. His name is Andy. Before Christmas, our 2 year old DD was laying on his back and even after he growled at her, she didn't get up, so he snapped at her face. He left a long scratch on her cheek with his tooth, that bruised pretty badly. The next day, my 5 year old DS did the same thing!! Of course, Andy did the same thing to him, but this time he actually punctured my DS's cheek. We had a long talk with the kids, explaining how they were hurting Andy and even though he shouldn't have bitten them, he was only defending himself. My DS understood and is now being more careful when he's playing with Andy, but our DD (she's now 3) just doesn't understand. Then, last week, our DD slid down off our Bed and landed on Andy (he was on the floor next to the bed) and he jumped right up and snapped at her face again. Again, he left a big scratch that turned to a bruise. This time though, it was very close to her eye.

My Mom and Dad want us to have Andy put to sleep, cuz they are worried that next time will just be more severe. My first concern is for my children (we also have an 8 year old DD, and she has no problems with Andy, they play all the time), and I'm scared to death that something much worse could happen. But, Andy has been in our family for 9 years and we love him as one of our kids. I just don't feel it's fair for him to lose his life, because he was defending himself.

What do all of you think???

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I wouldn't have the dog PTS, but I would seriously consider rehoming him somewhere where there are no small children.

tough one.......but I would see if possible to place the dog where the kids had no access........so he won´t be disturbed but still in our family.......it´s a tough choice to decide between skin kids and furry kids........but you gotta do what´s best for both........if you can prevent the dog bitting by keeping children out of reach, I think that would solve most of the problems.......

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Originally Posted by prechrswife

I wouldn't have the dog PTS, but I would seriously consider rehoming him somewhere where there are no small children.

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that is exactly what I told her, but she said her biggest fear is that he would do the same to someone else. But to me, it just seems like it is the children, that are obviously uncontrolled driving this poor older dog insane!

Well- I paid over 4 grand at the time ( hate to say what it would be now a days) for a dog that had a problem with small children. I rehomed the dog- lost money but they were thrilled they got a trained dog and had no small children.
My borzois do not understand small children either- but our children are grown- and no grandchildren...
I would rehome in this situation as its workable, but no reason to put to sleep...

Obviously the poor old dog is suffering some discomfort from an as yet undiagnosed ailment and the children are causing him pain. Could be arthritis, bad hips or something much more serious. He's reacting in the only way that a dog can to let them know they're inflicting pain.

The first thing I'd do would be to take the dog to the vet, have him checked over from head to toe and do a complete blood panel. In the meantime I'd keep him completely away from the kids. The dog isn't the one going after the kids, it's the other way around.

Only after a complete health check would I begin thinking about what to do next!

Rehome the skin kids. They aren't listening, they keep laying on or landing on the poor doggie's back, they are not trainable. They need to be in a dogless home; or in a home with no dog over the age of 4. If they keep this up, they will be PTS, as they are hurting a living being and that is just not right for them or fair to them. It's not their fault they aren't trainable.

You could try putting up a doggie gate to keep them away from the dog, but they could possible jump over that and get into more trouble.

Have you tried cookies? Sometimes, using cookies as a treat reward, you can retrain them and get their behaviour the way you want it to be. But that takes time and patience, not sure you have that luxury here. The dog could be hurt in the meantime!

Maybe keep the kids safe in the bathroom or in the basement; have you considered tying them out in the back yard? That way, the dog approaches them if and when the dog wants to and the dog is kept safe. The kids stay out of trouble while you figure out what to do.

How about a behaviourist to get through to the kids? Sometimes what the parents can't do a trained expert can.

Then there may also be a psychic communicator who can get through to these young kids using their language skill level. That may be another way out.

What about building a barrier around th ekids so that they can't get too close to the dog without the dog knowing they are in the vicinity? then the dog can just leave the area if it wants to; like putting a bell on a cat, ya know?

Hey a football helmut would work, it would protect the kiddo's face from the dog's muzzle. That is another thought. You can get them with padding so the kids won't feel a thing while they are wearing it.

I bet other PT'ers will have some ideas.

I definitely would NOT put the dog to sleep.

Still, keeping in him a home where there is a child too young to understand respect for him and the parents can't be bothered to train this child otherwise is not really safe. You can understand him not wanting a toddler laying on him or landing on him etc...many dogs would snap at children for this, heck, they would snap at their own pups for this. To dogs, this is perfectly normal behaviour, their version of discipline. It is nothing to do with the dog being vicious, it has everything to do with the dog simply being a dog.

I doubt he intends any harm on the children, the scratches they recieved would have been accidental. Pups have fur covering their faces but human children do not but a dog can't tell the difference.

If they want to keep the dog with them, their only choice is to drill it into the younger child not to lay on him or jump on him etc...
They should never ever leave a young child unattended with a dog even for a second anyway and they MUST always be supervised so that they are there to stop the toddler if she tries to do something they think will upset the dog.
Even toddlers of 2 can learn simple things like this. In fact, you'd be surprised at what they can learn. People get the wrong idea that children as young as this are too young to understand anything so they are too soft on them and let them get away with things or even laugh at bad behaviour like when they smack an adult but the child is learning a lot, they are learning how soft their parents are for example so a few years down the line, they have an uncontrollable little brat that throws tantrums etc....the price to pay for being too soft on a toddler you don't think understands anything. At least when they are a toddler, you don't need to use as much force to get your message across like you'd need with an older child who got too used to getting away with murder. If you get it into their heads early that they cannot push you, they will be much better behaved when they are a bit older.

No child should be left unattended with any dog for any amount of time under any circumstances anyway and they should stop her if they see her go to do anything that could end up in tears.

Also, they mention that the child was laying on his back and he growled but she didn't get up so he snapped at her. Why the hell did they leave her laying on him if he was growling. Didn't they figure it was time to get the girl off of him before he lost his temper?

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Originally Posted by Freedom

Rehome the skin kids. They aren't listening, they keep laying on or landing on the poor doggie's back, they are not trainable. They need to be in a dogless home; or in a home with no dog over the age of 4. If they keep this up, they will be PTS, as they are hurting a living being and that is just not right for them or fair to them. It's not their fault they aren't trainable.

You could try putting up a doggie gate to keep them away from the dog, but they could possible jump over that and get into more trouble.

Have you tried cookies? Sometimes, using cookies as a treat reward, you can retrain them and get their behaviour the way you want it to be. But that takes time and patience, not sure you have that luxury here. The dog could be hurt in the meantime!

Maybe keep the kids safe in the bathroom or in the basement; have you considered tying them out in the back yard? That way, the dog approaches them if and when the dog wants to and the dog is kept safe. The kids stay out of trouble while you figure out what to do.

How about a behaviourist to get through to the kids? Sometimes what the parents can't do a trained expert can.

Then there may also be a psychic communicator who can get through to these young kids using their language skill level. That may be another way out.

What about building a barrier around th ekids so that they can't get too close to the dog without the dog knowing they are in the vicinity? then the dog can just leave the area if it wants to; like putting a bell on a cat, ya know?

Hey a football helmut would work, it would protect the kiddo's face from the dog's muzzle. That is another thought. You can get them with padding so the kids won't feel a thing while they are wearing it.

I bet other PT'ers will have some ideas.

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ROFLMAO!!! :D :D I want to thank you for the humor! You had hubby and I laughing like crazy. Thank you for brightening our day! :)

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Originally Posted by prechrswife

I wouldn't have the dog PTS, but I would seriously consider rehoming him somewhere where there are no small children.

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same here.. I hope they don't bring him to the shelter. :(

If they aren't going to try to find out what's wrong with the dog first, they have no right to pawn it off on someone else. They should just go ahead and have it killed and put it out of it's misery rather than sending it away for someone else to deal with.

A 9 year old dog that has been raised with active kids doesn't suddenly start biting for no reason. The dog is hurting!

I agree, I would take him to a Vet first & foremost.

If he isn't it pain, it sounds like he's cranky in his old age, and obviously isn't exercising good bite inhibition. Gonzo has done a few "corrections" to my little brother (who is a madman, btw) over the years, but hasn't left a single mark, or even gotten close to touching him.

The poor dog should retire in peace, if they aren't willing to supervise the kids around the dog more often. I would recommend complete supervision, and always having the kids around the dog only when the kids are quiet. Also utilizing a crate, or a safe area for the dog to get away to.

At least they're trying! Some people would euthanize their dog in a second for this.

I'm with Canis-Lupess on this. The dog is not the agressor. If the parents don't teach the kids to leave the dog alone, THEY are at fault.

I would have expecteed the toddlers to get the message when their actions caused them pain. Even puppies understand that if they get hurt doing something, don't do it again. As for the kid falling off the bed onto the dog, that was hard to avoid. Maybe the dog needs a kennel to get away from everyone when he needs to. And teach the kids the kennel is the dog's safe place; Leave him alone when he's in there.

I had to laugh at the "Tongue in cheek" post. :D

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Originally Posted by Catlady711

ROFLMAO!!! :D :D I want to thank you for the humor! You had hubby and I laughing like crazy. Thank you for brightening our day! :)

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Hey I agree with her too.. loll.. ( spoken like someone without small children in the house other than visitors- and btw- the kids are told to leave the dogs ALONE.. lol.. )

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Originally Posted by Freedom

Rehome the skin kids. They aren't listening, they keep laying on or landing on the poor doggie's back, they are not trainable. They need to be in a dogless home; or in a home with no dog over the age of 4. If they keep this up, they will be PTS, as they are hurting a living being and that is just not right for them or fair to them. It's not their fault they aren't trainable.

You could try putting up a doggie gate to keep them away from the dog, but they could possible jump over that and get into more trouble.

Have you tried cookies? Sometimes, using cookies as a treat reward, you can retrain them and get their behaviour the way you want it to be. But that takes time and patience, not sure you have that luxury here. The dog could be hurt in the meantime!

Maybe keep the kids safe in the bathroom or in the basement; have you considered tying them out in the back yard? That way, the dog approaches them if and when the dog wants to and the dog is kept safe. The kids stay out of trouble while you figure out what to do.

How about a behaviourist to get through to the kids? Sometimes what the parents can't do a trained expert can.

Then there may also be a psychic communicator who can get through to these young kids using their language skill level. That may be another way out.

What about building a barrier around th ekids so that they can't get too close to the dog without the dog knowing they are in the vicinity? then the dog can just leave the area if it wants to; like putting a bell on a cat, ya know?

Hey a football helmut would work, it would protect the kiddo's face from the dog's muzzle. That is another thought. You can get them with padding so the kids won't feel a thing while they are wearing it.

I bet other PT'ers will have some ideas.

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LOL I like this idea!!:D
That poor dog. Why would they have it put to sleep?!! It did nothing wrong it needs to be rehomed in a place with no kids or older kids who won't jump on its back.

Thank you all! I am glad to hear that i have been conveying the exact same message! I think it is sad for this poor old dog. The do needs to go to a vet and be checked.