Rest in Peace Terri.
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Rest in Peace Terri.
If someone set up such a strong smear campaign as terri's parents did to michael, I'd sure as heck not let them see her either.
The last person she saw was the one who KNEW what HER wishes were, and that was to NOT live like that.
Fifteen years is too long to hold onto a mere shell with no cognitive functions.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7306432/site/newsweek/
(from page one of that link)
"In the early years of her condition, Michael and the Schindlers got along harmoniously, even living together in a house on the Gulf Coast for a while. They ensured that Terri received all variety of therapies, including physical, occupational and recreational. When those didn't work, Michael flew her out to California, where a doctor implanted platinum electrodes into her brain as part of an experimental procedure that ultimately failed. Back in Florida, Michael enlisted family members to record audiotapes of their voices, which he played for Terri on a Walkman. He was fastidious about Terri's appearance, spraying her with Picasso perfume and outfitting her in stirrup pants and matching tops from The Limited. At one Florida nursing home, he was so demanding that administrators sought a restraining order against him. But Gloria Centonze, who worked there at the time (and by coincidence later married into the family of Michael's future girlfriend), recalls a frequent comment among the nurses: "He may be a bastard, but if I was sick like that, I wish he was my husband." To better care for Terri, Michael even enrolled in nursing school.
Eventually, however, his relationship with the Schindlers soured over money. Michael had sued the obstetrician who oversaw Terri's fertility therapy for malpractice, arguing that the doctor should have detected her potassium imbalance. A resulting settlement yielded roughly $700,000 for Terri—which was placed in a trust fund controlled by a third party for her medical care—and $300,000 for Michael. On Valentine's Day in 1993, the Schindlers met Michael in Terri's room and discussed how to spend the award money. While the parents claim that Michael refused to use it for new treatment options, Michael alleges that they simply wanted the cash for themselves. Whatever the truth is, the discussion escalated into a vitriolic fight, and both sides stormed out, never to speak again.
After that, the relationship became steadily more toxic. Michael had begun to resign himself to the prospect that Terri would never improve, according to his court testimony. When she developed a urinary-tract infection in 1994, Michael followed a doctor's recommendation not to treat it, and entered a "do not resuscitate" order (which he later rescinded after the nursing home and the Schindlers protested). The parents responded with one of many legal attempts—all of them unsuccessful—to remove Michael as Terri's guardian, accusing him of abuse, neglect and adultery (he had moved in with a girlfriend and eventually had two babies with her). More than a few observers have questioned the timing of Michael's change of heart, coming so soon after the malpractice award. But Michael has repeatedly insisted that after years of fruitless efforts to revive Terri, he had simply given up hope."
does ThAT sound like someone wanting to kill her?
(from page three of that link)
"In the course of the trial, the Schindlers also made what a court-appointed guardian for Terri deemed "horrific" and "gruesome" comments—that the family would never remove Terri's feeding tube even if she had asked them to, and that even if she developed gangrene, the family would amputate her limbs to keep her alive."
(from that link)
"A resulting settlement yielded roughly $700,000 for Terri—which was placed in a trust fund controlled by a third party for her medical care"
We'll see what the autopsy has to say, though I highly doubt that will shut up all the people who accuse Michael of doing something to Terri.
At least she's RIP now, finally
I'm not going to get into a contest with you, Luvin Labs, but it surprises me that you have so much more of a strong opinion than even the experts do about what was right for this woman! Really! You are a relative newcomer to this board, and we welcome you, but I have to say you certainly have come on strongly for a newcomer.
Your "insider" knowledge is just more of what we are all dealing with.... not knowing. I think most of us have tried to view this whole situation as humanely as possible with our wishes erring on the side of life when there was doubt, which their obviously was, with the lack of a physical document stating Terri Shiavo's wishes.
Your opinion about what was best for Terri obviously differs from mine, but I find it almost unbelievable that you continue to ridicule and fault people who wished for something different that you did....I am a parent and I have to tell you that if there were a glimmer of hope that my daughter could live and I could care for her, by God, I would do that. I certainly wouldn't do it to the point of being cruel, but this was a living, breathing person, who needed nutrition, but otherwise was healthy. Yes, she was disabled, but to her parents, she was everything. I understand their sentiment completely.
Logan
This was just downright cruel of him to do IMO. He could have been the "bigger person" and let her flesh and blood family be there when she died. :mad:Quote:
Originally posted by momoffuzzyfaces
So sad that her husband couldn't be merciful and let her parents be with her when she died. I'm sure Terri never told him to keep them away!
His girl friend has been promoted to fiancee now (at least on CNN). Yea, his girl friend cried when she heard Terri was gone. Now she can plan her wedding!!! Couldn't they wait until after the funeral at least?
Rest in peace Terri. I bet they have a big party for you in Heaven with plenty to eat and drink.
Disgusting:mad:
I really don't like him after that behavior. Personally, I'd want my flesh and blood family there for me on my deathbed...:(
Amen Logan. I agree completely. I have to wonder about those who fault the parents. Are they parents themselves? I watched Bobby Schindler today giving a statement after Terri's death. He said that we should remember the words of Jesus who said "Father forgive them for they know not what they do." As my eyes filled with tears, I thought right then and there that Bobby was a better Christian than I.Quote:
I am a parent and I have to tell you that if there were a glimmer of hope that my daughter could live and I could care for her, by God, I would do that. I certainly wouldn't do it to the point of being cruel, but this was a living, breathing person, who needed nutrition, but otherwise was healthy. Yes, she was disabled, but to her parents, she was everything. I understand their sentiment completely.
Logan
Just read that Michael Schiavo will not disclose where Terri will be buried in Pennsylvania so that her parents/family cannot be there. How heartless can you be?? That is HER family. Her FAMILY. Her flesh and blood. I don't care what difference he had with them, to keep them from their own daughter's burial is revolting.
I was reserving judgement of him because all I know of him is what I've heard of him, but I can't help it anymore. No one with his heart in the right place does something like this.
http://famulus.msnbc.com/famulusgen/...ts=33120051604
I too have reserved my opinion's on the husband, but if this is indeed the truth , he is heartless and I can only say 'What goes around come's around" shame on him.
It has only come to me today, that I could indeed be faced with a similar but yet different situation in my own life, I can only hope that this does not be-fall my family, because I have a hereditary disease known as Huntingtons Chorea in my family, should my mother, my sister or myself succumb to this awful disease, we will eventually have trouble swallowing, we will not recognise anyone, more or less brain dead, have terrible involuntary muscle spasms, we will be in a vegetable state and this could go on for ten years or so, I can tell you now I DONOT want to be kept alive like this in hope there will be a cure, so for me Voluntary euthenasia(sp) is something I will be an avocate for, I have always believed in it, but until this case with Terri, I never gave it much thought, not realising just how real this could all become if I am the unlucky one.
My aunty mysteriously drowned herself three years ago in a freezing cold lake in Scotland, I have to wonder to this day if she thought she had the disease, and was not going to wait for all of the above to happen, she never left a suicide note, so we will never know.
One can never judge another until you have walked in those shoes I reckon.
I cannot see how anyone could feel badly towards the parents, they were only doing what they thought was right, their beliefs, how can you fault them for that., just as Logan mentioned she would do for her child if there was even a glimmer of hope.
I never said I had insider information :rolleyes: I feel strongly on this because I feel that the husband would know more about her wishes than her parents, as SHE chose HIM, not them. And I may be seeing things but I see a lot of people (not just on this site) that aren't looking at the facts of this case, and only of the opinions of people directly involved.
AND... I'm expressing an opinion out of all the information I've seen, just like you :)
That is upsetting, they all need to move on and even though they did not agree they all should at least know where she is buried.Quote:
Just read that Michael Schiavo will not disclose where Terri will be buried in Pennsylvania so that her parents/family cannot be there. How heartless can you be?? That is HER family. Her FAMILY. Her flesh and blood. I don't care what difference he had with them, to keep them from their own daughter's burial is revolting.
I can also understand why Michael would, since the parents did bring it higher than it really needed to go.Quote:
'If Mike knew they would come in peace, he would have no problem with it,'' Scott Schiavo, Michael Schiavo's brother, said during an interview at his home.
I feel for both sides (no matter what people assume I feel about the parents or the hubby) and hope this won't be a media circus for too long.
http://news.findlaw.com/hdocs/docs/s...1203galrpt.pdf
Page 14 is pretty interesting, and SICK IMO... It states that even if all her limbs were to be chopped off that they would still want her to 'live." And they even admitted that she is in a diagnosed PVS... !!!! Its the second full paragraph on Page 14... :eek:
Personally, I disagree. If I were the mother of a man or woman who was in a situation anywhere close to Terri's, I can honestly say that if I felt in my heart of hearts that my child's spouse were making the wrong decisions, I would fight them too. That child is my flesh and blood. And no matter to what extent I'd fight to keep that son or daughter alive, if they were to pass away I certainly wouldn't invite any media attention afterwards. I feel her parents probably feel the same way. I can't imagine they'd want something as somber as their daughter's funeral and burial to be a circus. If Michael were to relent and they did turn it into a media circus, I would lose respect for them.Quote:
Originally posted by Luvin Labs
I can also understand why Michael would, since the parents did bring it higher than it really needed to go.
(I'm not attacking you, Luvin Labs. As you said, you have every right to your opinion on the matter as do the rest of us. You just said something I don't agree with and I wanted to present my side/views on the issue.)
i agree... I really hope that MS will change his mind, I see his reason for concern but he should let them be there for the funeral... as people said they are her flesh and blood... and if it did turn into a circus then my respect for them would also be dwindling if not gone...Quote:
Personally, I disagree. If I were the mother of a man or woman who was in a situation anywhere close to Terri's, I can honestly say that if I felt in my heart of hearts that my child's spouse were making the wrong decisions, I would fight them too. That child is my flesh and blood. And no matter to what extent I'd fight to keep that son or daughter alive, if they were to pass away I certainly wouldn't invite any media attention afterwards. I feel her parents probably feel the same way. I can't imagine they'd want something as somber as their daughter's funeral and burial to be a circus. If Michael were to relent and they did turn it into a media circus, I would lose respect for them.
no sweat, SP, and I'm not attacking either....Quote:
(I'm not attacking you, Luvin Labs. As you said, you have every right to your opinion on the matter as do the rest of us. You just said something I don't agree with and I wanted to present my side/views on the issue.)
as i said before if we all agreed on everything it'd be a boring world, I M O :)
Have a Happy Puppy! :)
Go to http://www.terrisfight.org/index2.html and you will see exactly what her so called husband is doing with the money, that was intended to pay for medical bills. It is at the bottom of the page but the entire page is interesting. He (Terris husband) has not even planed her funeral and is already planing his next wifes wedding. I am going to put in my will that if my husband starts dateing another woman then I am to file for divorce. I would want my parents to be my gardians they would never leave me or move on to another.
That's not really a unbiased site to get facts from (i.e. that's a biased site)Quote:
Originally posted by tortuga55
Go to http://www.terrisfight.org/index2.html and you will see exactly what her so called husband is doing with the money, that was intended to pay for medical bills. It is at the bottom of the page but the entire page is interesting.
Where bouts is it? I'm looking at the bottom and do not see it... still looking
Edit: n/m found it.
Edit again: Where is their source for that spending information? Thanks :)
Actually, that website is biased towards her parents because it's their website for her.
I find that http://abstractappeal.com/schiavo/infopage.html is completely non-biased; it favors neither Michael, nor her parents. When looking for legal, medical or timeline information on this case, that is the site I reference.
It's over. It's done. Let us not get into the after-effects/affects between us. We already have established that we have VERY differing opinions on the whole issue. I WOULD HATE TO HAVE TO CONTINUE THIS VERY SAD AND DIVISIVE SITUATION BETWEEN US. Enough please. Let's have more respect for each other.
Did I miss something? I thought that as controversial as this topic is those who have taken part in this discussion have kept it extremely benign and respectful.
Indeed we have, and I would like it to continue that way. But I do think that some of the after the fact comments have been a bit controversial, as is the whole situation. Sorry, perhaps I should have just kept quiet :(
Ibaker I think you can see there might be potential for this thread to enter dangerous waters, but really I think this has been a very informative and emotional thread which has been handled very maturely on the whole by all of our wonderful caring PT members, would you not agree?
Don't be afraid to speak your concerns, after all that is what it is all about here, I merely see you as being just that, a tad concerned incase the thread gets out of hand,overall it is a healthy discussion and I think it will continue to be so hopefully.:)
My views differ as well since I wanted very much for Terri's will to be respected - although it could never be truly known. The husband has made it very easy to dislike and disbelieve him. God only knows.
Her death came as a relief and I do not believe she was "murdered". Feeding tubes are removed every day and death is not pleasant to watch - but it is something we all will face. My feeling is that medical breakthroughs have greatly prolonged life - but sometimes border on playing God. I am an RN and have spent time in nursing homes and see many sad souls who might not be lingering if their lives had simply progressed naturally.
This thread has been very thought provoking - and we all come to the issue with our own backgrounds and reasons - let me explain mine....
I recently lost my mom. My dad was so upset and unable to make rational decisons about her care. He refused to sign the DNR until many conversations that we had. She was 83, advanced Alzheimers, suffered two strokes and had a severe infection in her hip. She had been dying for many, many months but dad had them try everything possible to keep her with him. I traveled to Texas and sat with her alone as she died. Dad could not be there.
I myself have renal failure and my wish is NOT to be kept alive or to seek life-extending measures when that time comes and so have put my desires into my Living Will.
So, when I have been watching the coverage - I can easily see how this could be ME with hubby wanting to follow my wishes and parents who cannot let go. Of course there are few other similarities, but my point is that our personal circumstances affect the way we have passionately followed the Schiavo case. I seldom followed the case while thinking of myself as the mother but when I did, it was almost too painful to think about - and this may be the reason for the tremendous difference in viewpoints, whether from our personal life circumstance and experiences, or from the eyes we view it. Am I making sense??
I don't think there is any evil or hatefulness on either side - but it has made all of us think about matters of death...
Plus, this case has political undertones and agendas that are disturbing. What exactly - will become more clear in the future.
started with an eating disorder, ended with an eating disorder I don't care to say that I've been between anorexia and bulimia for 8 years, just because I live with it doesnt mean want to end my life with it, and I'm sure Terri would agree.
Quote:
Originally posted by tortuga55
I am going to put in my will that if my husband starts dateing another woman then I am to file for divorce. I would want my parents to be my gardians they would never leave me or move on to another.
At least in the US...one's will does not come into play until AFTER one has died. So, putting such language into your will that you want to divorce your husband after you have died is come what "complicating". :D The law here in the US makes death one of the ways a marriage ends, and it is automatic.
Also, the law in the US doesn't really support directives such as 'if my husband should marry....then I want to do this...' in wills, living wills, etc. Just some information for when you do your estate planning.
Quote:
Originally posted by Edwina's Secretary
I have told my husband the greatest compliment he could pay me, should I die before him, is to remarry quickly. That marriage was a good thing. If I should be in a long term coma or mentally gone because of dementia or the like...I would WANT him to have female companionship.
Life is for the living....and it is very short. I would not want him to be lonely. I trust he could find ways to honor my memory and still find some pleasure in life.
I must say I find this to be 100% 'proof' of a loving, committed marriage. To want your spouse, or your parent, or your child, or your pet to sit around and watch you fade away is a bit morbid for my tastes. How could you NOT want your loving partner to go on and experience happiness, life, joy, etc?
Quote:
Originally posted by LKPike
started with an eating disorder, ended with an eating disorder I don't care to say that I've been between anorexia and bulimia for 8 years, just because I live with it doesnt mean want to end my life with it, and I'm sure Terri would agree.
There is a certain irony to the situation, IMO. I wonder, I wonder...if we got ahold of people with anorexia/bulimia at the early age/stage, and did some 'in your face' imagery with what these debilitating diseases do, would we be more sucessful in treating them? We do it with beginning smokers- citing the risks of lung cancer, emphyzema (sic), mouth cancer. We do it with drinkers- liver cancer, comes to mind. We should do it with these diseases too. These diseases rob young women (primarily) of many, many things in life. I don't think we do enough to educate them on the horrific consequences of the disease.
for the record..
TS did not starve to death.
After listening to a Dr. on a talk show yesterday I realized that the media, in their effort to sensationalize the story, made it sound that TS would wither away to nothing.
The human body can live without FOOD for a long while-what is needed is WATER to keep a person alive.
She passed from dehydration-not the starvation that everyone
has reported and commented on.
Getting caught up in the passion of the topic made me forget my basic biology/physiology lessons. I guess i can use that as an excuse-the media????
I guess the facts don't matter anymore.
morons.
:(
the ny times editorial has it true on. rest in peace theresa. amen