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I am bowing out of this discussion. Several people offered educated opinions which I really appreciate, but a few people have really sunk to the lowest levels. This could have been a mature conversation, but I think the chance of that is ruined now. I am disgusted about it all as well.
Agreed, I didn't get too involved in the first place, but, I read all the posts. I'm also keeping most of what I want to say, completely to myself. ;)Quote:
Originally posted by aly
I am bowing out of this discussion. Several people offered educated opinions which I really appreciate, but a few people have really sunk to the lowest levels. This could have been a mature conversation, but I think the chance of that is ruined now. I am disgusted about it all as well.
DittoQuote:
Originally posted by guster girl
Agreed, I didn't get too involved in the first place, but, I read all the posts. I'm also keeping most of what I want to say, completely to myself. ;)
I am not sure wht I am responding, and I really have nothing meaningful to say, but here it goes anyway.
1. Yes, I have been to greyhounds races. I was in junior high and went while in Florida with my friend's family. This was about 15 or 16 years ago. I knew nothing of rescue groups, purebreds vs. mutts, puppy mills, or even how to train a dog. Yes, I had fun. I loved dogs and loved to see them run. That was as much as I knew at 12.
2. I know from therapy dog training that greyhounds are the only dogs NOT required to sit on command during the CGC/TDI test. I was told this is because retired racers are often never taught ti sit...they spend their lives laying or standing. I don't know know if this truely is the reason, but I have known 2 rescued greyhounds, recently off the track, that didn't know how to sit.
3. In any dogs sport, be it showing, racing, agility, flyball, whatever, you will have good owners and bad owners, good kennels and bad kennels. I hope and I want to believe that through education, things are getting better for racing animals. I don't think we can hope to stop it, only make it as humane for the animals as possible.
Personally, I can not see the aspect of getting a dog, working with it, and then giving it up. But that is me and my opinion. For the same reason, I could never breed a dog, or even train a dog to be a service dog, or even foster a dog. The bottom line reasoning for me is the same...when I put the time and effort into a dog, I want to be there for its whole life. I have bonded with that animal, and I don't want to give it up. In some aspects, that is me being selfish. In some cases, such as fostering, I am glad there are people who can do it. Don't know where we would be if there wasn't. But is it wrong to want every dog to a have a loving, stable forever home? Unrealistic, maybe? but wrong?
Pitties' needless, hurtful comments have been deleted. He is now banned.
Thanks Karen:DQuote:
Originally posted by Karen
Pitties' needless, hurtful comments have been deleted. He is now banned.
Greys please don't twist my words around. I'm doing my best not to twist yours but instead respond with my own opinions.
No where did I say that no one should breed greyhounds, I stated that I loved the breed very much. I just don't agree with breeding to race (for human entertainment such as gambling)
I have no problem with hunting dogs, sled dogs, and police dogs. Those dogs live with their owners and work along side them. We have a few sleders on this board, when a dog retires it l lives out it's entire life with them. Yes I realize not all sleders are like this, and I don't approve and have problems with sleders that treat their dogs like property.
Good breeders will sell their pups to aproved homes then if the home doesn't work out they will take back the puppy because they realize that if they breed a dog it's a lifetime commitment. Please don't twist those words around either. I'm not saying all breeders, which is why I only believe in supporting good breeders. Part of that means that they are willing to make a lifetime commitment to the dog and if it doesn't get sold then it lives it's life with them.
I'n not saying that every single person who races a greyhound is horrible. I just think the business as a whole is bad and don't support it.
Quote:
Originally posted by Karen
Pitties' needless, hurtful comments have been deleted. He is now banned.
Woo hoo thank you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Thank you so much Karen :)Quote:
Originally posted by Karen
Pitties' needless, hurtful comments have been deleted. He is now banned.
I honestly think that even though there has been some intense conflict on all of this, I love that some of the greyhound people are coming over and introducing themselves and showing their babies :)
For all those new members that joined us via greytalk please know that there are no hard feelings and we are not an argumentative board. We are just a group of passionate animal lovers. I hope you all stick around and enjoy other parts of the board. We all love pictures here and it would be wonderful to see some more pictures of your beautiful greyhounds.
Don't forget to vote in their poll!
http://www.greytalk.com/~forums/inde...howtopic=72292
I think that poll was more intended to find out the makeup of the board's regular members, but I could be wrong. The results are interesting though :)
Greytalk is one message board that is heavily pro-racing. Most other are not, which is understandable.
There are many who would dispute that.Quote:
Originally posted by 7up
Greytalk is one message board that is heavily pro-racing. Most other are not, which is understandable.
As PT is a forum of very passionate animal lovers, GT is a bunch of very passionate greyhound adopters/owners/lovers. Sometimes to the point of becoming easily offended. Particularly when some are adopters turned adoption workers turned racer owners.
:eek: I would have to say that at one time GT used to be fairly heavily anti-racing (the individual members, NOT the board itself). Though the mods do allow a civil discussion of the racing issue, they really do a good job of trying to keep the board neutral overall.Quote:
Originally posted by 7up
Greytalk is one message board that is heavily pro-racing. Most other are not, which is understandable.
Several members have joined that are in "the industry" Everything from race dog owners, to people running adoption groups at race tracks, to people who own greyhound farms/breed racing puppies....basically all aspects. They have done a great job dispelling many of the myths, keeping us informed to what the racing industry is doing to improve greyhound racing and adoption - AND talking about what work still needs to be done to reach 100% adoption.
Personally, I think everyone is entitled to their opinion on the issue - and I can respect an opinion based on good, solid information.
I think you will find that greyhound owners are passionate as well - especially about our beloved breed!.I'm looking forward to spending some time on this board. If its pictures you want...well, I have PLENTY of those :) :)Quote:
Originally posted by Uabassoon
For all those new members that joined us via greytalk please know that there are no hard feelings and we are not an argumentative board. We are just a group of passionate animal lovers. I hope you all stick around and enjoy other parts of the board. We all love pictures here and it would be wonderful to see some more pictures of your beautiful greyhounds.
Here's one of my faves...my first chip (second greyhound) Hanna
http://www.greyhoundfreaks.com/hanna/hanna-angel.jpg
I realize this is my third straight post...but just thought I'd address this real quick....
Our boy Prajna went through a cell dog program. He sits very well - and on command. I just went through CGC with Harmony and taught her to sit. Our old gals Star and Annie both sit on their own (we adopted them both as seniors so I don't know if they were taught to sit or not by previous owners). All this to say that greyhounds can and do sit. It tends to not be their favorite position (too hard to sleep while sitting...lol)Quote:
2. I know from therapy dog training that greyhounds are the only dogs NOT required to sit on command during the CGC/TDI test. I was told this is because retired racers are often never taught ti sit...they spend their lives laying or standing. I don't know know if this truely is the reason, but I have known 2 rescued greyhounds, recently off the track, that didn't know how to sit.
I think most owners just don't know how to train the gh to sit or don't want to take the time. And, honestly, its not that important in their day to day lives.
OK, my dogs are getting jealous...
So... pics: my first race pups, now 4 months old. These pics were when they wre a day old.
http://www.rmga.org/jan/images/RaceLi1.jpg
http://www.rmga.org/jan/images/RaceLi2.jpg
And this is what happends when you have multiple adopted greyhounds:
http://www.rmga.org/jan/images/fullcouch1.jpg
http://www.rmga.org/jan/images/housefull1.jpg
Jan those pictures are just way to cute!!!
Pictures of the couch is an all to familar scene at our home also :)
As far as greys sitting just imagine telling a muscle bound person to put his arms down, straight to there sides. They just can't there lats are just to big to allow.
When a greyhound sits there butts don't touch the floor, for the most part. So they are supporting all there weight with there legs. Kinda like if you squat half way down. Not to comfy :)
Beautiful pictures. I have never seen a greyhound puppy - their faces look so different! I think my Sadie is half whippet and she was often the fastest sleekest dog in the dog park until a full bred greyhound or whippet showed up.
Cincy's Mom I'm too selfish too to be a temporary mom to a dog. I don't have an opinion on racing. My hope is that all animal abuse ends or is at least heavily punished and looked down on by society - whether it be related to racing, fighting, breeding, or just owning.
May I come over? :D I see a spot right down there on the floor that would be perfect for me!!! :D :D :DQuote:
posted by micki76:May I come over? :D I see a spot right down there on the floor that would be perfect for me!!! :>>>>>>>>
Where? What spot? lol
Good evening ... :)
Another Greyhound lover from Greytalk ... hope you don't mind me stopping over! I've been reading this thread since yesterday and I have not posted on the thread in Greytalk. I think someone on here said that the truth is usually in the middle ... and that's pretty much where I've found it to be regarding Greyhounds.
I've never been to a race ... don't know that I'd go if asked, but I just may ... just to see the Greys run - something they absolutely love to do.
There's good and bad in everything in life ... I'm sure that Greyhound breeding/training/racing is no exception. I've met some wonderful people being involved with Greyhound adoption - both pro-racing AND anti-racing and each feels passionately about their beliefs.
The one thing I feel passionate about is the Greyhounds. I volunteer, I make GUR's, I foster - I'll do whatever needs to be done to find these wonderful animals good homes. I just flunked Fostering 101 for the first time ... :D
It's hard for discussions like this not to get nasty at times ... but please, please ... try to see the other's viewpoints and act respectfully. Everyone has their own opinion and it isn't always necessarily the one you believe in.
And last but not least ... here's a pic of my 3 girls ... Cash (our 6-year old red brindle girl), Flecka (our recently adopted 2-year old Hurricane Ivan foster) and our 4-year old daughter.
Lovemygreys7, RMGAJAN and MomofCash Welcome to Pet Talk! And thanks for posting some pictures, all of the pictures I saw were wonderful! I hope you all stay and continue to post pictures long after this thread has died.
Gosh... to the folks from GT that are coming over to share pics, all your greys are beautiful. But I must say you are making my greyhound fever burn more intensely than ever before :D. I sure hope some of you decide to stick around here and continue to share your beautiful babies with us :)
OMG! I love all of your greyhounds! I've always loved the breed and it's great to see pictures of them! Welcome to PT everyone from GreyTalk:D I hope you decide to stick around:D
Since you all are posting pictures of your greys I want to post a picture of my all time favorite grey named Abigail. She is one of my regulars and I sit for her often. Her owners recently adopted another grey (but I can't remember his name :( ) I've never sat for him because he still can't be trusted in the house so they decided for now it's best to kennel him when they go out of town. Abigail is a wonderful dog, but I will admit she is the worst bed hog ever!
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/...8/fbe0d2af.jpg
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/...b/fbe0d2b3.jpg
Sorry the quality is bad. I haven't taken any pics of them since i got my new camera.
Thank ya'll for the welcome .... it's much appreciated. And since ya'll love pictures, thought I'd post another of my girls ... ;)
personally, I have never been to a race, in a stadium.. but I have seen several racing Greyhound kennels and racing facilities in Oregon that appauled me :eek:... I don't even want to get into that, but all of what I have seen of the industry is pretty horrible. A lot like the horse racing industry, in ways. When money and gambling is involved it seems like it's bound to be a bad scene. But, as in everything, I'm sure there are many responsible owners out there -- though, no matter what it doesn't seem all that responsible to me, to dump your dog off at a rescue after he/she has faithfully trained and raced for you for years.
I have been to many lure coursing events, I love them!! hounds are amazing dogs, and its great to see them out doing what they're bred to do. greyhounds are wonderful dogs, there is no arguing that, I would love to adopt one someday.
exactly! I know that everyone on these boards, everyone, wants to put an end to all neglectful kennels, puppy mills, and animal abusers. period. None of us want anything to do with an industry which, in any way, condones the abuse of animals. Personally, I am so angry when I see any dog that is put through a lot of trauma and sometimes branded as unadoptable just because their idiot owners did not take the time to socialize them at an early age... I don't care if the owner is a nieghbor of mine, a greyhound kennel owner, or a puppy mill owner.Quote:
It can and does happen to every breed out there. sad
Firstly I want to welcome all of you from GT. I hope you stick around and enjoy PT.
I also want to give a link. That is from a greyhound rescue group here in florida. Here is a quote from it:
You need to understand that to most people here at pet talk this is unexceptionable. No pet wether it be a dog or a mouse should be without love and the best possible care. I am not saying that this is the case with every race dog, but there are way too many cases like this.Quote:
A continuing program for Retired Racing Greyhounds.
When I run my Adopt A Greyhound, Everyone's a Winner, television show, everyone asks me how do I go about doing a Rescue. It's simple ... the phone rings ... there's an emergency somewhere with a bunch of greyhounds ... and we're on our way! The first thing that has to be arranged is a place for the animals to stay. No small feat when you've got 40-100 starving greyhounds that need to be medically treated, fed, sheltered and adopted.
400 in 2 weeks. You can see that there is a problem when that many dogs are going to a rescue in a 2 week time. I know that not every 2 week period of time that passes another 400 greyhounds are put into rescue groups, but for that to even happen once is disgusting.Quote:
Let me tell you, rescuing 400 greyhounds in a two week period is a monumental task and without the Lord's help, it just couldn't be done.
Quote:
Originally posted by KYS
posted by micki76:May I come over? :D I see a spot right down there on the floor that would be perfect for me!!! :>>>>>>>>
Where? What spot? lol
:p :D Believe me, I can find a spot!! In a room full of puppers, I can always find room!
Obviously Cali has never seen a documentary on Greyhounds.
Every year, when seasonal tracks close there is a great influx of hounds into adoption. Likewise when the NGA auction is held. Non-winning dogs are moved off the track and into waiting adoption groups. Groups plan for these time times and work with the racing industry to matriculate these dogs through the adoption process.Quote:
400 in 2 weeks. You can see that there is a problem when that many dogs are going to a rescue in a 2 week time. I know that not every 2 week period of time that passes another 400 greyhounds are put into rescue groups, but for that to even happen once is disgusting.
Very few dogs that adopted out are true rescues. These are hounds that have been release by their racing owner into adoption programs. Those owners could keep the dogs or put them down - but they don't. Some owners do place their own dogs - but a vast majority recognize that greyhound adoption groups are GOOD at what we do - so they give the dogs to us to place. Adoption groups also rely on the support of racing owners and kennel owners for donations to keep the doors open.
As for the claim of "rescuing" 400 hounds in two weeks. I don't know ANY group that could responsibly process this many dogs. Where is their kennel facility? Do they have 400 foster homes? Who pays the vet bills???? I'm not saying its not true - just that I'm not familiar with this group or what work they've done in the past. I do know that when the hurricanes went through FL this year and many racing kennels were damaged, adoption groups across the country stepped up to take in dogs. Sure groups weren't expecting this - but neither were the tracks or kennel owners. We all worked together to get the job done.
Sure there are some jerkies in the industry...there are some jerkies in adoption too! I have seen HORRIBLE cases of abuse - not from tracks though....by people who have adopted the greyhounds. I have a 14 year old that is a perfect example of adoptive owner abuse (and a 6 year old and a 13 year old). So just keep in perspective that there is good and bad in every industry. Racing, adoption and adopters (and there are bad cops, bad teachers, bad doctors.........) We don't get rid of doctors because there are cases of malpractice.
30 years ago we didn't recycle pepsi cans. Now we do. 30 years ago virtually all racers were euthanized. Now, less than 2000 per year are. Is that still too many? Absolutely. Do people in the industry agree with that? Absolutely. But the difference now, is that you have racing working with adoption to reach 100% adoption - and that includes more responsible breeding so there are fewer pups born every year.
lovemygreys, It is encouraging to see the changes that are going on and I hope they continue. It would not surprise me if some organizations dramatize what is really going on, after all several animal rescue groups do that, Peta is a prime example. Of course, I still think there is a ways to go, and like you and others stated, it happens with all dogs, but since racing is such a big industry, I think it is more common than with some. I just think the truth lies in the middle between the two extremes, though I do not claim to be perfectly educated. Pretty much most of what I have to go by is what one side says versus the other side. Often in those situations, it's a little of both.
Again, welcome to Pet Talk though, I know I appreciate all the viewpoints here :)
Thank you! Greyhound adoption still has much work to do - but one day we will get there. As I've said before, people are entitled to their opinions on racing - one of my goals is to help educate people on the whole picture of racing and adoption so that they can make an informed opinion.Quote:
Originally posted by K9soul
lovemygreys, It is encouraging to see the changes that are going on and I hope they continue. It would not surprise me if some organizations dramatize what is really going on, after all several animal rescue groups do that, Peta is a prime example. Of course, I still think there is a ways to go, and like you and others stated, it happens with all dogs, but since racing is such a big industry, I think it is more common than with some. I just think the truth lies in the middle between the two extremes, though I do not claim to be perfectly educated. Pretty much most of what I have to go by is what one side says versus the other side. Often in those situations, it's a little of both.
Again, welcome to Pet Talk though, I know I appreciate all the viewpoints here :)
Greyhound adoption is fortunate in the sense that we have an "industry" to work with. My heart and respect goes out to the thousands of people who work tirelessly to home and re-home the seemingly never-ending stream of pure and mixed breed animals.
All people who work in adoption - regardless of breed or species - are heros in my eyes!
Cute doggies everyone! :D
I'm completely sick of the way GT has been talking aobut Pet Talk. :mad:
I guess we're all trolls now.:mad: :rolleyes:
I just wanted to share these three beauties that Valerie (dukesdogsmom) and I met at the FL PT meeting a bit back.....
http://img32.photobucket.com/albums/...TMeet04/12.jpg
oh im so happy that were not argueing(spll??) any more.I love seeing pictures of all these beautiful greys,and i love hearing about you stories.:)
I went to Grey Talk's site, and, really didn't see that much trash talking done about Pet Talk. It was only a few comments that I saw, and, they weren't anything to worry about, IMO. Maybe I'm not looking in the right places, though, I only read the thread about dog racing. Was there more? And, the "don't feed the trolls" posts (I think I remember seeing two) were basically ignored, meaning, I didn't notice anyone nodding their heads in agreement. Overall, it's seems like a smart site to me, from what I read. But, anyway, the overall feeling I got was not a bad one, just a few random posts with some stereoypical comments. Anyone who believes lump statments like that without at least doing a little research is a sheep anyway, and, who cares what people in sheep's clothing think? If some random remarks from a couple of posters in Grey Talk brought over some curious Grey Talkers, I say GREAT! I'm loving all the photos of the dogs, and, like that they are posting about the positive aspects of racing. It's nice to finally see another side of the coin. And, again, that's just my opinion, don't bash me for it. :)
I'm a bit disappointed myself. GT'rs are normally very accepting of both greyhound and non-greyhound owners. Everyone is welcome on our board (pro, neutral and anti racing peeps as well as folks who know nothing about greys, but want to learn!) I think a lot of people felt like we were being attacked unfairly so they lashed out. I've felt very welcome on this board!Quote:
I'm completely sick of the way GT has been talking aobut Pet Talk.
I agree. While a healthy debate and exchange of ideas is a good thing - it serves no one when the topic (regardless of what it is) detiorates to namecalling and mean-spiritedness.Quote:
oh im so happy that were not argueing(spll??) any more
Thanks for keeping an open mind. That's all we ask :)Quote:
It's nice to finally see another side of the coin.
I've always had an open mind about the racing industry and the sled dog industries. I've personally seen both sides firsthand of both of those sports. I know there are a lot of people, though, that think if one animal is needlessly harmed for the entertainment of people, the entire sport should be banned. I don't agree with that at all. But, I'm just glad there are more greyhounds on the site, now!