Mom is refusing to belive me about raw.

LOL whatever floats your boat dude, have fun with the chip on your shoulder. Nobody said all dogs have to be fed raw not to have health problems. Yes corn and by products aren't great ingredients, but that's rather moot. Case in FACT as witnessed in my own dogs, SOME dogs with health problems can benefit from eating a raw diet, as far as their health goes. Nobody said it was a cure all to every health problem out there, and nobody said that dogs can't be healthy on kibble. Not one person said that. Enjoy your vastly superior knowledge safe and secure in the fact that your dogs are just fine, and nobody said otherwise. Have a nice day.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vela

I agree, raw has done wonders for my crippled dog, she's like a whole new dog. My "perfectly healthy" dog, who had no apparent health issues, also has more energy, better stools, better haircoat.




PEOPLE make kibble and people are the ones who decided it was the best food for dogs. So saying raw is human's perception of what a dog should eat makes no sense to say, since kibble is also a perception of what humans think a dog should eat. I don't care if someone feeds raw or not, but don't bash it just because you choose not to feed it. Nothing makes you right more than anyone else. PERSONALLY my dogs do much better on raw and the health problems they DID have, while being fed a high quality dog food, Chicken Soup and Canidae, have virtualy disappeared. If you don't want to feed it fine then don't, but that doesn't make it wrong to do and many many many dogs get nothing but great benefits from it. You can try to dispute my dog's health to me all day, but I'm the one who lives with them, so I see for myself and your "refutations" about raw feeding mean nothing to me.

---

Quote:

---

In actuality, KIBBLE is what is perceived by humans to be dog food, if you were to put both down, most dogs would choose the meat, at least once they realized they could eat it.

---

One could also put down a half rotting dead Possum next to their evil commercial dog food, and the chances are they would dive into the Possum without hesitation. In fact they would probably even forsake the raw chicken for something smelly. After all wolves scavenge for carion, the argument goes that centuries of wolves makes it ok for our dogs. I'm not sure if carion would be all that healthy for dogs, but at least by your logic it would be- after all it's the smell and taste that matters. Dogs will always eat what instinctly they know is best for them?

Quote:

---

I don't care if someone feeds raw or not, but don't bash it just because you choose not to feed it.

---

Any time someone says that raw is superior to commercial dog food, then that is a bash towards those of us who choose commercial. And as I just pointed out in another post one is even labeled as crazy, and for feeding bad dog food. But of course commercial dog food owners deserve such bashing - don't they? It's just terrible what we feed our dogs.

Quote:

---

Nothing makes you right more than anyone else.

---

Outside of knowledge- nothing.

Your dog(s) are having less health problems on raw since they got away from their food allergy. Mine have never had health problems on commercial dog food. So goes the testimonials.

It's one thing to post the myriads of "what did I feed my dog today". It's another to present misconceptions as fact.

My dogs never had a food allergy, my dog has crippling arthritis, which has nothing to do with a food allergy. She no longer needs medication or pain releivers for her arthritis and can run and jump and play, this is from changing her diet. So please don't proceed to tell me my dogs are doing better because they had a food allergy, because they didn't. I certainly never told you not to feed kibble and for ME raw is best. I don't give a rats behind what you feed your dogs, but it doesn't mean it's the best thing for them and it doesn't mean it's the worst thing for them, and I never said anything about it. You bash raw because you don't agree with it, well your way doesn't make you right just because you beleive it to be true. MY dogs do better on raw, and has nothing to do with a food allergy whatsoever. I never told you to feed your dogs raw, ever, or even that you should. I have ALWAYS said people should feed what they feel is best and what they can afford as long as they feel good about it, I personally beleive raw is better, but I'm not trying to make you feed it to your dogs, feed whatever you want, but stop bashing raw just because you don't do it or like it. Yes I do beleive raw is better, but I'm as entitled to think that if I like. That is not a bash to you because you don't feed it, but take it how you want. That's your chip on your own shoulder, not mine. I am not trying to make up your mind for you, but there is no need for you to put down those who do feed it and prefer it as better food for their dogs. Just because your dogs get excited about eating kibble doesn't mean they WOULDNT get just as excited about eating raw, they just don't know that it eixsts as food because it's not provided. Wheter a dog chows down their food or not is no indication of it being healthy or not for them. Most dogs eats whatever they are given, raw or kibble, and most get equally exicted about it, so if you are basing your dog's happiness at being fed on whether or not it's the best food, that's rather unrealistic. You seem to have this huge ego thing about your "knowledge" but OMG you don't know everything! Surprise!

I don't think people who talk about raw food are taking over posts as was eluded too, earlier in this thread.
It's just that there is so much to raw feeding.
A kibble diet is simple. Poor 2 cups of kibble in a bowl. The dog eats it.
But with raw it's completely different. There's lots and lots of info. to learn. How to buy it. how to cut it up. Portions. Proportions. Sources, vitamins and mineral content, etc. We just want to do it right and as healthily as possible. We are here to educate and inform each other what we've learned and what is working for our dogs.
We can do that w/out begrudging kibble feeders. Honestly there is no time for that. What we should all begrudge are the folks that starve their dogs.

Quote:

---

My dogs never had a food allergy, my dog has crippling arthritis, which has nothing to do with a food allergy. She no longer needs medication or pain releivers for her arthritis and can run and jump and play, this is from changing her diet

---

yup same deal with Shadow, the vet called in premature aging, at 4 years old she had arthritus so bad she was unable to stand, she looked like a 13 year old dog rather then a 4 year old, all the vets said she would not live to see 5 and because she was already suffering so much we should put her down. we switched to raw because of Happy who had an allergy to grain(note the past tense, since the switch her grain allergy is gone, grains are no problem to her now) the switch took longer to benifit Shadow as she had been on kibble for 4 years and she was in such horrable shape, but after several months things started to clear up, her teeth got better, her arthritus vannished, and her intenstnial problems caused by her spay vannished never to return. she was on raw for 4 years, when we had to rehome her, by then all her problems were gone, she has been back on kibble for 2 years now and the effects of the raw have lasted, at 10 years old she continues to show no signs of the arthrtius that once crippled her. Raw is not a cure all however. when researched and fed properly it can be the best thing you can feed, but it not researched and fed right it can cause more harm then good .

dragondawg most of us raw feeders have fed both raw and several kinds of kibbles, you have fed only kibble and bash something you have never tried. when raw feeders complain about problems from kibble its from EXPERIENCE. you are bashing raw based on your own theorys.

I think you missed my point completely, Dragondawg. We've disagreed before... not because of what you feed your dogs - they sound very healthy, and that is AWESOME - but with the "tone" that you use in your posts. Talk about belittling.

My quote about grocery store kibble had nothing to do with kibble, and everything to do with educated dog owners. The fact is, I've seen you reply to many threads about people who feed lower quality brands who are unhappy with it and feel their dogs could do better, and your replies many times have simply been advocating the grocery store brand and telling them to stick to it. Yes, we are doing this for the love/health of our dogs, and they should eat what works for them. But, to discourage people from looking beyond the mega-massive "grocery store" kibbles, to me is what's crazy. People should know what is out there & make an educated choice on what is going into their dogs, beyond Iams and Beneful and the convincing commercials, as the vast majority of dog owners DON'T! If [insert brand here] kibble works for your dog and you are totally satisfied, that's great. But I know that I, as a young person who has learned a lot since getting Gonzo when I was 13 & fed him Nutro and similar brands, did not even know how healthy he could be with a better diet. We should all strive to improve our lives and the lives of our pets as much as we can, don't we agree on that? Why does it threaten you when people want to improve the diet & therefore the health of their dog?

Ucka. What Vela said, I'm getting too involved in this, when I know absolutely nothing I say will change anything.

GreyhoundGirl wrote: Nutro is good? Is it better than Purina 1? I have seen it in Wal-Mart, Which is handy. I would have to go out of the way for Canidae>>>>>>>>>>>>

My experience with these 3 foods:

PURINA ONE:
Purina one I read is one of the good dog foods carried in the Grocery
store. My X husband has been feeding this to his dog for several years
and his dog does very well on it.

Nutro:
I fed Nutro Natural Lamb and Rice to Sheba for 5 years.
Her skin and coat were beautiful with this food. I would have
no qualms feeding this kibble.

Canidae: I have used this food for almost 7 years now for Sheba and
Rocky.
Rocky has a bad stomach and he has done very well on this food
compared to others. Both dogs have never got tired of the taste and this is a good human grade food at a reasonable price.
* I also add a little human food such as meat, poultry, yogurt, and cottage cheese to their kibble.

My opinion, if your dog is healthy and happy stick with the food you are using.
(Some grocery dog foods are very low in quality and I personally would
stay away from these foods)
Check out the first few ingredients of the food, this will give you
an idea how to compare the different foods.)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by bckrazy

I think you missed my point completely, Dragondawg. We've disagreed before... not because of what you feed your dogs - they sound very healthy, and that is AWESOME - but with the "tone" that you use in your posts. Talk about belittling.

---

I completely agree. This quote says it all -- "Outside of knowledge - nothing." Honestly I'm scared to post in the dog health section because of the amount of times I've felt like my advice has been belittled, and now I have to worry about it in dog general. I'm tired of the arrogance.

The only food I'm against are low-quality kibbles. If you want to feed a high quality kibble, go ahead. If that's what works for you, great. I'm ecstatic to see so many people on PT interested interested in higher quality kibbles and raw. But I'm against the whole idea of lower quality dog foods -- I think it's wrong. I think that even if the dog appears to be doing well on it, things are going on insid ethat you can't see. My GSD died of cancer on a low quality dog food. Her sisters are still alive at 12 years of age with nothing but some arthritis. Everyone thought she was healthy --- sure, she had a doggy smell, she was overweight and had dandruff, and she chewed her one leg to pieces. But nobody made the tie to diet. Because that is what is normal these days. Dogs smell, dogs are greasy, dogs chew themselves, and when a dog is altered it gets fat. It's never the food, oh no.
Just because I feed raw and recommend raw does NOT mean that I'm against all kibbles and will belittle someone for feeding kibble. Even if they feed a low quality kibble I will not make any snide remarks or pound them with a bunch of textbook studies. If they are looking for something better, I will tell them what I believe is wrong with the food they are feeding, and what they should avoid in the future. As soon as someone sees me telling someone that raw is good and kibble is bad and all kibble owners should basically rot, call me on it. I tried dozens of kibbles, none of them worked for MY dog, and I don't want to feed kibble, that is ME, do what works for you. Raw is not for everyone. I've seen needless deaths and illnesses on raw because the owner didn't research properly --- I've also seen it on kibble.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by KYS

GreyhoundGirl wrote: Nutro is good? Is it better than Purina 1? I have seen it in Wal-Mart, Which is handy. I would have to go out of the way for Canidae>>>>>>>>>>>>

My experience with these 3 foods:

PURINA ONE:
Purina one I read is one of the good dog foods carried in the Grocery
store. My X husband has been feeding this to his dog for several years
and his dog does very well on it.

Nutro:
I fed Nutro Natural Lamb and Rice to Sheba for 5 years.
Her skin and coat were beautiful with this food. I would have
no qualms feeding this kibble.

Canidae: I have used this food for almost 7 years now for Sheba and
Rocky.
Rocky has a bad stomach and he has done very well on this food
compared to others. Both dogs have never got tired of the taste and this is a good human grade food at a reasonable price.
* I also add a little human food such as meat, poultry, yogurt, and cottage cheese to their kibble.

My opinion, if your dog is healthy and happy stick with the food you are using.
(Some grocery dog foods are very low in quality and I personally would
stay away from these foods)
Check out the first few ingredients of the food, this will give you
an idea how to compare the different foods.)

---

Thanks, do you have any experience with Iams?

I am quite sure I don't have the time to learn How to buy it. how to cut it up. Portions. Proportions. Sources, vitamins and mineral content, etc. I wouldn't have time to do that regularly :o . ( the 2 cups of kibble sounds much easier. )

I am quite sure I have come to what I think would be a wise move for my lifestyle right now. I am thinking Nutro with one egg a week ( Sun. evenings ;) ). Would that be good? Or does Nutro not need the egg? ( And I should feed the egg with the shell, right? )

Thanks again :)

GreyhoundGirl,
I never fed Iams kibble so I can not comment on their food.
All I can suggest is read the first few main ingredients and compare.

(I cook plain eggs for myself once or twice a week (with-out fat)
and share a little with each dogs I give them mostly the cooked whites
from my dish, no egg shells. : )

I would think a good grade kibble alone is fine, but as mentioned, I like to
add human food to their dinner.
I also add a little meat juice or warm water to their kibble.

This is just what I do for my dogs. :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GreyhoundGirl

I am quite sure I have come to what I think would be a wise move for my lifestyle right now. I am thinking Nutro with one egg a week ( Sun. evenings ;) ). Would that be good? Or does Nutro not need the egg? ( And I should feed the egg with the shell, right? )

Thanks again :)

---

Kodie and Lucy get one raw egg each a week. Kodie gets the shell because he likes it, Lucy doesnt like the shell.Nutro is a great choice in food,Kodie had bad food allergies and they cleared up so fast when we switched to Nutro Natural choice.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Roxyluvsme13

For one, Iams is not a high quality dog food. Have you seen the crap in it?

---

Have you seen the crap that results from eating it? One of my main reasons to switch Niño's food.

Ever since I started feeding Nutro to my pets, their health, skin, and coats have improved a great deal. I am so glad I found PT, because I never knew how to read pet food labels, I just figured that a more expensive food would be better. :o I was feeding Bil-Jac - which is more expensive and not as good in quality compared to Nutro.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JenBKR

Ever since I started feeding Nutro to my pets, their health, skin, and coats have improved a great deal. I am so glad I found PT, because I never knew how to read pet food labels, I just figured that a more expensive food would be better. :o I was feeding Bil-Jac - which is more expensive and not as good in quality compared to Nutro.

---

That's what my mom thinks. Iams is the most $$$ one in the grocery store.

Jen usually does get some people food with her meal ( things like blood from steak ), but I think one raw egg a week would be good with her Nutro.

My mom says I just have to finish the bag of Iams and the bag of purina ONE ( both about half gone ) than I can choose whatever food I want ( as long as it doesn't cost an arm-and-a-leg :p )

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Suki Wingy

Have you seen the crap that results from eating it? One of my main reasons to switch Niño's food.

---

I wouldn't know what good resuts would look like. :o Jen has only ever been fed grocery store brands. :o I'm hoping on seeing some improvement once we make the Nutro switch.